4110 Transmission: John Deere Review  -- John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum and Review 4110 Transmission: John Deere Review -- John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum

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 05-16-2004, 20:50 Post: 86177
aemiller



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 4110 Transmission

Please bear in mind that I am a total newbie when it comes to tractors. I originally was looking at getting the 2210, however, after reading some responses to previous posts, I am thinking about moving up to the 4110. It looks like I can get the 4110 WITHOUT the FEL for about the same price as the 2110 WITH the FEL. I'd just get the FEL for the 4110 in the future when I had enough cash to do so.

Looking at the John Deere website, it lists the transmission on the basic model 4110 as "Collar Shift" and "Availability Limited to Dealer Inventory ". The optional transmission listed is the Hydrostatic Transmission for $1400 more. I'm just curious if anyone has an opinion as to whether it is worth it to pay $1400 for the Hydrostatic Transmission, since I am already on a tight budget? Any info about this will be greatly appreciated.






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 05-16-2004, 22:32 Post: 86181
DRankin



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 4110 Transmission

I have had both.

If all you want to do is use the tractor as a tug boat to pull wagons of manure.... save the money, get the collar shift.

If you expect to use the tractor for other, more complex jobs.... get the HST. You won't look back.






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 05-17-2004, 06:12 Post: 86186
hardwood

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On a tractor that size the hydro will consume too much power and your tractor won't pull much of a drawbar load. If your primary use will be mowing and other light draft work the hydro will be fine. The first compact I demo'd had a hydro, personaly I did'nt like it, so I've bought three Deere 12/12 reversers since, and would'nt even consider a hydro, just too much power loss, and too expensive. These are only my opinions, others have their reasons for liking hydros. Best of luck, Frank.






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 05-17-2004, 06:42 Post: 86187
Ducati996



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 4110 Transmission

I was under the impression that Deeres HST is pretty efficient in its method of power delivery. Surpisingly less HP loss overall. In this case the 4110 w/hst is still 17 HP PTO from a 20 HP motor...pretty much identical to the gear..

If you have loader work in the future, I think you should consider buying the FEL now, as part of the package. I think you can work it into the package for some possible savings (rebates, or discount, or install waived). It tends to be more expensive after you have the machine to get attachments such as an FEL or BH.

I have the gear 4100 (replaced by the 4110) and I love the machine. I would love HST a little bit more, but I'm still happy having the machine - I havent heard a negative yet regarding these machines!

Good luck in your decision-and keep us updated

Duc






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 05-17-2004, 09:02 Post: 86197
DRankin



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 4110 Transmission

I just noticed there is an ad at the top of the active topics page.

Deere is offering zero down and no interest loans. Could be the right time to get what you need all in one bundle.






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 05-17-2004, 09:57 Post: 86199
kwschumm



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There are avowed gearheads who wouldn't own a hydro. There are also gearheads who, after trying an hst wouldn't own anything else. I won't have anything but a stick in my vehicles, but went with an hst in the tractor. It all boils down to personal preference and there are a lot of threads in the archives debating this issue.

There are a few things an hst will do that a geared transmission won't. For one, they have an infinitely variable speed so you can match the speed exactly to the task at hand. With a geared transmission sometimes you might find one speed is too slow and the next is too fast. An hst will also allow you very precise positioning control. I work in and around a lot of trees and often have the need to move only an inch or two at a time without hitting a tree - this is very easy to do with a hydro, but is more difficult and error prone when you have to slip a clutch. Also, when doing a lot of back and forth loader work a hydro is faster than a collar shift type transmission.

Hydros are the biggest seller, so that would be an advantage on resale or trade.

Frank is right that you will lose a few extra hp vs. a geared transmission. So, you have to weigh the pros and cons for yourself.






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 05-17-2004, 10:42 Post: 86202
Murf

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Duc, you are confusing apples & oranges. The losses in the PTO hp. of a HST vs. a Gear TX are NOT relative to the overall loss of hp. that gets to the wheels. PTO hp. is measured with the machine standing still so the only load is the pump doing no work. Even that number is deceiving since the load on the engine doing something like bush-hogging at 5mph is higher with a HST TX than gear, so there is less hp. 'left over' to run the cutter.

Frank & Mark are right, there are significant draw-bar hp. losses with a HST TX. over a gear TX. A number of years ago our dealer brought us an HST demo unit to try out, we were at that point running relays with dump wagons, loaded one way, empty the other. The HST was put head-to-head against 5 GST's of the same model. The outcome was shocking to me, the HST was 20% slower than the GST's.

Best of luck.






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 05-17-2004, 14:36 Post: 86217
cherymax

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I just bought a 4110 hydro less than a week ago. I've also had JD hydro garden tractors as long as I can remember. In my opinion, the "loss" of a few HP is more than outweighed by the convenience and time savings the hydro provides.

If your going to be using the FEL often... hydro is the way to go. The 4110 hydro has no problem pushing the bucket fwd/into piles of gravel. The things like a big ox.

The only negative I can think of regarding the 4110 hydro is the operating noise produced by the 4110's hydro tranny. It's not terrible... just more than I expected.

Regardless... I'd never consider buying a Gear model.






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 05-17-2004, 14:57 Post: 86219
Murf

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We seem to be going in a bit of a circle here.

There are two VERY separate and distinct quantum's which are used as benchmarks to rate a (big or small) tractor's performance.

The first quantum is PTO horsepower, the difference between the outputs of two similar tractors, one gear, one hydrostatic is usually only a couple of horsepower. This is caused by the fact that the ratings are done with the tractor standing idle and it takes less energy (losses) to spin the gears than it does to drive the pump which is always working even if the tractor is standing still.

The second quantum is draw-bar horsepower; this is the measure of the pulling energy created. This is where the real losses in a hydrostatic drive system appear.

The second difference is the one that most people are unaware of when it comes to a CUT. Typically a HST is only 60% efficient. That means, for example, a 35hp CUT will typically lose 14hp just in the transmission. I hardly consider that to be neither "the "loss" of a few HP" nor inconsequential.

Those of you who have had riding mowers will know just how much work can be accomplished with 14hp.

As long as you're willing to suffer that sort of loss for the convenience, no problem. Are they handy, darn tootin', are they more than a gear unit, yes absolutely, are they better, well that's a different kettle of fish.

Best of luck.






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 05-17-2004, 15:26 Post: 86222
Billy

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 4110 Transmission

Murf

"The second difference is the one that most people are unaware of when it comes to a CUT. Typically a HST is only 60% efficient. That means, for example, a 35hp CUT will typically lose 14hp just in the transmission. I hardly consider that to be neither "the "loss" of a few HP" nor inconsequential."

You're a lot smarter than I am but I'll have to disagree with that statement. I don't get my facts from any book or chart but from first hand day-to-day experience with both.

I had a JD 4600 with collar shift for 3 years and now have a JD 4610 with hydro for 2 years. There's not a nickel's worth of HP loss with the hydro.






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