Go BottomKubota 3400 Manual Trans vs Hydro HST knee pain
 | praha4752
Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 68 
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2007-07-08 143513
After 2 hours heavy FEL work with my new 3400 my knee hurts like hell. never had a problem with it.
I bought a gear tractor to have fun. Hydro seemed boring..hahaha.
Joe
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 | earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan 
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2007-07-08 143516
Errr? Gear tractor = fun.
Hydro + mo' money over gear = fun (an' no pain) ....
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| hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 3583 iowa
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2007-07-08 143518
Just need 2 more hours on the loader then the knee will loosen up and be back in shape. You ain't gonna win this one EW. Gears are for real tractors. I'm sure itchin for an argument today for some reason, the heat I guess. Frank. ....
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 | kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2007-07-08 143519
I like gears but if I had to use 'em all day long trying to maneuver in around trees and other tight areas my knee would hurt too. Plus, the doc says clutching is bad for your back. Take it up with my doc Frank :) ....
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 | candoarms
Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1932 North Dakota 
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2007-07-09 143525
Frank,
Maybe by the time you read this, you won't be much in the mood for fight'n no more. hehehe.
You wrote, "Gears are for real tractors". I couldn't agree with you more, sir.
However, there are some mighty big "real tractors" that have hydrostatic transmissions, and they do some "real" work.
As a kid, I operated a hydrostatic International when baling hay. There is one pile of stop-and-go work involved in the making of hay bales. The hydro makes this work feel more like play. But that same tractor would also be used to pick those bales out of the field and place them on a truck. For this work, we used a loader and a grapple. NOTHING can compare to the hydro transmission, when it comes to doing a whole lot of loader work.
There's no fight coming from me. You're right. But, there's a whole lot of work to be done that can't be done so well with a real tractor.
Joel ....
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| hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 3583 iowa
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2007-07-09 143526
Candarms; Whatever year the 656 hydro came out my Uncle bought one, so that as kind of the family baler tractor. We had an IH #46 baler behind it. My Uncle milked 80-90 Holsteins, and we had a beef cow herd and all of us fed cattle, so LOTS of hay was baled. I had a new 656 gear drive a late 65 model and Uncle's Hydro was what ever year the Hydros came out. Both were gas engines. Gasoline was around 30-32 cents and after you got your gas tax refund back the gas really cost about .16-.18 cents per gallon, so not much concern was given to gallons per hour. On the baler the Hydro was neat in one way in another it was a hazzard. I like milloins other farm boys of that era have loaded a milloin square bales on the rack towed behind the baler. Working on a hay rack loading bales you liked a constant travel speed to keep your ballance, we learned real quick to NOT let an inexperienced person operate the Hydro on the baler because they couldn't keep their hand off the hydro lever and were constantly throwing you off ballance, so great on a baler, yes and no. We finally put my gear drive back on and ran in second just for that reason. Baling on the ground it would have been better with the Hydro, but we just did'nt do that, too much risk of rain before you got them picked up. We really did'nt calculate the fuel cost per hour to precisely in those days but the Hydro on drawbar work was like a size smaller tractor compared to my gear drive and took gas like it was free, so Uncle traded the "OIL JOB" as he called it for an 706 when they came out. Hodro's I'm, sure have been improved far as being more fuel effecient than they were then, but I just got a sour taste for Hydros back then and never liked them since. I owned Hydro combines since the 70's my last one was a 9610 Deere, the hydro was great, on a lawn mower they are great. I'd never owned a pickup with an automatic till the one I have now, an 07 Silvearado and almost hate the thing. I just like gears period. Another factor you have to consider is being from North Dakota you likely have lots of neighbors who are like me still 100% German. Germans are NOT stubborn, they are determined. Hope I haven't ruined your day with all my rambling on and on over sometning that really doesn't amount to a hill of beans. You like hydros, buy one. I like gears, I'll buy another one. (Next pickup for sure). Frank. ....
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| candoarms
Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1932 North Dakota
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2007-07-09 143531
Frank,
I will NEVER own another pickup with an automatic transmission. NEVER! Gears are the way to go when pulling heavy loads. I believe the automatic transmission was made for the city-slickers, who are caught in traffic jams 4 hours each day. The automatic transmission was never meant to be a heavy puller.......but that doesn't prevent those city-slicker engineers from trying to build a better mouse trap.
I can honestly say that I have never tried to plow a field or do any summer fallow work with a hydro tractor. Those tractors aren't made for pulling all day long.
I used an old Minneapolis "U" for pulling a cultivator. (It had a hand clutch, and I sat WAY OUT behind the danged thing) My grandfather (an old German) used his International 4100 for the real heavy work, and it had gears.
My uncle was one of the first in the area to switch over to the new round bale system, when the big round balers first came out. Those big round bales weighed in at somewhere around 1800 pounds each. Even so, it doesn't take long to make a bale. When the baler is full, we stop the tractor, wrap the bale with twine, tie it off, and then dump the bale out the rear. In order to do this, you first have to back up a bit, so that you can pick up where you left off. This involves a lot of stopping, backing, and switching gears. But, with the hydro, this isn't a problem at all.
I'll leave you to dwell on this mental picture.........
Imagine a skid steer tractor with a gear shift transmission in it. NOW THAT JUST AIN'T RIGHT!
And now imagine a motorcycle with an automatic tranny!
Oh boy.....I hope I didn't give our engineers any goofy ideas!
Have a great day, Sir.
Joel......German.....with about a fifth of Scot in me. (Not scotch....Scot!)
....
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 | Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2007-07-09 143536
Joel, not to start any arguements here, but a couple of your statements seem a little less than 'right'... ;)
"The automatic transmission was never meant to be a heavy puller......." Do you know that a VERY large number of semi-trucks built today are equipped with an AUTOMATIC transmission? They are capable of as much load as any gear unit. Same goes for most off-road construction equipment, loaders, off-road dumps, especially mine pit trucks, including the worlds biggest trucks, the minig haulers, all equipped with a hydro. drive unit.
"I can honestly say that I have never tried to plow a field or do any summer fallow work with a hydro tractor. Those tractors aren't made for pulling all day long.", some of the first commercially available hydro farm tractors were the very popular Red ones, many of them are still in daily use as primary tillage machines. We had one at our farm for many years and it pulled as good (or better in certain conditions) than a gear tractor would.
In short I think it has more to do with personal preferance than suitability.
Best of luck. ....
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 | Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2007-07-10 143585
My best thoughts on gear to hydro and hydro to gear.
Pto, loader, direction change, hydro one size larger tractor then gear!
Deep tillage, plowing, ground engaging, hydro one tractor size smaller.
Way to move the largest possible load with out wheel spin, hydro. ....
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| praha4752
Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 68
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2007-07-17 143782
Yeah, knee pain did not go away, and gear grinding became annoying.......next one will be hydro./I am affraid there's no such thing like the next tractor... I'd like to trade this one in right the way and get hydro, but I'd lose my pants and a divorce procedures would kick in...lol
Joe ....
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