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 | ihookem
Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 49 Allenton, Wisconsin 
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2007-01-08 138582
In 130 hrs. I have had several flats and my front tires leak all the time. Even put a tube in one and still went bad. My back tires are ok but the fronts are 4 ply. Do you think it's too wimply with an fel with a 7510? Also, where can I buy good tires? The Kubota dealer wants 234 dollars each for a 6 ply bar tire.
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 | Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York 
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2007-01-08 138602
I don't know exactly what you've been doing it or where but it has proven not to be good for your tires. I'd wonder if on the fronts if you've been keeping enough air in them to keep the bead seated but with the one with a tube going flat are you working on a bed of nails? It sems like the harder R-4's might be good for you as the only thing the ag tires might give you is thicker rubber which just slows the flats down abit. The ag tires have taller bars that might help the tire from hitting all the debris but for the most part offer little more protection then the turf tires as far as thickness. ....
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 | greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky 
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2007-01-08 138603
If you have a specific reason for staying with turfs, you have to realize that 4-plies are unsuitable for FEL work. Too much flex in the sidewalls. The R4 recommendation is a good one. But if turfs are your only alternative, match the tire rating to the payload. Depending upon how much you typically lift/carry, you need no less than 6 ply - maybe even 8 or 10
//greg// ....
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| Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2007-01-09 138609
After not being able to get a matching foursome set of tires for a large farm tractor years ago I found the outer dimensions of the desired tires and found some that were the same but a different tread depth. What an eye opener! IT took about one hour of operation for the first u-joint on the drive shaft to have the grease running out of it. I don't try to mix and match tires treads at all anymore. ....
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 | yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2007-01-09 138618
I have turfs and haven't had any problems. My fronts are extra wide giving more support for a FEL. The brand of tire is "Galaxy" which is quite popular.
All of the tractor manufacturers put too small of a tire on the fronts when it comes to "Turfs" except how mine is equipped.
If you can go with a wider front tire but keep the diameter the same it will help lots.
Have you thought about loading the fronts, that will give extra support to the sidewalls. ....
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| Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2007-01-10 138635
Filling front tires is not the best for wear on steering components although the Kubota's are about the easiest steering. You might want to look at foam filling the fronts which still will give you additional weight but no flats at all from foriegn objects. ....
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| charlieK
Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 137 kentucky
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2007-01-10 138650
I've had my front ags foam filled for almost 3 yrs. now and no problems with the steering on the L3130GST 4X4 w/723 loader. best thing I ever did. rears too. expensive but no flats and lotsa weight. I don't abuse the tractor. ....
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 | earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2007-01-11 138655
Art, maybe I missed something but can you clarify why liquid filling wears the steering components? (was this specific to the post or in general?). Foam filling (urethane?) weighs even more than chloride or water so that would be even worse, wouldn't it? ....
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 | kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2007-01-11 138658
Art, may I add to EW's question? How does filled tires compared to weights on the front end for wear?
It is easy to find the suggestios to remove weights when not needed, but with clamps to keep them from getting bumped off, sort of a pain. Also pain to the back.
As to water filled, for some reason I have been told by local dealership DO NOT FILL FRONT TIRES. He went on to say...I don't remember why. But he was sure you did not, period. Yes Kubota dealer. ....
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| greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2007-01-11 138663
Hate to interrupt, but this is starting to stray from the OP topic here; a loader-related 4ply turf tire issue. Besides, front weights have to come off before most loaders are mounted.
//greg// ....
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| earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2007-01-11 138701
Greg: I hated for you to interrupt too. Let's not get our panties in a bunch over some relevant information that needs to be clarified. Art, has a lot to offer and that's what makes this board tick. If you'll read ALL the replies a bit closer you'll find that this IS on target (and who says there's rules anyway?). Loosen up :) ....
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| greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2007-01-11 138703
Well, as a general member I don't have the power to stop you from using this as your personal bulletin board. But it's poor ettiquete in most other public forums, quite commonly referred to as hijacking. But since I'm now guilty of it myself, I guess you can talk about your front weights all you want.
//greg// ....
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| ihookem
Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 49 Allenton, Wisconsin
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2007-01-11 138706
Thanks for all the replies. I found some tires at place called Fleet Farm and popular in Wisconsin. Art says stick with the same all around so I will. They are six ply so they should be better. I would go with eight or ten ply but don't know were to get them. Anyone know of a place I can order 8 or 10 plies? ....
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| Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2007-01-11 138714
Not to sound to picky but it does make a difference. Think of every time you steer your tractor that you are pushing a weight. The more it weighs the more strength you need to move, the more stress on the tierod ends as well as the steering rods. We've been spoiled by power steering as we don't have to feel the load directly and the power steering is a good amplifier of our strength. In years gone by some power steering couldn't even move the wheels at an idle with a full bucket. Some built today still can't. To do back in time when only manual steering was available on some tractors even with out loaders you had to move the tractor to get it to turn. It's important to have a tire with the same outside diameter as well as body or core to have a good mate. ....
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| Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2007-01-11 138715
Greg, I wasn't trying to stray. There are many different ways to solve a problem and solutions might be differnent from one application to the next. I don't like to waste my money or other peoples so normally I like to cover as many solutions as I can. ....
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| greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2007-01-11 138719
I know of several sources of 8 and 10 ply, I used them on the front of my Yanmar. But I could help you pin down a source better if I knew what size you were looking for and what tread pattern you desired. I'm guessing about 21x8x10 or so, but tread selection is pretty slim when you get into 8 and 10 ply territory.
//greg// ....
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| fcoccia
Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 8 Penna.
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2007-01-12 138735
Wouldn't mind a clarification on something that Art had mentioned in this thread. My understanding of Art's statment is that mis-matching tread designs between front and back can cause problems in the drive-train. I'm certainly not experienced enough to debate that point, but my curiousity forces me to ask why?
Scenerio: (Mine actuallY)
Kubota L3450 4wd
Agressive Turfs in the BACK (ex. Titan 21.5L-16.1SL 10 SofTrac II TL ) These are large knob pretty aggressive for a tire refered to as Turf.
Regular Turfs up FRONT (ex. Titan 27x10.50x15-4 MULTI TRAC CS TL ) Worn pretty good on the edges!
Would like to replace the fronts with an R4 type tire to aid in traction in muddy areas, backs work pretty good now! Although I am not getting flats up front, if you are using the loader to its potential, the front 4ply tires are a little spongy. Are you saying that if I replace the front turfs with R4's that MATCH the overall circumference of the original tires it will cause problems??? If so, why would that be in your opinion?
thanks ....
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| Justus
Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 179 Justus, Pa.
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2007-01-15 138811
I'm looking forward to an answer to fcoccia's question. I have Turf tires on my TC 33D and other than when I have my back blade on, I don't have any actual ballast in the back. On the occasions I've used the loader with any significant weight in it without the back blade on, the front tires are really squished. I can see how they would work their way off the rims. I like the Turf's in the snow and naturally on the grass but if/when the time comes for me to get new tires I'd like something with stiffer sidewalls for the front. ....
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 | kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2007-01-15 138813
No definitive answers, but maybe something to think about (assuming 4WD here). The front/rear lead/lag ratio may be wrong if the tire diameters are mismatched. When the front tires "squish" it's like changing the front tire diameter which changes lead/lag. If the front and rear tires squish proportionally to each other as loads change the ratio might be maintained correctly. If the fronts are stiffer and don't squish as much the rears the ratios will be different, but I don't think anyone can say if they will change enough to be a problem without examining each individual circumstance. Loads on these machines change dynamically with use and if we had to worry about lead/lag ratios every time we loaded the bucket or connected a bush hog we'd go nuts. Myself, I wouldn't see a problem swapping turfs for R4s on the front, as long as they have the same diameter, but then I have far less experience than Art or Murf on such things. ....
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| Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2007-01-15 138817
Justus, I'd make it a point to either leave the fronts with the air for having the loader on or have a way to add it quickly. That will cause problems with your drive train as far as the lead lag ratio. ....
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| ihookem
Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 49 Allenton, Wisconsin
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2007-01-15 138831
My front tires on the 7510 are 12x8.5x23 ....
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| earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2007-01-15 138832
hookem: I'm not sure if anyone mentioned it, but as far as tires going flat, have you tired Slime tire sealant (about $28 - $40/gal avail. at Walmart and TSC on low end of price)? I use it exclusively in my CUT and skid steer. I usually put 1.5-2 gallons in each tire on the skid steer which has tires 12" x 32" tall---about 4 times what the mfg. suggests but seems to work well. I use that much because by the time the tire sealant is forced out to plug the hole there still is enough for next time and residual air pressure.
I also use a tire boot in the CUT R-4 front tires which is thick rubber sleeve to add thickness to the tread. Those are about the size of a mid-size car tire. ....
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| Justus
Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 179 Justus, Pa.
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2007-01-15 138833
Art, I have the recommended air pressure in the tires. I helped a neighbor during the summer put a paver sidewalk in and used my bucket to haul his gravel and sand. It wasn't far, just from his driveway to where we were working, but I didn't have any rear ballast. Usually if I have a lot to do with the bucket, which isn't often, I'll put the back blade on for ballast. Anyway, with no ballast helping my neighbor I noticed a decent sized bucket of sand or gravel would really flatten the FRONT turfs. I did worry a little about breaking the seal on the tire but I just took my time. Are you saying I should have increased the tire pressure under those conditions? I know I should have rear ballast of some type but I usually do this stuff on my own (I'm not one to ask for help from anyone) and taking the back blade out of a shed I keep it in and putting it on/off and back in the shed myself is a real pain.
Without looking up the thread I remember Mark (DRankin) talking about after market tires he had gotten. They were a truck tire and looked like Turf tires but I believe the sidewalls were stiffer. Again, I could be wrong.
Thanks, Steve ....
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| greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2007-01-16 138847
Greenball sells one, looks like their part number is T1222S. It's listed as a trailer tire, but that's where ya gotta look for 8 and 10 ply tires small enough to fit your application.
It's a biased 22.5x8x12, 10 ply, load range F, load rated 1980 pounds each. Can't see a JD7510 lifting anything those babies won't support. I know you said you've got a 23 inch tire, but consider that 23" is the unloaded height.
See http://www.greenball.com/tires/biastrailer.htm
//greg// ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2007-01-16 138848
I thought the air pressure is what held the tire (load) up, not the side walls. I thought the stiffer sidewalls gave support against side ways movement and the total tire held the air in, with the higher ply rating having the strength to hold more pressure, thus more load. But, I just asking... ....
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| greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2007-01-16 138850
I don't know if you're addressing that to me - but, umm....who said it wasn't ? Yes - additional loader weight is in fact supported by increasing tire air pressure. But additional sidewall plies are necessary to safely contain that additional air pressure.
It's a sequential thing; adding sidewall strength permits higher air pressure that permits you to use the loader to its maximum rated capacity.
//greg// ....
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| Justus
Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 179 Justus, Pa.
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2007-01-16 138857
"It's a sequential thing; adding sidewall strength permits higher air pressure that permits you to use the loader to its maximum rated capacity."
Well put! I wish that, for what would probably be a few dollars more at time of purchase, they would place beefier sidewall Turf style Tires on or at least give you the option.
....
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 | Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 4299 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2007-01-23 139072
ihookem,
In answer to your question, it has been my experience that pretty much any tire on a tractor that is less than 6 ply is prone to punctures. Sometimes even the 8 and 10 ply tires has some mishaps. I had this problem with my ATV's on the ranch being that they came with OEM 2 ply tires. My neighbor got a puncture in the front tire of his John Deere 5420 and had a similar issue.
I talked to the guys at my local Coop who mount and repair tractor tires and they swear by a product call TRC Tire Seal. They charge about 38 cents per ounce to fill tire with it and say they have never had a come back. I purchased a 6 gallon pail for $105 and the pump kit costs about $75. The pump kit is DEFINITELY worth it due to the large volumes of tire seal tractro tires take. I filled all of my ATV tires and my neighbors tractor tire and all have retained pressure and not a single flat since. I abuse the heck out of my ATV tires and my neighbor does too.
On the subject of tires for use with a FEL. Your 4 ply turfs are just not going to work well if at all depending upon how much weight you pickup. You will need to upgrade to at least a 6 ply and I would recommend an 8 ply or better tire. The tire casings and side walls are MUCH stronger and resistant to punctures as well. ....
Link: TRC Tireseal
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