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 | DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ 
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2007-10-31 147585
I bought some supposedly premium firewood from MulchExpressUSA (aka MulchXpressUSA). Their delivery was prompt but that ends the good part. I am convinced that what they do is drop refuse containers off at Tree Service Companies, then the tree companies dump all their wood waste in the dumpster, then MulchExpressUSA sells it to dummies like me as firewood.
I sent them an email with the problems I have with their firewood service:
1) Short Quantity : after stacking I measure 2.16 cords of stacked low grade firewood not the 4 cords I ordered. I have many yards of waste but that does not count as firewood.
2) Grade/Quality: the wood is not Premium Firewood as advertised (tulip, birch even Pine as well as near rotten material)
"Quality Firewood Available While Mulch Express USA is best known for our quality mulch products, we are increasingly becoming well known for our firewood as well.Our firewood consists of a mix of hardwoods that are indigenous to the tri state areas. Primarily, species such as Oak, Hickory, Beech, and Cherry will make up a bulk of our firewood "
3)Excessive Waste Material -- I have many yards of debris to remove. I split 5 cords of wood last year myself so I have an idea of reasonable waste material, the amount of waste in the load I recieved from you is enormous by any standard. You certainly don't want to show my YouTube video to prospective customers on your website do you? I could tell the driver was embarrassed there was "so much debris" after he dropped the load, he offered "I don't know why they do that (have all that
debris)".
Hopefully they will make an adjustment on this. If you want to laugh ( or be depressed in my case :())take a look at the video of the debris that they called firewood in the link to YouTube below.
Link: MulchXpressUSA Firewood Review
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 | Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2007-10-31 147590
Dennis, I like your approach to it if nothing else.
BTW, I even noticed that the dog walked away from the pile at the end, if a Lab can't even find a stick to chew in that mess I don't think there's much firewood, that's for sure. ;)
Keep us posted on what they do about it.
Best of luck. ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-10-31 147591
Thanks Murf!
I should have known better, I usually want to physically see the wood before I buy, but if you look at their web site they are clear in a couple of the right areas:
1) Wood-- Premium hardwoods, even specifying the type of wood
2) Cord Measurement -- They clearly state the difference between a face cord and a real cord 4x4x8 and indicate the cords they sell are the latter.
Yeah I know can't believe what you read on the web.
I had the kids work on stacking the wood last Sunday. It was fun for them because you actually were "playing hide and seek" to find the firewood in the refuse pile they dumped. We were thinking man we are good, we stacked that 4 cords in no time! Until I measured the pile and realized that besides the poor quality they only delivered half the wood I ordered.
They said they would get back to me today with what sort of adjustment they can make. We'll see!
Dennis
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Link: MulchExpressUSA.com Firewood Review Video
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 | kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2007-10-31 147592
What a rip. If you were nearby I'd give you a dozen cords worth of Noble fir. It is not great firewood but it's a lot better than that mess. ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-10-31 147593
Thanks Ken,
Could you UPS me a sample first ;) Just kidding!
But how is fir for stove use? Doesn't the sap cause too much creosote?
Dennis ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2007-10-31 147595
Dennis, I don't know about Kens fir, but I burn a BIG pile of fir every year, mostly hemlock and pine slabs from our own saw operation, it burns quite well but the pine does snap and pop a lot due to the sap content, but clean if it's well seasoned, no creosote at all.
A modern stove doesn't burn wood, it burns the gas coming off the wood as it gets heated by the fire, the sap is the same, it gives off a very flammable gas which will quite readily burn clean given enough heat and oxygen.
As for the quantity etc., of what you had delivered, you might want to talk to the consumer affairs branch of your state commerce department, in most jurisdictions the weights & measures branch people take short changing customers quite seriously.
Best of luck. ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-10-31 147596
That is a good point!
This is the picture they have of what a typical delivery of wood looks like hmmmmm does not look familiar.
They also went to great pains to explain the cord measures as well as the higher BTU values of the better hardwoods they said they were selling as "Premium Wood"
(10/9/2010 MulchXpressUSA has removed the image but suffice it to say the picture was one of beautifully stack pristine oak, .....haha ha!)
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Link: MulchExpressUSA Cord Measurement
Picture Link
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 | kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2007-10-31 147599
Dennis in South Carolina weigths and measurement fall under The State Dept of Agriculture. kt
Have a web tail that I may share in the next few days. Think mine is turning out well. But much more money. kt ....
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 | nosteiner4me
Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 113 ohio 
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2007-10-31 147600
Dennis.....Now thats a pile of mulch crap not firewood. Good luck with that one. Looks like bunch of kindling at best. ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2007-10-31 147601
Dennis, is it possible the driver picked up a load that was to be dumped and did? that was to be funny.
Could be that load was meant to be dumped and not sold. Could you have refused the load? How did you pay them? If by credit card get complaint filed quickly. kt ....
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| nosteiner4me
Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 113 ohio
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2007-10-31 147603
Dennis...I just looked at your link for their cord measurement....Just take a look at the picture of the full chord of wood. Looks like a couple of large logs are missing to me. I Guess Mulchexpress...by the name itself...says it all. ....
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| kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2007-10-31 147606
I haven't used much fir in the fireplace because of the creosote issue. What I have used burns fast and smokes and pops quite a bit. With the woodstove I'd think the burning of gases will keep the creosote and smoke way down so I'm planning on using it up.
You can't argue with mostly free heat :) ....
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 | candoarms
Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1932 North Dakota 
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2007-10-31 147627
Dennis CTB,
I went to their website and looked at the picture at the top of the page; 1/2 of which is firewood, the other 1/2 being mulch.
Your driveway looks as if it could have been a poster child for that photo.
I do hope they straighten this mess out for you. The least they could do is provide you with four cords of REAL firewood.
If it were me, I'd be there picking up the mess I left you, as well. And the person who loaded that truck......well, he'd be looking for a new job.
Let us know how this turns out. Thanks for sharing the video with us. Incredible.
Joel ....
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 | bloggins
Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 104 Kingston, Ontario
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2007-10-31 147628
It looks like run-off from Mount St.Helens. That's outragious for anyone to be in the firewood business selling that crap. Are these guys for real? You now have a HazMat pile, not split seasoned firewood. I'm with KT, I think they dumped off the wrong shipment...some mill that wanted waste wood probably was eqaully baffled by their delivery of nicely seasoned oak for a bulk burn in a mill furnace. ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-11-01 147639
Well if you google for "MulchExpressUSA Review" this thread shows up as NUMBER One!
I am going to build a page dedicated to this so that it comes up everywhere as number one.
I am on a mission, it is important to do this so that other people are protected from the same unfortunate outcome.
Should this actually be a misstake then I will just as actively clear up all the postings so a true picture is painted.
I have more pictures that I will be posting later today.
Dennis ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-11-01 147641
Ok here is the beginning of the the page. I am creating this just to improve its visibility.
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Link: MulchExpressUSA Review - Firewood
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 | AnnBrush
Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 463 Troy OH
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2007-11-01 147644
Dennis
That is grounds for a lawsuit. I would withhold payment or reverse the payment if possible on the basis that no delivery was made. Second I would charge them for removal of the trash they dumped on your property. Unbelievable! ....
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 | harvey
Join Date: Sep 2000 Posts: 1550 Moravia, NY
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2007-11-01 147652
I use the "SPLITTER" which in real knarley knotty wood tends to cut thru things also ripping and shreading the worst of the knarley. Did about 7-8 face cord last Sunday afternoon and all my waste would fit into a wheel barrow. (but that still goes into bags and into the outdoor wood furnace at Boys house).
I am glad you are on a mission. I'm just glad it wasn't me that took a leak in your bowl of Wheaties... :-)
Good luck in your quest Harvey ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-11-02 147671
Harvey,
I really like the gift of words you have ;)
Dennis ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-11-02 147672
They want to make up for the shortage with 2 cords of screened firewood, ie. no debris. as 4 cords was actually two cords is 2 more of their cords actually 1 cord :-(
What do you think ? I think I would rather part ways with a credit for what I did not get and removal of the junk they left me. Afterall we are not married ;-)
These guys are killing me.
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| nosteiner4me
Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 113 ohio
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2007-11-02 147675
Dennis, you still need the wood and if they are willing to help stack the wood and it is agreed by both of you that you will get 2 more cords(128 cu ft each cord)then i would say go ahead. Since you were short so much i could see no arguement on their end as to helping you stack and make sure 2 cords is 2 cords. I split 6 cords by hand this summer and i no way have anything left over like that mess in your driveway. I would think since they are willing to make it right(keep your money) that they will make it right with better wood this time. Good luck ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2007-11-02 147677
Dennis, I agree with Nosteriner if they were friendly about it. If not I would want one drop of blood. Hey do they hang ceiling fans? If so do not use them. :) kt ....
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 | hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 3583 iowa
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2007-11-02 147679
Dennis; We been gone a few days so I'm kinda catching up here. Yes that is kind of an ugly pile of nothing they dumped in your drive. We've all kind of had second chances a time or two in the past, perhaps if they are willing to make up the difference in the firewood shortage and haul away the rubbble it might work out. You always have the option of not buying from them a second time. As for the ceiling fan, would the Mrs. be real upset if you just returned the fan and somehow had some kind of floor level fans to somewhat of the same thing making the air circulate. It could be worse you know, some folks in this world don't even have a ceiling, let alone a fan. (No joke intended here). Frank. ....
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| bloggins
Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 104 Kingston, Ontario
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2007-11-02 147685
Take their two cords, once you have inspected it, and consider the matter closed. Their is no value in being stressed, and now you (and we) know who to deal with and who not to. Personally, I inspect everything including gravel deliveries before I let them dump it at my home. ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-11-03 147690
Bloggins,
Amen to that!
Dennis ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2007-11-07 147895
Dennis, what did they finally come up with? It sometimes is hard to know when to turn loose. kt ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-11-07 147898
They refuse to give me a refund without me filing a law suit against them. They say they will send me two cords of better quality wood. I have to call them today to see if they still plan on honoring that offer as they did not reply to my email.
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-11-15 148306
They are supposed to deliver two cords today. Will let you know how it turns out. ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2007-11-15 148307
It's interesting to note the time line on this.
In the original post you said the delivery of the wood was "prompt". That was Oct. 31st.
On Nov. 7th you said you had already emailed them about accepting 2 cords of wood, but got no reply and were going to follow it up with a phone call.
Now it's Nov. 15th and they're 'supposed' to drop off the wood today.
It looks like "prompt" ended 2 weeks ago.
Best of luck.
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-11-15 148308
If anyone ever read Franz Kafka's "The Castle", this is a little like that story.
As in Kafka's novel a man goes to a village to speak to the master of the castle, but he only gets to speak to people who say they have spoken or seen the master of the castle and they refer him to another person that does have access to the master, every time he digs deeper he finds that each of the people that say they have seen the master never did but rather spoke to someone who said they had seen the master.
In this case I was dealing with an office manager who had no decision powers, and always said she would talk to her supervisors. As we discussed this there was always the delay to find out what the supervisor said.
Then a week and half ago the office manager got into a car accident. Eventually she replied with the phone number of the supervisors.
I then called them, thinking at last no more middle man!
Nope, when I called the supervisors were always in a meeting.
And so it went until I was looking forward to the rapid recovery of the office manager.
I called her yesterday and she was back, hurray!
I asked her were they going to deliver the 2 cords. She said she'd have to talk to her supervisors LOL
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Link: The Castle, Franz Kafka
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| candoarms
Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1932 North Dakota
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2007-11-15 148310
Dennis CTB,
Thankfully the receptionist wasn't killed in that car accident, or nothing would ever get done there! hehehe.
Joel ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2007-11-15 148312
Dennis, it is time to go higher up the food chain. I have no idea about this company but somewhere there is an owner's name. License Department, Secretary of State's Office or such. Call asking for that peron by name. Be polite, just tell you are sureif they were aware of such service they would be very upset and wanted them to be aware of it to protect their reputation. Normally that gets attention/action. kt ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-11-15 148314
Ok I just got the delivery of the two cords. This time it is just split wood no debris. The wood seems to be split in very large pieces too big for even a fireplace let alone a stove, not aged, very dirty like it was in a land fill. If the weather clears I will start splitting it and stacking it over the week end to confirm the amount.
It is hard to get satisfaction when you are dealing with a company like MulchExpressUSA. ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2007-11-16 148359
I may have missed this but I just really noticed this company's name. It is not firewoodexpress so guess the name says it all. But that does not work either for that sure did not look like mulch either. kt ....
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| Larryj24
Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3 LaGrangeville, NY
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2007-12-21 149527
This thread ended in November without knowing if you got the FULL 2 Cords they promised.
Keep your blog up about them. AND The Department of Weights and Measures is the correct department to report them to.
A Cord, Face Cord etc, are measurements of volume and if you are selling by the cord, you must DELIVER A FULL CORD. If they tell you, you will get crap mixed in, that is fine, but you still have to end up with a full cord. Oh, and that is measured WHEN STACKED, not tossed. So if you take a 4x4x8 box and toss wood into it, THAT IS NOT A CORD.
Their name doesn't mean mulch, I mean much, LOL As soon as they choose to deliver Firewood, they have to meet the requirements of that.
Funny thing is I entered my zip code to see what they would charge to deliver to me (I am 2 hours away! from there) $165 for a cord! That to me says it all. No way anyone is bringing me a load of wood traveling 4 hours for $165.00 Now, I know that they would if they are bringing me stuff that would normally cost them to get rid of IE: waste.
I have seen many firewood operations up close. There is no way to get all that waste in a load unless you put it it. So what they are doing is adding a yard or two (or in his case 4) of waste from their mulching biz and sending it out to each and every customer. In essence, spreading their garbage out and not having to pay to get rid of it.
By the way, I posted their name and your video on some other sites as well. Help to spread the word. ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2007-12-21 149531
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Larry,
I finally finished stacking it and I would say now that I have the 4 cords of stuff but the quality is still not so hot and the "split part" as I said is a misnomer, I had to re-split all of crap they sent me. The wood had at least 15% was tulip (yuck! too sappy and little heat from it burns quickly). The wood was all split but too big for my stove so my son and I split it all again. I also think this load was pretty green judging from the weight.
I thought the price reflected a quantity discount rather than a quality decline based on the sites admonitions.
I could have bought from a local guy called "Tims Timber" in Hackettsown NJ for $200 a cord. My son and I saw two of their loaded delivery trucks at a fast foot place over the weekend. Looked like good clean seasoned wood.
I am glad it is over and I am done with them. I thought they would want me to remove the bad review of their business, but just as what I got from them, they just don't care. If they had been willing to compensate me for my time and inconvenience it would have been a consideration.
It is amazing how some people can reach some level of success with such a poor product!
Dennis
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2007-12-21 149535
Dennis, adding to your comments, as an insurance agent that is why I ask those who have such experience to report that to their State Dept of Ins. It at least may prevent someone else having the same heart ache.
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| Larryj24
Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3 LaGrangeville, NY
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2007-12-21 149548
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The only goverment body that would care is the Department of Weights and Measures. Other than that, a lawsuit in court, but they were willing to rectify the situation so that is out.
Success is not a means of determining Quality as much as it is Quantity. Just look at McDonalds. Not the best hamburger you ever bought! ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2010-10-09 174471
The following are comments responding to SPAM from MulchXpressUSA:
Very interesting!
First you visit the MulchXpressUSA video on youTube, pretending to be a disinterested third party who posts numerous comments that state that I am "dishonest" in my review of MulchXpressUSA.
Then when I block your comments about my factually documented and honest review, you come here saying that my review is damaging your business.
I worked my butt off trying to get a refund from MulchXpressUSA, hours and hours of calls, video, removing the debris, and the final load of wood was really unsatisfactory, and required two man days of work to make usable and cull out the crap in it. So no I was not and am not satisfied. I was exhausted with chasing after MulchXpressUSA, and I want others to know what that was like so they can make their own choice.
My review was widely available over the last three years to warn consumers of the experience I had with MulchXpressUSA.
If you had googled MulchXpressUSA in the last three years you would see that my review of this business was at the top of the list. Something a potential buyer should have known.
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| bloggins
Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 104 Kingston, Ontario
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2010-10-09 174473
Stick to your guns Dennis! Change of administration is always doubtful. Could just be Jr. taking over from Pa. Because of you, a company is forced to act honestly or seem to act honestly, but you shouldn't have to do this, this should have never happened in the first place. The "new" administration should change there name to clear the air of any bad service from the "previous" owners. Then again with a name like Mulch Xpress, I would figure that they would deliver mulch and nothing else. ....
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| kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2010-10-09 174474
Part of buying a business is to perform due diligence. Any bad will discovered should have been factored into the purchase price. Reviews posted before a change of ownership are not invalidated by the change so why should history be rewritten?
A better way to approach it would be for the new owners to apologize and work to satisfy customers that have been mistreated in the past and, perhaps, gain them as new customers. Doing so would be more productive than complaining to them about their reaction to being screwed.
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2010-10-09 174486
I use phone and email a lot in my business. But somethings are still best handled by a face to face conversation. Frankly too often the change of ownership does not mean anything has changed or if so it has for the better.
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 | earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2010-10-09 174487
Mulch, it happens. Deal with it. Even still, I can't see how Dennis' post has had that great an impact on your business that would hunt him down like some kind of animal.
Dying to know: what is the real reason the other guy sold?
And $200 for a cord? I thought we (those in the wood biz) used to get top price---nowadays everyone is selling wood. A face cord goes for as little as $45 and no more than $65.
I'm a contractor. In 12 years I've only had one bad complaint against me--- from a local couple who unfortunately both are mentally ill (no other way to 'splain it Lucy). The wife posted lies about me on Angie's List. The way I found out about it was -----I googled my company name. Boy, I was furious! I contacted the company and countered her false claims. They gave her a week to reply and she didn't. And they took down my negative feedback. Funny, about year after that her brother in law (whom she doesn't like) had me work for him for the second time. The second day on the job her husband happened to be there. Boy was that uncomfortable... for him. He was like a dog that pooped on the carpet. ....
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| DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998 Posts: 2709 NorthWest NJ
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2010-10-09 174488
Thanks EW!
I really don't want to hear from these guys .... what happened sucked and having them on my site just adds to the insult. I am deleting anything they posted here and anything they post going forward.
Dennis ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2010-10-09 174490
Dennis, think that is wise. No idea of the comments made elsewhere but the comments just here did not seem proper. If they are truly honest it is a shame they bought so blindly as Ken pointed out. If the company name was being bought then be sure the value of the name, just the same if you were buying used equipment have it checked out if you don't know how to. ....
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| earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2010-10-10 174507
Dennis I would have left up everything they said---it is a testament of who they really are. Then, let the buying public see/learn for themselves based on your experience. Think about it: if you remove the crap they posted it's as if it never happened---they win. I don't think they're that smart to begin with to execute a plan per se, but by default that's how I see it playing out.
Speaking of not being too smart... (not you, Kenny so put that phone down--I do have caller ID) if they were on their toes and if your Dennis experience was that detrimental (wow just think of the power you wield!) anyone with half a brain would have simply changed the name.
Are these guys what we call "tree guys" who cut trees then chop them up for fire wood? There's quite a few guys here who make millions doing this.
I had an opportunity to get and sell 300,000 cubic yards of tree chippings. I had just a week earlier bought this same type of tree chippings from a landscape supply for $28 a yard! So I thought I'd sell this landscape supply my goldmine. He says sure he'll take as much as I could bring! He said he normally gets them for free---from tree services--- but he'd GIVE me a dollar a yard delivered! Take a guess what I told him. Sadly I sold a measly 15 yards (it was awful stuff). Weeks later it was loaded into 100-yard Canadian haulers and trucked to incinerators for making power and cement. ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2010-10-12 174539
Looks like I missed most of the excitement.
Dennis, if it were me, I'd put up a follow-up comment or video showing the dirty tricks they pulled like making disparaging comments about your factual expose under the guise of being some disinterested third party and not the company themselves.
Best of luck. ....
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