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 12-24-2006, 11:27 Post: 138326
hardwood

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I have a 46X46 frame shed with 14 ft. 6 in. clearance floor to ceiling. My dream is to install a 46X28 self suporting second floor with aprox. an 8 ft. floor level above the current cement floor. I tried the forks on my 4310 this morning, they don't quite reach 7 ft. so that won't work to get things up there, I used to have a real moose of a Clark all terain forklift that went 21 ft. high, I sold it but it would be far too clumbsy for use in tight quarters anyway. Several neighbors have bought used smaller lift trucks that sometimes start sometimes not and allways leeak on the floor. I have to share this shed with my wife who keeps her high dollar John Deere lawn toys there and me having an old smoking sputtering oil leaking thing in there would knock this whole deal dead in it's tracks, so that is kinda out. Now to the meat of my question has anyone ever did such a thing as I'm dreaming of and used some sort of an elevater system maybe a converted car hiost with a floor on it type deal capable of lifting a ton or so to drive like the Gator, lawn tractors on to lift them to winter storage, plus sit pallets of lumber and misc. stuff on then lift them up to use a hand pallet fork to move them around upstairs. I've built heavy duty second levels in shops before but never with an elevator system. Any Ideas. Thanks in advance. Frank.






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 12-24-2006, 15:24 Post: 138329
Peters

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 Loft in shed

I have had second levels in shops at work but we always had a fork lift. Good question.
Alternatives:
1) trade the 4310 in on a slightly larger unit. 5-6K
2) Buy a 3pt fork lift attachment 1.5 -2.5K
3) Buy an old fork lift 1.5-3K oily mess
4) Buy used electric fork lift 3-6 K
5) Buy a car lift and use it to raise to new level 3-4.5K

I guess 2 on the money. Number five on utility if you like to work on cars.






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 12-24-2006, 19:42 Post: 138332
earthwrks

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You're probabaly gonna end up with what's called a two-post lift rated well over 2K, and big enough to store a car on. I've seen them in magazines for less than a grand. Beter have the concrete floor beefed up (read: designed to handle load) though.






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 12-24-2006, 22:51 Post: 138334
kentfield



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I made a platform just over 1 foot high with ramp on one side drive up on the platform and the forks reach second floor them put the platform back out side






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 12-25-2006, 10:51 Post: 138336
Peters

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OK Ken now we are starting to brain storm.

6) Metal platform and ramp. $500?

EW I have never seen the lifts that low in price, but if you can get them down that far? I am not sure you could drive off the 2 legged lift at heighth, you are placing a lot of weight at the edge. I think the lifts are designed to have the weight near the center?






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 12-25-2006, 11:17 Post: 138338
earthwrks

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Peters I wasn't sure if he was driving off the lif and omto the loft or mezzanine. So no, the two poster nor the 4-poster would work for one reason (aside from the lifts not being designed for rolling weight: momentum. Any rolling weight on the platform that has to accelerate either on or off the paltform will tend to collapse the lift unless heavily braced against the torque. Then the other question is: how the heck are you going to build a cost-effective loft or mezzanine to support not only its own weight but other stuff? 3/4" just ain't gonna do it even on 12" centers IMHO. Going back to the lift thingy, I was visting a friend in elevated home here on the coast. It's up on 8" sq. x 10' pilings--about 20 of them. I'm sitting at the kitchen table while my buddy closes the frig door and walks fast about 4 feet and stops abruptly and went back (forgot his beer)---like anyone would do. Once he stopped the entire house shook and swayed back and forth. And that's what's possible with a lift and/or loft if not designed and built properly to support alot of weight.






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 12-25-2006, 18:18 Post: 138340
hardwood

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Hey, sounds like I really got the old wheels turning for me. That was my goal to get some thoughts kicked around. Now I'll be a bit more specific on the construcion details. I was probably a bit misleading on the self supporting comment, so here goes. Plan is to place three rows of 7ft. tall salvaged 8X8 barn beams, four per row, one row down each side of the 46 ft. sides spaced 11.5 ft. apart and the third row down the center to support 12 in.X whatever thickness required of those manufactured lamanated beams made out of like 1/8 thick strips glued together for headers above garage doors, etc.(I can't remember what they call them), but I've used them before and they are incredibly strong. Ok, four of those beams will span the 28 ft. width with a center 8X8 post for a 14 ft. support beam span. Between these four beams wiil be three sets of 2X10 joists spaced 16in. O.C. fastened to the laminated beams with heavy duty joist hangers for an aprox joist span of 11 ft. Then this topped with 3/4 ply, not OSB. I'm open to any ideas on a lift system, I only mentioned the car hoist thing as that was the first thing popped into my mind. I do understand the problem of stoping stored kinetic energy in a moving object like a gator or mower, that energy has to be transpfered to somewhere when the object stops. Don't be gentle about any critisims, I'd rather be corrected now than have a hoist or a loft collapse. Thanks again, Frank.






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 12-25-2006, 19:17 Post: 138341
earthwrks

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Frank I'd be tempted to make a mock-up loft floor with a piece of plywood supported between two 2x4's--I think you'll be surprised...err...disappointed how much it deflects--even just standing on it, let alone a 2000lb. Gator.

Angle bracing from the posts to the floor is imperative to reduce wracking. I feel the floor might need two layers of 3/4"--just my opinion.

You must be a rich man to afford those lam-beams, eh?

You might want to consider metal web (all angle or angle with rod webs) trusses. Sometimes you can get them from old farms or commercial demolitions for just taking them down. And they're relatively light enough to put up with a tractor loader. And they'll span farther than the lam-beams. If they're not the right size you can modify them easily--though a purist (and a lawyer) would say they have a designed-in crown and shouldn't be modified. If they're too long to drag home cut 'em in half and weld them back together (consult an engineer buddy for the wisest way).

The other way of making that floor is use the steel trusses and lay down corrugated metal, and pour mesh-reinforced lightweight concrete down like what is used in commercial applications.






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 12-26-2006, 09:56 Post: 138344
kthompson



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Hardwood,
I do not see where you are wanting to store large items there. It seems you are thinking on items small enough for your tractor to lift. In saying that, just storing paper really adds up in weight. If you are wanting to store small items you can tote or use a hand truck to move, how about an electric lift with a metal basket with a side that opens. You could set up posts to guide it so it would not swing.

EW could be more right on the floor needed than you think.






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 12-26-2006, 18:04 Post: 138348
hardwood

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Lots of interesting ideas, 1) The angle iron zig zag rod type beams, I have saw those in salvage yards, I don't remember what the lam beams I bought a couple years ago cost, but the used steel likely would be lots less. Good idea, I'll call around a bit. 2) I would have some fairly heavy items, Gator, 345 lawn tractor, Wife's lawn toys, (thatchers, seeders, lawn plug thing, and whatever else Deere built in that category). 3) palets of hardwood lumber, usually in 8-10ft. lengths. 4) Several 8ft. long pegion hole parts bins, backhow buckets, frost hook, etc. This boils down to needing a pretty hefty hoist of some sort, seems like I remember seeing some pretty hefty electric winch type hoists in the Surplus Center catalog, I'll dig out my catalog and have a look. Any other Ideas are welcome. Thanks. Frank.






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