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Super UDT and Premium UDT Hydralic oil

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bpeter01777
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 3 Prince Edward Island, Canada
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2010-05-03          170522


Super UDT which is a synthetic based hydraulic oil with a grapite base was recently touted ans the best oil ever and used extensively in the states and also used in newly manufactured tractors built in the states. Not available in Canada is one of the dumbest thing I have ever heard and will be expressing my concers on every blog including tractor .com. Why should Canadian purchasers be force to replace the UDT with an inferior product. Kubota in their news release said that the new SUPER SYNTHETIC oil was far superior and the manual clearly indicates that SUPER UDT is now used in the tractors, yet all that is available is the PREMIUM in CAnada How stupid is that? forced to replace with an inferior oil.
The problem is there is no way of reaching Kubota to express my displeasure with them.
Bill


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auerbach
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 2168 West of Toronto
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2010-05-03          170525


Be glad you're immune to a marketing ploy. I can't see any benefit of its being synthetic with graphite, and hyd systems don't fail because the brand-name fluid was poor quality. ....

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earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2010-05-04          170527


Quote:
Originally Posted by auerbach | view 170525
and hyd systems don't fail because the brand-name fluid was poor quality.


Auer I'm shocked at this reply. You're a learned man. Lol

But you couldn't be more wrong. Poor quality fluid IS the leading reason for wear, especialy when pumps are concerned and for that matter any moving parts like piston seals. ....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2010-05-04          170531


So, explain the situation a bit more. As I get your post you have a new Kubota that you know has the synthetic fluid, right? Now your concern is that Kubota doesn't sell that type fluid in Canada, correct? I'm sure they will shortly. If your owners manual calls for the new stuff, they will have it soon. Seems strange they would call for it and not sell it, I think you likely find it there soon. ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7199 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2010-05-04          170532


Bill, I hate to ruin a perfectly good rant on you, but......

The only reason we have "Premium UDT" in Canada instead of "Super UDT" is the legal beagles said so. :)

The name "Super UDT" is a trademark of Kubota USA, and as such must be produced by them, or under license to them, and to their specifications. This only makes sense since they would ultimately be responsible if, for example, it really was inferior and caused damage, for which they would be liable.

"Premium UDT" is however a trademark of, and produced by Petro-Canada under license to, Kubota Canada. Although I have not been able to get a straight answer from either Petro-Canada nor Kubota, several sources 'in the know' have unequivocally stated that it is really Petro-Canada's Duratran Synthetic.

If you look at the spec's, Duratran Synthetic is actually a superior product, not inferior.

As for your issues with contacting Kubota Canada, I'm not sure what you mean, your local dealer will give the name and number of your regional rep., and the head office address and contact information including phone numbers is on their website.


Best of luck. ....

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auerbach
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 2168 West of Toronto
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2010-05-04          170534


Once a vehicle is sold, the maker and dealers make no more money on it (except for occasional parts or servicing). That's why they push their own brand of consumables.

Do you use Toyota antifreeze and motor oil in your Toyota? Do you stick to Motorcraft oil, coolant, filters and belts for your Ford?

If yes, is it because you think these makers operate their own refineries and filter and belt firms? Well, they buy them from the same firms that sell to Walmart. Which is where, mistakenly or not, I shop. ....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2010-05-04          170535


Auer;
Ok just my take on the consumables. I still do the service on my tractors, mowere, Gators and their related equipment that I can do from ground level. Pickups and cars I used to do myself too till a handicap situation prevents me from gettting down and under things.
Now I go to the dealership where I bought the pickup and cars where i actually know the owner and most of the guys outback and am very confident they wouldn't slip in some cheap crap oil then chaerge me for the brand name oil. There are some big time dealerships that i wouldn;t trust to sevice a bicycle.
I'ts usually in the 23-26 dollar range for oil/filter/top the washer flids, check all other things underneath, etc. including the man's time to do the service. I'm sure they don't make a killing on this but it gets my car in ther door to do brakes, etc. whaterver else that actually makes them some money.
Back in my farming days when I used lots of oil transmission fluids and filters I still used whatever brand the machine was. Yes any brand oil that meets or exceeds the specs. in the owners manual is OK, but for the difference in the cost of the oils it just wasn't worth the risk of an unknown brand in a machine that cost 200K. Filters are another matter, I used to be a Baldwin dealer and can point to some very well known brand filters that are total junk, cut some new ones open to see what's inside. That sold more Baldwin filters for me than all the printed advertisment could have ever done. GM, Ford, Deere, Kubota, filters are good, I've cut them open too. Baldwin at the time i was involved could undersell the majors, till deere for example lowered their filter prices to remain competive, they weren't selling many filters when they got too aggressive with their pricing.
I think that old Henry Ford owned some oil wells and blended his own brew, but since then I doubt any auto ot tractor company owns any wells. ....

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Super UDT and Premium UDT Hydralic oil

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7199 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2010-05-04          170536


Quote:
Originally Posted by hardwood | view 170535
and hyd systems don't fail because the brand-name fluid was poor quality.
[QUOTE=hardwood;170535] I still do the service on my tractors, mowere, Gators and their related equipment that I can do from ground level. Pickups and cars I used to do myself too till a handicap situation prevents me from gettting down and under things.

There are some big time dealerships that i wouldn;t trust to sevice a bicycle. [/QUOTE]

Frank, get ol' Jeffy to service your bicycle for you, our friend Kenny says he's an expert on things that go round and round like bicycle wheels do.

LOL

Seriously though, I'm with you on the quality stuff, it's cheap insurance.

A friend of my father's was with an executive with a big international auto parts manufacturer for many years. He said they wanted to close a certain plant because of the poor quality it produced but the union was making it tough, so instead they kept it going and sold the stuff to cut-rate places like Wally World instead.

I know I've bought things like spark plugs from a big Canadian auto parts place in the past when I got stuck on a weekend or something, total waste of time, in one case I had to buy 6 plugs, 3 packs of 2 plugs, before I got a single plug that would work.

Best of luck. ....

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earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2010-05-04          170539


Whoa am I dizzy...(referring to Murf's ...ahem.... comment.

Anywho...a few years ago my New Holland dealer was complaining to me that the NH rep had just left their place and had the Parts dept up in arms. The rep demanded they get rid off all non-NH branded parts like filters oil etc that had "Fleetgard" on it because they were in direct competition with NH and were cheaper. They could not get it across to the rep that "Fleetgard" WAS (is) a NH brand. Just another example of the right hand not knowing what the left is doing.

....

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4289 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2010-05-05          170549


Bill,

Do you have access to Chevron brand lubricants? If so, Chevron All Weather Synthetic THF is for all practical purposes Kubota Super UDT. Chevron makes many of the lubricants for John Deere and I suspect you find they make them for Kubota as well if you take the time to track down the MSDS information.

Mark started a good thread on this subject a good while back:

http://tractorpoint.com/cgi-bin/tractorreview/fullThread.pl?parentnum=43224&subject=Replacement%20for%20Super%20UDT&keyword=Kubota%20Review

Here is some information you can compare against the Kubota Super UDT specs. for your own satisfaction:

http://www.alexisoil.com/pdf/SyntheticAllWeatherTHF.pdf

None of the tractor manufacturers manufactures their lubrants or other fluids. They are all contracted out to various petroleum refining companies. You CAN find the equivalent oil refining company brands that are MUCH cheaper. ....

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kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 5242 South Carolina
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2010-05-05          170563


Murf, you are correct...Ole Jeffery is the expert in that area. ....

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cutter
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 1306 The South Shore of Lake Ontario, New York
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2011-12-02          181469


I used the SUPER UDT since my first change, ready for the second one now. Over the years I have always purchased the best lubricants and oils possible. ....

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bristan8
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 65 Camden NSW, Australia
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2011-12-02          181478



I have a recent model Kubota which came with super udt in the transmission. When the dealer did the first service he replaced the fluid with standard udt. Apparently the super udt is not available in Australia as for Canada. The problem I have is the hydrostatic transmission pedal became sluggish after the oil change. I complained to the dealer who just lubricates the linkage. He says he will mention it to the rep but nothing seems to happen. By sluggish I mean that if you take your foot off the pedal while moving, the tractor keeps going as the pedal stays down. I sometimes have to kick the reverse pedal to stop it. This can be dangerous in some situations. It seems to be worse in the winter as after a couple of summer 33deg (90F) days the pedal started returning normally. The pedal is quite free when the tractor is not running which indicates to me that the linkage is ok.
I looked in the manual and found a printed sticker on the lube page saying either fluid could be used. Obviously put there by the Australian importer. I removed the sticker and the original print said to use super udt with no mention of standard udt.
I know that super udt is a thinner oil than standard and as the hydro transmission was designed for this oil it is feasible that the thicker udt somehow is causing this problem. This would explain why the udt is now working when it is hotter and also thinner.
I have thought about importing the correct oil but being a dangerous goods this is probably out of the question. I have been putting up with it but it is disappointing that an otherwise good product is marred by what is probably a marketing decision by the Aust importers. On paper the udt spec would appear to be fine however field testing sometimes tells a different story. I may be completely wrong and I will probably never know as the dealers are just not interested. Such is the modern world!
....

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