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 07-11-2006, 22:05 Post: 132031
kirbygiampa



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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

Deere 4115 with 46BH and FEL. I would like to add a PHD to make 42" deap 8" holes in clay soil with minimal rocks.

I have read down-presure is key. Should I get a 3PH Auger or one that attaches the BH or FEL?

thanks Kirby






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 07-11-2006, 22:49 Post: 132032
DRankin



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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

Sooo... Did you close the deal on the 4115?

As far as I know, the only viable option for a PHD is the three point. It's the only place you can get an unobstructed shot at a drive shaft to run the thing.

I never had much luck with my PHD and sold it, but I have really strange soils..... loose beach type sand over concrete-like hard-pan.

I would bet someone with clay soil can offer some insight for you. Right off hand I would think that a properly sharpened auger bit would work its way though the soil you describe with no extra down pressure.






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 07-12-2006, 03:51 Post: 132035
kirbygiampa



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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

I have paid for th used 4115, but waiting for the BH and FEL to come in and get installed.

I saw some options for PHD that attach to the BH or FEL and use hydr. The 4115 has about 5gpm so that is on the low end for most of the PHD.

The 3pt PHD seem to be more moderately priced. I am trying to find a used one since my use will be minimal. I have used the PHD on a Bobcat and it was awesome. I would not expect the same of the CUT.






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 07-12-2006, 07:03 Post: 132038
kthompson



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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

kirby,

Have used 3 pt PHD on soils with different amount of clay with good results. Of course clay varies. Unless it is bone dry or sticky wet would not expect any real problem. Be sure the point is good on the auger and no root or grass or such covering the cutting edge.

I guess you could always add weight to the 3 pt PHD for down force. Just wonder if you were exerting much down force would your auger remain vertical. It seems it might want to lay over on you. May be enough to affect you.

Depending on how often you will use one you may find rental an option.

Have never used a hyd PHD but assume they will reverse, so if you have roots or such that might be an advantage. As has been discussed before, I would stay away from high rpms on post hole digger if there are tree roots or rocks in your ground.






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 07-12-2006, 08:14 Post: 132039
Murf



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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

A hydraulically driven PHD is a *lot* more money than it's PTO-driven cousin.

We use the hyd. version commercially for two reasons, time is money, and versatility, it can be used with anything capable of producing the required hydraulic flow, and lifting and lowering it.

The ability to use downforce and reverse are huge benefits in some instances.

Kenneth is right, the tip and cutting teeth are critical in clay, without a good set, you might as well be using a teaspoon.

The other item that comes to my mind is your description of the holes themselves, 8" x 42" deep? What do you need such holes for? Frost doesn't really affect posts, and in most cases 24" down will hold up an awfull ot of post.

Best of luck.






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 07-12-2006, 08:35 Post: 132041
HuckMeat

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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

Your mileage may vary, I found that the 3 point PHD was worthless in my soil and sold it. I would look at a unit that mounted to the backhoe or loader - You can get ones with a gear drive between the hydraulic motor and the auger to give you a little more margin with limited GPM.

I now borrow my neighbors skidsteer and PHD; Although I'm casually looking for a new one (hyd) for my 4330.

I have a backhoe, 12" bucket, but to do post holes with it you end up disturbing a 14" x 20" area, which makes for not good post holes.






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 07-12-2006, 16:27 Post: 132066
kthompson



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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

Does the hyd augers the power companies use have down force on them? Some don't look like they do, others I suspect could.






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 07-13-2006, 08:28 Post: 132089
Murf



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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

The biggest mis-conception people have about a hyd. PHD is that it is some special beast. In fact, almost any PHD can be easily converted to hyd. drive instead of PTO.

If you look at the input shaft of the gearbox on almost every PHD you will see a square'ish flat face perpendicular to the shaft, with (usually) 4 threaded holes in a square pattern around the shaft. This conforms to an industry standard pattern in size & shape, in fact it is the same as the couplers used to bolt a hyd. pump to a small engine for making a hyd. power pack, such as for a log splitter. You then need only to match up the hyd. ability of the tractor, and the power req. of the PHD with a suitable hyd. motor, and a 3 piece linkage to join the two shafts (gearbox & motor) together. It is a pair of steel pieces that lock onto each shaft that look sort of like gears, and a rubber block that goes betweeen them to isolate vibration and introduce a bit of cushion between them.

Generally it costs $300-$500 to convert a PTO driven PHD to hyd. drive. You then merely need to make a mount to hang it from whatever point you want.

Kenneth, yes, all of the truck-mounted augers have down-pressure, and lots of it too.

Best of luck.






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 07-13-2006, 10:43 Post: 132099
hardwood

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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

HuckMeat; I never had much luck with post hole augers. it seemed like about every other hole I drilled that a tree root, a rock or something gave me a hard time, so I thought I had died and gone to heaven when I got the backhoe and started using it for postholes. If I hadn't already sold it I would almost give you the auger I had just to get it out of my sight. Frank.






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 07-13-2006, 18:16 Post: 132114
earthwrks

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 Post Hole with Backhoe or Loader

I've used a 3pt PHD on my 33hp NH with excellent results in clay soils and went down 48" for signage posts for an apartment complex. At 8" diameter roots didn't pose a problem, but I lucked out and didn't come across many. The unit was a good brand name and wa well balanced and weighed enough that down pressure wasn't a concern. What is a concern was if you go to deep, too quick---or if it cathces a rock or root, there is a chance you'll scfew it right into the ground. And since you can't reverse it you'll need to have another larger machine lift it out or disconnect the auger and using a pipe wrench and a long pipe manually reverse it out. The key is drill down in small increments pulling it up and out to shed the spoils. That lessens getting it stuck in the hole. Also upgrading to a heavier-duty auger bit with replaceable teeth will cost more but last forever.

Even though my skid steer hydraulic auger has 1,700 lb-ft. of torque, I can stall it on larger roots (running a 24" diameter drill) but I can usually reverse it and chop them up, then run it forward. This is effective for chopping up bricks and concrete in the way too---that's what's nice about having an extreme-duty drill--don't have worry about destroying the drill.

Another option is to rent a walk-behind or ride-on rubber tracked skid steer like a Toro Dingo that Home Depot rents; they have auger attachments for them amongst other ones.






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Discussion Boards > Active Subjects > Messages as Posted > Tractor Implements Forum

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