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Gator 620i gas in engine oil

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rpfeffer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 19 USA
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2010-02-10          168497


I bought a JD gator 620i in 11/07. I am having trouble with gas in the oil.I have not had much success with yhe dealer.I know there are other people having this problem,any ideas

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kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2010-02-10          168499


I do not know the gator but I'll throw out a couple of ideas from past experience.

If it has a mechanical fuel pump and the diaphragm ruptures they might leak fuel into the crankcase (depending on design).

If it has a gravity feed tank and the needle-and-seat does not seal properly fuel might leak into the crankcase when the fuel bowl overflows (typical Honda small engine problem).
....

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rpfeffer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 19 USA
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2010-02-11          168513


This engine has fuel injection and fuel tank is below the engine. ....

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gatoraider
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 540 Maryland
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2010-02-11          168518


I think there is a post on here somewhere that deals with your problem. If I remember correctly I think they replaced the computer or the throttle body. Ask your dealer if there is a bulliten on it, I know I've seen it on here. ....

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AllisMan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 6 Horseheads, NY
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2010-02-12          168550


There is no O2 sensor, so injection is preprogrammed. If you do a lot of starting and stopping of engine or prolonged idling, you will wash down the cylinders getting fuel in the oil. Know problem, but they may not admit it. I've seen up to a pint/month!!!! with lots of starting and stopping. Dealer will tell you to run it hard and change oil frequently! ....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2010-02-12          168552


AllisMan;
I haven't noticed a problem yet with out XUV 620i. It varys from a hard couple hours to a five minute run to the mailbox. I'm kind of a wacko when it comes to oil and filter changes on small equipment like mowers, Gators and the like. Probably none of them run more than 25-30 hours between changes, so if I do have a gas in the oil problenm I just never knew it. My reasoning is that with Gators and mowers easily topping ten grand I don't mind a ten dollar oil and filter change that might add up to 40 or 50 bucks a year. I know they have good air filter systems but most of those little engines sit right down where all the dirt gets to them. ....

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pontpines
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 3 Northern NY
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2010-03-02          168927


I have a 620i bought 5/08 135hrs on it , sent to dealer this week after I could not diagnose RPM loss. Dealer advises needs motor overhaul& advises caused by idling or frequent on / off motor not geting up to temperature. Neither cause applies though! Technically out of warranty but this is not a $2000 chinese POS knock off, dealer is contacting JDeere regional mgr. Will post further... ....

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Gator 620i gas in engine oil

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AllisMan
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 6 Horseheads, NY
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2010-03-03          168949


Like I said...:( It's frustrating. I have a 620i with 60 hrs...same issue. You would expect this from a POS Kymco! ....

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greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2010-03-03          168951


What kind of fuel pump delivers gasoline to the fuel injection? I know a lot of these Gators have Kawasaki engines, and I have a Kawasaki 430cc V-twin with a vacuum type fuel pump that I have to replace about every 18 months due to a perforated diaphragm. Dang thing is a sealed unit, so the whole bloody pump has to be replaced. Vacuum to the pump comes from the crankcase. Once perforated, fuel goes two ways; via normal line to the intake, PLUS back down the vacuum line and into the crankcase.

If this machine does not however have a vacuum type, disregard.

//greg// ....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2010-03-03          168962


As I said in a prior post I likely change oil too often to catch the problem if I do have it.
I've been greener than a tree hugger for the past 20-25 yrs. more because of the dealership than to make the Deere quarterly report look good. But as has been said this isn't a cheap Chineese POS knock off, Deere is supposed to be somewhat of a standard of quality, which they have been in most but not all things they have built.
From as many reports as I have seen and heard about with this problem Deere does need to approach this as something of a their fault issue rather than always a customer fault issue. I don't feel real happy with a 12 grand supposed to be a standard of the industry machine in my shed that may need an engine at 300 hours.
You guys with the known problem I urge to put the squirm on Deere and keep us up to speed. ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2010-09-20          174106


Anymore info on this problem. I have a 09 620I with less than 40 hours on it with gas in the oil. It had it the first 10hrs also but did not check the level, just drained VERY thin oil. Mine got so full in the crank case it started smoking and missing till it burned some off. Is JD still passing this off on the customer or are they standing behind there product?

Just got mine back from the dealer for this problem and they gave me the same story everybody else is getting about not getting it up to operating temp. I am a mechanic and this is complete BS. I seen another posting where a dealer told someone they had to much idle time. My dealer told me I should leave it run as apposed to shutting off and re-starting. As a matter of fact I brought in with 37 hrs on it and they put 10 hrs on it letting it idle at the dealer to do their test which are BS. I have a shed full of green but it's going orange if they do not stand behind this. I'm surprised there is not a class action on this, as you all have said this is supposed to be the best equipment out there, lord knows we all paid to have the best. But now it looking like I have a $12k POS in the shed with no fix for it except get rid of it. ....

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gatoraider
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 540 Maryland
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2010-09-22          174130


I think AllisMan has the problem diagnosed, but getting an O2 sensor on an XUV is out of the question. There must be another variable in there also because some are way worse than others. I have experimented with my XUV and put a piece of cardboard totally over the front of the radiator. I don't use mine to do any heavy work, just riding around, but I have yet to have the cooling fan come on. I believe the cooling system is overkill and won't let the coolant get hot enough to let the heater work properly let alone turn the fan on. I think total blockage could be tempered with partial blockage according to work load, but I think there needs to be some restriction to get some heat in the motor, which Deere is telling you to do in the first place. I know if mine ever got hot enough to turn the fan on I would have to cut a small hole in the cover ( cardboard ) to let the fan do it's job. Maybe another idea would be to turn the heater fan on high and see if that would cool it down. Oh yes, I have tried my fan in a closed situation and it does work. I have changed my oil also. I detected a gasoline odor and the oil was brownish, but the viscosity did not seem to be compromised. ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2010-09-22          174131


You've put a lot of time in to this. I'm a mechanic myself, and personally believeknow the line of BS JD is giving us about all cold gas engines put fuel in the oil is total crap. My biggest concern is not that there is a problem with the gator it is how JD is not stepping up to fix it or at least help out there customers that have basically spent around $12K for something that is not going to last. Personally I'm so angry with JD right now I'm trading in everything I have green on orange. I'm going to take a pounding on the gator since I only bought it 9 months ago, but it's take it now or take later. I've talked to customer service to just try and get a good amount of money back on the 620I to trade up to the 820 diesel but they say they can not do anything. I was going to trade in my 4520 open cab for a 4720 closed cab but now I'm going to trade it in on a Kubota. I'm at a loss on how this whole thing is being treated, you would think there will be a class action law suite for this. I know I'm just one little peon customer and there is really nothing I can do to JD, but that being said my shed has always been full of green, everything from the gator to ride mowers, zero turns and tractors. Up until now everything has been great and I've been proud to be a JD ownercustomer. But from the way this going down I will not buy even a JD hat after this and it's really sad, you try to buy American "and I know this is a Kawasaki engine" but the way this being handled is terrible.

Good luck with yours, hopefully you or someone can figure out and inexpensive fix. Me personally, I'm washing my hands of the whole company at my expense.
....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2010-09-23          174140


So far mine hasn't been a problem, but as I said before I'm kind of a wacko on frequent oil changes on small engines. All our small equipment is water cooled. As an exapmle our 345 riders that get "rode hard and put away wet" so to speak get an oil and filter change at 50 hrs. instead of the OM recommendation of 100 hrs. 4310 tractor 50 hrs. instead of 100, the 620I 25 hrs. It does get used hard enough to have the fan kick on, but also maybe 50% of the hrs. are mailbox time. so far I haven't noticed a fuel smell from the drain oil.
I'm not totally up on the workings of the 620I cooling system but my assumptions are that coolant flow from the engine is controlled by a thermostat at the engine coolant outlet. Ok now another assumption. The 620I has a pretty small coolant capacity in the engine block and heads, the long hoses to the front of the Gator plus the capacity of the radiator probasbly hold 75-80% of all the coolant involved. I don't know what the temperature of the coolant should be when it re enters the engine from the radiator and hoses. My guess is that by the time the coolant gets back to the engine it is too cold to keep the block warm enough to have a proper operating temperature.
When we farmed we had a lot of late model high hp. Deere equipment, when you have a lot of equipment there will be problems regardless of the color. I can think of a couple times when a problem came up that wasn't casused by improper use, I pled my case to the dealer and big daddy Deere in rational terms. Once Deere did fix it and extended the warranty to five years, the problem didn't reoccur. Another time Deere as it appears they're doing with the Gators kinda gave me the brush off so the dealer kicked in and took care of it at his, (not small) expense, that's why to this day thye're the only dealership I do business with. There are lots of other good dealerships around regardless of color who likely would have did the same, but that builds customer loyalty.
Frank. ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2010-09-23          174141


I wish your dealer was near me. I had a pretty good relationship with the local dealer, all though it was just me buying equipment not having any problems. I guess when you have problems is when you find out just how good of a relationship you have. The dealer I purchase my gator, 4520 and zero turn from has since sold out to new owners and is not going well. That being said I have found a good dealer a few miles further away and they have done more for me with this gator than the dealer I purchased it from.

As far as my gator goes I had excessive gas in the oil the 1st 10hrs but did not realize it at the time when I changed the oil. I myself own and run a repair shop and understand everybody makes mistakes and has problems. To me what makes good customer relations it how you handle the problem and take care of the customer when it happens "and don't have to many problems". I have read the bulletin that JD put out on this problem and for the most part it is total BS. Basically according to there bulletin every time you start up a gas engine "they may of said liquid cooled" you have to keep running it until it heats up to operating temp so that all the gas that got down in the crank case while it was cold will evaporate and vent out. They also said gas has a shelf life of 30 days and old gas will increase the problem, I personally work in the petroleum industry and I no gas over time will get stale but 30 days.

I guess a long story short is they have a problem with there product, there not owning up to it and there problem is going to cost me money. The new JD dealer I'm talking to offered me 8K for my 620I to trade up to a 820 diesel. So that would mean it cost me $100 an hour to run my gator over the last 10 months. There is not much I can do but take my little bit of business away from JD and just hope if I go Kubota there product is quality and where it's not they stand behind it. To me that is how all businesses should run. ....

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Gator 620i gas in engine oil

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2010-09-23          174142


Ejack;
I'm by no means defending Deere, I own no stock etc. and knowing that others have had the Gator oil issue that the have more or less said too bad buy a new engine doesn't build my loyalty with me to to Deere only to the dealer I work with. Unless they do make good to the owners of the bad 620I's I'll have a hard time recommending one to anybody who asks.
This dealership does have one of the largest small equipment sales in the aeria and has sold lots of Gators, the service manager tells me they had only one so far with the oil problem.
Sometimes I think a lazy dealeship who don't want to make waves, or doesn't have the guts to buck the manufacturer will just pass a customer off with lame excuses rather than ruffle any feathers that may infuence their "Dealer Of the Year" award. I've always felt my dealer did what he could for me but I've also have never been afraid to find the custopmer relations phone and sorta go direct to the ones who can if they choose correct your problem, so even tho you have found a more helpfull dealer don't hesitate to go direct to the ones who may have the ultimate power to help you.
Just as an unrelated example the picture windows in our house are Andersen brand. Roughly about 7-8 years after the house was built the seal between the inner and outer glass failed letting moisture between. I contactd the lumber yard where we got all the materials for the house. The manager whom I've known and did 98% of all my lumber business with for the past 30 years. His response was that if he or anyone from the yard calls Andersen they just more or less say too bad sell em some new ones. His experience had been that if the cunsumer, (me) called Andersen direct that they usually come across with some help. It took only one phone call describing our problem, the age of the windows, etc., no hjassle whatever. The person whom I spoke with said if you will pay the instalation costs, about 150.00 I think the new windows will cost you nothing. Done deal. ....

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MrChris
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 19 Georgia
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2010-09-23          174144


Ejack, I feel your pain. It makes no sense to pay more for a brand name and then don't get brand name satsfaction. I must warn you though, I have seen several threads on different forums that have discussed problems with Kubota to the point where people don't want them anymore: RTV 500s(weak power in high gear, slows to a crawl up a slight grade) and RTV 900s(rough gear shifting, have to turn off engine to shift)L3400s(jerky 3 pt lifting) just to name three and Kubotas response has been very similar to Deeres: nothing they can do about it or worse: user error! So, before you throw in the towel I would suggest you keep at it with Deere about some resolution, especially if you've been happy with your other Deere equipment. Good Luck. PS. The gas engines on the new XUVs are made in China (maybe the old ones were too)...not that there's anything wrong with that.:) ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2010-09-23          174145


I appreciate all the comments and advise. I have talked to JD customer service, they escalated it to a supervisor who contacted the dealer that I purchased it from and also had taken it to for the problem. I told them I did not want to debate the problems and or the cause of the problem "getting back to JD's bulletin of BS on the problem". All I want was a fair trade in value for my 10 month old gator and I would pay for an upgrade to the the diesel model. That sounds more than fair to me, they told me there was nothing they could do. As of right now the new dealer I'm talking with has a call in to his regional JD guy to see if he can get him to help with trade in value. The one catch to that is I"m looking to trade in my 3 year old open cab 4520 with backhoe and loader for new 4720 cab tractor with backhoe and loader, about a 28K upgrade. I told the salesman if they won't do anything with the gator I'm not buying another JD tractor. So unfortunately at the end of the day if they do help me out on the gator it won't be about doing whats right it will be about getting more money. I really don't want to change to Kubota but it will more or less be out of spite, right or wrong. Getting a Kubota tractor doesn't bother me much, but as the 1 posting said, I have a friend with a diesel Kubota RTV, I did not like it. So as of right now I'm so mad at JD I could spit "or worse", but I got to make sure I don't go from one bad deal to another. ....

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pepperman
Join Date: Dec 2010
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2010-12-24          175929


I have 2 620i's one is a 07 the other is a 09. The kids and myself run the 07 hard , it has over 500 hrs on it and have'nt had any problems yet "knock on wood" except a brake line rubbed a hole in a boot,came from factory with wrong brake line on back. The 09 on the other is apparently junk. My parents are in thier late 70's and i let them use it around the farm , they do let it idle alot. After 22hrs i had the first fuel pump put on, 61hrs had another,101hrs had another. Its doing it again now and dealer said he had no answers. I finally told them they were a bunch of idiots. This has cost several $ and John Deere will not stand behind thier equipment. 'so why should we'. ....

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rpfeffer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 19 USA
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2010-12-24          175936


I have figured mine out finally.I have a factory cab and heater and during the winters the water capacity is more and it has too much cooling capacity, I have put a temp gauge in the water hose and now I monitor the temp and every time I run this I make sure the temp gets at least to 130.I have also put cardboard in front of radiator.This gets me through the winter and summer is no problem.The heater is a bad design.R pfeffer ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2010-12-27          175962


Don't take this wrong but what you found is a way around the problem. We bought our Gator to use around the farm and for hunting "which is what I thought they were made for". Some days thats working it hard, pulling equipment around and running it for long periods of time, but more times than not it just riding back and forth to the barn which is about 800 yards one way. My gator is putting gas in the oil so fast that with in 20 hours of an oil change it is about a 1/2" to 1" over full. JD says all gas engines put gas in the oil when they are cold and then they burn it off when they heat up. The dealer told me they had this problem with I think he said the 90's gator. I had a 2X4 gator before this one and all we did with that was drive back and forth to the barn it never got worked hard "no suspension had no choice". Obviously all gas engines don't do it. Sad to see JD not standing behind this and now I see from the other posting not standing behind a fuel pump issue. I wonder if they have lemon laws on UTV's. Hell they cost as much as some cars. ....

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gatoraider
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 540 Maryland
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2010-12-27          175963


Gentlemen, Allisman figured it out a year or so ago. The motor has no O2 sensor so the computer dumps gas in there at the same rate all the time. How can a fuel injected motor operate properly without an oxygen sensor? It can't. Deere isn't going to retro fit every XUV with a computer, O2 sensor and wiring harness to fix the problem. So they make up lies to try and appease the poor owners that are complaining. They made a mistake and are not owning up to it, or making any attempt to really fix it. If you have an XUV,cover the radiator up until the red light comes on then uncover it a little bit. Mine is almost completely covered and the fan doesn't even come on. ....

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ejack11
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Posts: 15 Virginia
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2010-12-27          175964


I don't quit get that because you want more fuel when it's cold and leaned out as it heats up. With out the O2 it defently can't adjust to be efficent but I would think the problem with that would show up once it got hot. Maybe it just compensates off of engine temp richer cold than leans out when hot. Don't know how they do it or try to do it. I just had mine back to the dearler, they changed the oil and tweaked on the fuel. I can tell they leaned it way out, it almost cuts off when cold but doesn't. Hopfully this will help, they did give me the extended 2yr warranty but only because I bought a tractor. ....

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gatoraider
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 540 Maryland
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2010-12-27          175965


What you say makes sense. I think the problem is when the motor is warm and not to the hot stage, that could be where the sensors are. If the sensors think the motor is still cool they will keep it rich. I think an O2 sensor would cut back on the fuel in this range. I know there are other sensors on it. The main problem is the motor never heats up. I just don't think Deere did enough testing before they put it in a Gator. ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2010-12-27          175966


I guess the biggest problem here is JD's lack of concern or action to make it better. I know it's been said somewhere in this string, when you buy JD you pay top dollar for what is suppossed to be the best. I have a 4720 tractor and a zero turn that I love. I actually love the gator minus the problem. It's just big business and bean counting - it will cost them less money to piss off and loss some customers than it would to admit a problem and correct it. Sad but true. ....

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pontpines
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 3 Northern NY
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2010-12-27          175967


Main problem is ethanol in your gas and aluminum block causing wsahing in cylinder. Chnage oil& filter frequently, use ethanol treatment in your gas. If problem does not resolve you will probably have to havecylinder rebored & go to bigger piston. Upside is more power down side is that unfortunatly your machine is no longer under warranty ....

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ezdarin
Join Date: Dec 2010
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2010-12-27          175979


People do occasionally have this problem, the issue is the programming in the ECU. They (Kawi) have to make it rich when the engine is cold to promote engine idling and acceleration. They are sure that 10% fuel in the oil is acceptable and will not affect the engines life. It is most often caused by prolonged running at low temperatures. Take it out and exercise it more often. You will enjoy it so will your Gator! ....

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gator2times
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 14 North Texas
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2011-03-06          177222


I have had three of the older style gators..the 6X4 mods NOT fuel injected but all had this problem. Newist one is a TH 2005 air cooled engine and it was the worst( gas in the oil ) The way I use them is short distance and shut off. We use them to work on the rancho here and this is how it is.

This problem used to drive me nuts and I always got the same BS from any JD guy I talked to about the problem.

This is what I surmised as the problem and solution for me.. 1 engine card set way too rich and not burning all of the fuel if the motor does not warm up. ( for years we just drove around with a set of spark plugs and a plug wrench in the glove compartment, develop ear for fouling plugs, change back plug frequently and check and change oil frequently.

however about two years ago I though about using the new spark plugs developed for ethenal fuels. SIGNIFICANT IMPROVEMNT. I wouldn't say the problem is solved but it is much better. We still drive aaround with spark plugs but the incidence of replacement is much less and I don't seem to be getting gas in the oil unless someone else drives it that is totally tone deaf and too lazy to replace the plugs. The plugs I am using are the NGK Ridium 6441. you may need a different plug for your engine. The plugs I buy are around $7 each so I bought a plug cleaner from HF much happier now...

However the reason I am on this board was to research the fuel injected gators... thinking maybe they would not have this problem. Boy was I wrong...

....

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gator2times
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 14 North Texas
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2011-03-06          177223


I have had three of the older style gators..the 6X4 mods NOT fuel injected but all had this problem. Newist one is a TH 2005 air cooled engine and it was the worst( gas in the oil ) The way I use them is short distance and shut off. We use them to work on the rancho here and this is how it is.

This problem used to drive me nuts and I always got the same BS from any JD guy I talked to about the problem.

This is what I surmised as the problem and solution for me.. 1 engine card set way too rich and not burning all of the fuel if the motor does not warm up. ( for years we just drove around with a set of spark plugs and a plug wrench in the glove compartment, develop ear for fouling plugs, change back plug frequently and check and change oil frequently.

however about two years ago I though about using the new spark plugs developed for ethenal fuels. SIGNIFICANT IMPROVEMNT. I wouldn't say the problem is solved but it is much better. We still drive aaround with spark plugs but the incidence of replacement is much less and I don't seem to be getting gas in the oil unless someone else drives it that is totally tone deaf and too lazy to replace the plugs. The plugs I am using are the NGK Ridium 6441. you may need a different plug for your engine. The plugs I buy are around $7 each so I bought a plug cleaner from HF much happier now...

However the reason I am on this board was to research the fuel injected gators... thinking maybe they would not have this problem. Boy was I wrong...

....

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MrChris
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 19 Georgia
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2011-03-07          177248


I own an '06 TH 6x4 Gator from new with 1300 hrs on it now. I've never experienced oil in the gas. I change the oil every 100 hrs myself. We do a lot of short trips on hilly terrain to feed our horses and also to scoop our pastures, shutting the gator off and restarting quite frequently. I'm surprised to hear about gas in oil with the air cooled engine. I know the pre '05 6x4s are water cooled. ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2011-03-08          177255


I have a 1 year old 620I that would fill the crank case in 30hrs. That is with a mix of driving but the bulk being driving about 1000yrds to the barn and shutting it off "which I thought a UTV was made for". I had an old 2X4 before that we only drove to the barn, because it had no suspension and could stand to drive through a rough field. That never had any problems "it was carburated". That's why it pisses me off so much when JD says all gas engines do this if you don't run them hard. I see a lot of ways to help this problem or maybe fix in here. I'm a mechanic myself and could tune on it or change things a bit to make it work better, but I did not go out and spend $12K to get a brand new suppossedly top of the line piece of equipment to have to work on it. It should be right from the start or they should standing behind it and making it right. ....

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rpfeffer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 19 USA
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2011-03-08          177257


I put a temperature gauge on mine and let it sit around and run a lot in the winter. I always make sure it gets warmed up at least once every day.I also agree it is an expensive poor design and wasteful on gas. ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2011-03-08          177258


My local dealer gave me an extended 2yr warranty on mine "because I spent $40K on a tractor". I took it back to them and they played with the fuel mixture. They leaned it way out to the point it almost wants to cut off when coming back down from reved up when cold. Seems to be doing pretty well for putting gas in the oil, but the one time I did work it hard pulling a big load it seemed to not have enough fuel and the check engine light came on. Figure I have about 20 month of warranty left on it and it can go away after that. I'm suprised there has not been a class action law suit on this. Hell I could rep out side it so cut and dry. ....

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gator2times
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 14 North Texas
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2011-03-08          177259


Does anyone know if the new 825s have this problem? I suppose that if the problem is my driving habits then it would reason that I would have the same problems. Maybe the new motor does not have this problem? ( oxy sensor ? ) I have looked and found some complaints about the 825 regarding the front end, but not gas in the oil... I bet that motor is not cheap to replace or work on. JD is probably the exclusive parts supplier! OUCH

BTW I would be very interested in the results if some 620/625 owners try the hotter spark plugs. If anyone tries it, please post me.

Thanks ....

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ejack11
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2011-03-08          177261


Hotter spark plugs was a suggestion I made to the dealer, but with mine still having 2 years of warranty the last thing I want to do is tweak anything that would give them and out if something went wrong. I would think that would help whith burning all the fuel, the only problem I could think of would be during hard use creating excessive heat in the combustion chamber. It a fine line. ....

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MrChris
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 19 Georgia
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2011-03-08          177264


I guess I have 2 questions related to this thread. Is it safe to say the HPX model does not have this issue? And anyone hearing about this problem in the EFI Kawasaki Mules? ....

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gator2times
Join Date: Mar 2011
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2011-03-08          177268


Quote:
Originally Posted by ejack11 | view 177261
Hotter spark plugs was a suggestion I made to the dealer, but with mine still having 2 years of warranty the last thing I want to do is tweak anything that would give them and out if something went wrong. I would think that would help whith burning all the fuel, the only problem I could think of would be during hard use creating excessive heat in the combustion chamber. It a fine line.


Well if it goes kaput with the new plugs, you could always put your old plugs back in before you call the dealer. LOL But seriously, if it is taking on that much gas you have to wonder how long it will keep running anyway. I blew out a crank seal on my TH like one or two days after warranty was up... I had talked to them about the problems too. They would not stand behind the product. Now I need a new machine ... trying hard not to go Deere ....

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gator2times
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 14 North Texas
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2011-03-08          177275


Quote:
Originally Posted by MrChris | view 177264
I guess I have 2 questions related to this thread. Is it safe to say the HPX model does not have this issue? And anyone hearing about this problem in the EFI Kawasaki Mules?


Don't know about the efi mule but apparently the carb ones do
http://www.kawasakimotorcycle.org/forum/kawasaki-atv-mule/20357-mule-3010-gas-oil.html

I am now going to assume it is just a matter of how they are used and not a problem specific to JD

....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2011-03-09          177284


Knock on wood it's not doing bad since they leaned it out. I just keep checking the oil often. That new 50+hp gator looks realy nice but I do not know of anyone who has one. It's hard to stick with JD after all of this but I like the style of the gator kind of workplay design. I have friends with the mule "diesel though". They do good but they just seem like they are built for work only. ....

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9900ix
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 3 winnipeg manitoba canada
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2011-03-11          177352


i wouldn t say the HPX dont have the problem with fuel in gas, but rather i have problems with my 2005 HPX not starting up when left for a while, but while warm its not bad. so i always keep the cardboard in the rad like the fellows mentions. 2000 hrs and im still struggling to keep it running smoothly. also dont burn the gas cleanly, pretty smelling, think deere got something out of adjustment.....think ill go orange ....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2011-03-12          177356


We had an HPX till the XUV came out with fuel injection. It seems that every company that's been around a while has built a model of this or that which wasn't a demonstration of their best engeneering. Ours was always a pain to get started when cold and there didn't seem to be any fix for the problem.
I was ready to trade the HPX for any color other than green but the dealer asked me to try the fuel injected XUV. I did demo it, liked it and traded. I'm not sure what year that was but the XUV's were new, I think I bought the first one from the dealership. So far it has never failed to start and keep running cold or hot.
The gas in the oil thing, I'd never heard of the problem till after the XUV's had been around a while. So far we haven't had the problem with any Gator, but perhaps I change the engine oil too often to have any gas buildup. Whatever the oil change interval is shown in an owners manual for any small engine I cut it in half for example a 100 hour interval in the book I change at 50 hrs.
Frank. ....

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stwist
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 2 Milton, WI
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2013-03-19          186425


JD 625i gator gas in oil about every 10 hours -- 1/2 inch over dipstick mark. Only has 88 hours on it. 'Still under JD warranty. JD Service Dept. advised to drive at least 30 minutes every time -- not acceptable for my use. (They should have told me, when I bought it, if that was a necessary requirement.) This is the second time I'm bringing it in for inspection by the dealer. I'm so frustrated, I want to give it back. Does anyone know how to rectify this problem? ....

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rpfeffer
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 19 USA
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2013-03-20          186427


I have the same problem but I have the optional heater which makes it harder to warm up.I put a temp. gauge in the heater hose and run it long enough to see the temp.Not usually a problem in the warmer months.I have 650 hrs. so far so good. I live in Ohio . ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2013-03-20          186428


If there is a fix JD doesn't know it. Mine has the same problem, about 10hrs and the crank case is so full of gas and oil that it will start missing and smoking. I just drain the oil and put in new don't even touch the filter. My dealer even gave me a buletin from JD that all gas engines build up gas in oil and if you don't run them long enough to heat up and burn off it will build up. Total BS, bottom line is you have a $13k piece of crap and JD won't stand behind it. The part that kills me is they think it's OK to tell us we need to run them for a 1/2 hour everytime we start them up, don't know about you but we got our to run back and forth to the barn mostly "thought that was what they were made for". I'll quit now, I could right a book bitching about this but it won't do any good. ....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2013-03-21          186439


I'm not doubting anyone who tells of the gas in the oil situation. We still have the same 620i that we bought when they first came with fuel injection I don't remember the hours, I'd have to look but I'm guessing 500+.
Maybe a few habits we have that others don't that may effect the oil problem.
1 - We seldom use it in the winter.
2 - Use only the recommended grade of Deere branded engine oil.
3 - It gets used for longer periods of time, sometimes a couple hours without shutting the engine off.
4 - I tend to change the engine oil much more often in the Gator, or any small engine that holds a quart or so of oil than the owners manual recommends.

I really don't know if any or all of my habits contribute to not having the problem, but so far we haven't. I smell the oil every time I drain it.

Frank. ....

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gatorboy
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 5 Florida
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2013-03-22          186446


Checking my new/used HPX for gas in the oil by by changing oil. It is now over full by about 1/2 quart after about 15 hrs. I think/hope the previous owner may have over filled it right before he sold it. However I don't remember it being but a 1/4 quart over the full mark. If I have a problem I guess with all the start and stop operation a monthly oil change will be my solution. Any ideas on that as a solution would be appreciated. ....

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gator2times
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 14 North Texas
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2013-03-22          186451


Hey guys .. this is an old thread but I am will to share my two cents.. I have had three of the 6x4 gators..( two currently ) I use them around the barn. All trips are short stop start trips. All of then had this problem. One has the air cooled engine.. it is the worst. I blew a crank seal out of that one about two days after warranty.

Don't ask me why I would ever by JD again but I have two of the 825s also now..LUV em..

But back to the other gator questions: Loooong story short;

First buy a box of hot plugs for it. On mine I have used NGK BPR2ES and NGK RIDIUM 6441

Second: buy a dedicated spark plug socket and ratchet to have in the gator at all times

Third: buy a spark plug cleaner ( Harbor Freight )

Develop an ear for when the plus are fouling.. If the gas is being fired.. you will not have gas in your oil...

Change those plugs frequently. if you have an ear for it. you will know when. I know this sucks but it is the only solution I have found and this works for me.

The knuckleheads at JD know about the problem but they "ain't gonna fix it"

Good Luck ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2013-03-25          186481


For what it's worth - I have a 625I I think 2010 with a 130hrs - took mine back to the dealer at 20hrs gas in oil - they tried tweeking the fuel system probably leaning it out, but long story short told me I was not using it right "not driving it long enough to warm up, you think if that was such an important thing it would come with a temp gauge" Given that is all total BS "I am a mechanic and own my own repair shop, not small engine" I did send out an oil sample for analysis - they can not actually check for gas but it was low vis. and high water traces "no metal" mine runs fine, when it does start to smoke and miss it is because the crank case is so full that the pistons
ods start slapping the oil in the crank case when I get on a incline. Now I just drain the old oil and put in fresh don't even touch the filter "most the time". The hotter plugs does make since but was afraid to void warranty at time what the warranty is worth I don't know. The bad part is I could not sell it to someone like this so I guess I'll be trading it in on something orange in the future. The other bad thing is I have a JD zero turn, riding mower and 66HP tractor - now I have no faith in the company. ....

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cabbellgroup
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 6 north garden, va
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2015-08-10          193284


I have the same gator with the same problem. Where are you in VA? I am
near Charlottesville. 21.5 acres. Very upset about this. Gator only has 204 hours on it. ....

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cabbellgroup
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 6 north garden, va
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2015-08-10          193285


I have the same gator with the same problem. Only 220 hours on my 620i. Called 15 dealers across the U.S. They all say you have to run the engine for20 minutes each time you start it. I do this and it still has the same problem. I am near Charlottesville, VA.

Have you found a solution?

Interested in forming a group to go to John Deere?
(434) 244-3535
....

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gator2times
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2015-08-10          193289


I have both the older 6x4 normal carb gators as well as the 825i injected gators. Had tons of problems with the carb gators washing gas down the cylinders. Were using those for very short runs. Absolutely NO HELP from JD. they pretended the problem didn't exsist and this was the first time they had ever heard of it. When i bought the EFI 825s we started using those for the short runs and now use the carb gators for work that allows then to warm up. Problem solved. Regarding your 620 / 625i, I have heard of all sorts of weird problems with them. Because it is EFI it should not be doing this. It has to be An EFI problem of some sort. It is seems Deere has all these units running way way too rich and they are all gas hogs. 825 included. That said, I absolutely love my 825s but have had problems with the one I bought used, it came with some injection problems.

I wouldn't hold my breath waiting on Deere to help. If your use is short run type stuff, particularly in cold weather, I would sell the 620 and get something else. 825i is a good choice IMHO others may be better, I cannot speak to that. ....

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gator2times
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 14 North Texas
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2015-08-10          193293


PS before switched to the 825 gators we bought hotter plugs and swapped them very frequently.

In fact you can tune your ear to know when you are not getting a complete burn on the plugs and need to swap. I also bought a harbor freight plug cleaner and just rotated them out. I kept extra plugs and a plug wrench with the gator at all times. This got us through it. ....

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berryday38
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 7 Palestine, TX
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2017-02-18          196296


Have a 2010 Gator 620i with fuel injection. At 150 hrs it started stuttering and running rough and had gas in the oil. Per instructions from dealer I took throttle body apart and sprayed with JD Carbon and Choke Cleaner and started putting Sea Foam in the gas. Also installed new plugs - BPR2ES. Gator then ran fine but was still getting some gas in oil. At approx. 300 hrs the dealer replaced Fuel Pump and Fuel Filter as it was making a squealing sound. After that was running good but had to change oil every 30 hours because oil up above full mark 1 inch due to gas in oil. At 355 hrs it started running rough again. I've tried to clean the throttle body assy as before, put in new plugs but still not running good. Not same roughness as before. Now it coughs and sputters when start it, but hasn't died yet. When push on gas peddle it also coughs and sputters. When moving at a steady speed and holding the gas peddle steady the Gator engine speeds up and then gradually slows down to almost an idle then speeds up again, even though haven't moved gas peddle. It keeps doing this at about 5-8 second intervals. Sounds like not getting gas. I thought maybe the fuel filter was partially blocked and was going to change it out. However I took off the gas hose going to the throttle body assy and it's pumping out a good stream of gas when you turn the key on. Apparently some sensor is not working right. Any help would be appreciated. I'm not happy with this John Deere Gator and obviously I'm not the only one having problems. Thanks for any suggestions. ....

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ejack11
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 15 Virginia
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2017-02-18          196297


I traded mine in at around 150 hrs and it was doing like yours when I got ride of it. We had a family friend as a JD salesman and he said it was the TPS. Don't know for fact but it made since. A little history on mine was it dump gas in the oil from day 1 even when it ran fine. They gave me letter from JD saying I did not run it long enough to heat up and evaporate the gas that got past the rings and into the crankcase "that all gas engines do". I got an 855D and it seams pretty good, I would not of got another JD but could bring myself to sell or trade in to anyone other than JD since they built and wouldn't stand behind the POS. ....

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