Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package: Current Events  -- Current Events Health Happiness Discussion Forum and Review Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package: Current Events -- Current Events Health Happiness Discussion Forum

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 08-05-2009, 15:28 Post: 164672
kwschumm



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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

Just got back from a company quarterly status meeting.

Our sales are down a third from a year ago, not unusual.

Apparently, though, the stimulus program is directly reducing our sales.

We sell a lot to universities, medical research facilities and the like. They
are telling our sales force that they are holding off on all capital purchases
until they see how/if/what/when the stimulus program will impact them.

Note that they do have the money to spend but they are waiting to see if the
stimulus program will give them a windfall and allow them to buy more or buy
differently.

In the mean time our company has cut 600 jobs and closed four production facilities.

I can't wait to see the unintended consequences of the health care train wreck.
They are surely worse than any of the reports we've heard so far.






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 08-05-2009, 16:08 Post: 164673
kthompson



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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

The "intended consequences" ones will be bad enough. The trickle down effect will be more like a raging river. Three local hospitals have already began freezes in hiring, notice of no wage increases, lay offs, hours worked reduced and termination of construction and careful review of any capital purchases due to revenue levels they will be at. Note, these three local hospitals are: one county own, one private nonprofit and the third not sure of it's ownership.

The fact Congress has exempted it self from this and allows them to keep the coverage they now have tells us enough.

Then guess I am one of the idots who is being paid and bused to say this.






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 08-05-2009, 18:01 Post: 164684
earthwrks

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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

Personally, the health care industry NEEDS to have the same thing hapen to it that has happened to the car industry. For way too long wages have been bloated for no reason. Doctors especially need a good spanking.

Next in line are teachers. In my area of Metro Detroit our teachers are some of the highest paid. My former girl friend teaches 5th graders and clears $38 an hour plus bennies. Just more with the entitlement mentality that they deserve the best no matter the cost to society.

BTW, I'm changing my name to Hardwood Jr. Laughing out loud






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 08-05-2009, 21:12 Post: 164686
kwschumm



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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

There are a bunch of things wrong with health care, and government can play a role, but the way they are going about it will kill anyone sickly or over 50 and raise costs to unsustainable levels.

I mostly blame lawyers, bureaucracy, pharmaceutical companies and government. Lawyers for treating the judicial system like a lottery, bureaucrats for allowing their ranks to get so bloated that ~50% of health care dollars go to pay pencil pushers, pharmaceutical companies for charging ridiculous prices to developed countries "because they can" (they charge far less in countries that can't afford it) and government for failing in their oversight role, passing unsustainable programs that cause all of our rates to go up and sucking at the teat of business for self enrichment.






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 08-06-2009, 06:49 Post: 164692
hardwood

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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

Either the TV ad's for health insurance are total lies or the old time insurance companies we all have been paying are total theives.
Two ad's come to mind, one that says that for ten dollars a day they will insure a family with a list of coverages that seem to cover every possible situation. The other ad I saw just yesterday says that for the cost of a cup of coffee a day you can have health insurance, it must be premium coffee.
Our Medicare supplement policy alone costs just short of ten dollars a day for the two of us so somebody just isn't telling the whole story here.
EW; Should I be flattered or what that you would want me to adopt you. First thing you would have to do is buy a gear drive tractor to even be considerd for the position.






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 08-06-2009, 08:30 Post: 164693
auerbach



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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

KW: "Unintended consequences." Yes, that is bound to become a major theme in public consciousness. Your example is one of many, but a particularly compelling one. I urge you to write an op-ed piece on this, and submit it to the largest nearby newspaper.






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 08-06-2009, 08:46 Post: 164694
kthompson



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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

Without a doubt there are many items in health care that could be improved and lower the cost. Hardwood those prices you are seeing if for insurance are plans that pay at Medicare reimburse rates which are much lower than anyone else can pay and is shown by your need for a Medicare Supplement.

I learned yesterday the reason for so few OBGYN doctors who do delieveries is to the law suits they face if a "normal" birth does wrong so it is safer for them to go to a "C" section if there is any thing out of "normal" going on. Guess it proves they did all they could to potect the child and mother when in many cases less costly and less stressful normal child birth would have done well in vast majority of cases.

I listened to Obama's previous Doctor last night tell how Medicare have never gotten between him and what care he wanted to give...with a family member in the health care they may not get between they just nick pick everything with threaten fines and such. Yet they are full of fraud as has been reported over and over to the point they went to the Medicare Advantage plans with insurance companies taking on claims management to reduce over all cost.

As an insurance agent let me be the first to say there are insurance companies who are anything but ethical. There are also agents almost as dishonest as many in the current administration in DC.






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 08-06-2009, 09:11 Post: 164697
kwschumm



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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

Quote:
Originally Posted by auerbach | view 164693
KW: "Unintended consequences." Yes, that is bound to become a major theme in public consciousness. Your example is one of many, but a particularly compelling one. I urge you to write an op-ed piece on this, and submit it to the largest nearby newspaper.



The last time I wrote a letter to the editor of the Oregonian newspaper they rewrote it to make me sound like a drooling moron and printed that instead. My letter of complaint to their "consumer advocate" was responded to with a form letter restating their policy that they reserve the right to edit all submissions for clarity, brevity and content. I won't make that mistake again, they are a prime example of what is wrong with journalism in this country and there's a good reason why nobody buys what they print. I am hoping for the day when they go belly up altogether.






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 08-06-2009, 09:18 Post: 164698
kwschumm



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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

Interesting. I posted our companies experience with customers delaying purchases due to the stimulus in a usenet newsgroup and another guy said the sales guys in his company are saying the same thing. Besides the stupidity of it all one has to wonder if the stimulus is really delaying any possible recovery.

Stimulus dollars here are being spent to repave roads that don't really need it. They could be adding lanes or paving over all the dirt roads in the county but that would make too much sense.






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 08-06-2009, 10:59 Post: 164703
auerbach



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 Unintended consequences of the Stimulus package

You're a good writer, KW, but newspapers have their own editorial conventions, space limitations, "balance" issues, legal fears, etc., and some low-level editors feel that the more they change in a submission, the better they're doing their job. You have an important and timely point to make, and if you'd like to get a former columnist's comments on your first draft, you're welcome to send to me.






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