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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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psimonson
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 57 Northeastern Tennessee
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2003-12-16          71367

I have posted a few pictures taken Thanksgiving weekend while assembling the backhoe I built for my 2210. (It has already been called my Christmas gift to me cannot understand why!)

Hydraulics are primarily based on a set of plans I bought online. A PTO pump feeds through a flow splitter to 2 separate 3-spool valves. The main frame between the stabilizers serves as oil reservoir. The weather has not cooperated, it has been either frozen and snow-covered or muddy, so I will not do any real digging until spring but everything works OK while running the controls through their paces in the comfort of my garage.

Reach is about 10 feet from the main pivot and it should dig to just over 8 feet deep. The main boom swings about 150 degrees. Because of the tractor size and weight I kept the bucket to only 10 wide while the stabilizers spread to almost 9 feet.

I considered 3-point hitch attachment but decided against it because the upper link mount did not look too strong and the length of the lower links would have forced me to move the hoe back at least 6 feet, bad for both balance and ground clearance. Instead I came up with a sub frame that hangs from the cross bar for the lower 3-point arms and extends forward to plates welded to the bottom of the FEL mounts. (Short enough to clear the MMM deck at its highest.) In addition to hanging off the cross bar, the rear has a pin through the original drawbar hole.

Although playing with the snow blower is fun, I cannot wait for spring!


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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003
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2003-12-16          71368

Wow, that's some beautiful work! Wish you were my neighbor :) ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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ScooterMagee
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2003-12-16          71375

Very nice.

I’m curious how the seat arrangement works? I can’t quite tell from the pics.
....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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psimonson
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 57 Northeastern Tennessee
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2003-12-16          71377

The backhoe has a separate seat mounted witha hinge at the top of the post that holds the control valves. It locks nearly straight up when operating the tractor and folds down flat to run the backhoe. The original tractor seat has to be folded forward since they almost touch. Only drawback is I had to bypass OPS to run PTO while on the second seat. ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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shortmagnum
Join Date: Nov 2003
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2003-12-16          71378

Psimonson, The backhoe looks great! It's satisfying to create your own stuff. Lots of work though. Your shop looks much cleaner than mine. :-)

Dave
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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2003-12-17          71438

I'm curious about the hydraulics. I'm guessing the splitter is a proportioning valve that gives a set percentage of flow to each leg and the PTO pump has enough flow to produce acceptable speed in all functions. From the description, I don't have to look at the pics to know that this is good work.

I'm thinking that the set up might give simultaneous operation of one function on each of the SCV's and that would be a very good feature. I know it would save me a bunch of time if I could swing and raise the boom or extend the stick at the same time when dumping. My single stack valve gives me 'the lightest load moves first' operation and that just isn't predictable enough for me. I know that some large hoes have separate pumps just for the swing cylinders. ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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psimonson
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2003-12-17          71488

TomG - your thinking about the flow splitter affording simultaneous operation of one function on each of the SCV's is right-on. One input from the pump is divided into two equal outputs.

I used a $75 spring-loaded splitter while the more sophisticated (expensive) ones truly meter the flow though gears like 2 hydraulic motors coupled together.
Pete ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
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2003-12-18          71562

I think that type of splitter valve is fairly easy to change from equal flows to other percentages. Equal sized orifices on both legs gives 50%-50% division but different sized orifices in the legs can give different percentage division. There may be potential for fine tuning if a tinkering mood happens to occur. For example function like the boom which tend to be slower than others could be put on a higher flow leg. The tinkering might be interesting if the mood is right, but the hoe probably works just fine as it is. ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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jd2210
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2003-12-18          71567

The work is outstanding. I assume you made the cab as well? If so, do you have some plans or do you make any on the side? You are welcome to email me on the side, but kudo's to your work. ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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danschmidt3
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 2 Michigan
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2003-12-19          71681

Looks great!

I am also interested in plans - any idea of much it cost you to build?

Dan


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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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psimonson
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2003-12-22          71946

I too wondered what I spent so I got ambitious and summarized parts costs for the backhoe by a few broad categories: Cylinders and controls $765, Fittings and Hoses $480, materials for frame $255, totaling $1,500.

The PTO pump and related hardware aren't included above because many tractors could run this off the tractor hydraulics with a power beyond valve. My pump, quick connects, hoses, suction strainer, etc. came to about $350 for a grand total of $1,850. I didn’t dare try to keep track of my cheap labor.

In response to a couple of questions, I have 7 pages of plans showing most major backhoe components and would be willing to send out a copy if you’re interested in building one. I didn’t document anything for the sub-frame except the plates that weld to the bottom of the FEL mounts, just kind of eyed it up and built something to fit. ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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danschmidt3
Join Date: Dec 2003
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2003-12-23          72033

I am definately interested in whatever you got for plans. I have been looking for a good winter project. Email me off line and I can send you $$ to cover your copying/mailing/etc expenses.

Dan
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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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tamanaco
Join Date: Jul 2003
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2003-12-26          72301

psimonson,

Good looking BH. Nice work! I've got a couple of questions. Is the sub frame shown in the pictures all the connection to the tractor? I've been looking for plans to build a 3pt unit for a subcompact. I know of CadPlans. Are there other plans on the web for BH plans?

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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psimonson
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2003-12-27          72359

tamanaco, the sub-frame is all that mounts the backhoe to the tractor. It is held by 2 pins at the front of the subframe (1 under each loader mount arm) and a pin through the original drawbar hole in the rear. The rear pin doesn't support any weight, that is handled by two pieces of 1" X 3" steel with a slot milled to go over the original lower 3-point mount bar.

I built a Cad Plans model 508 backhoe for my former Simplicity Legacy about 3 years ago. After a year I modified it because of the small reach and depth - I got tired of moving the tractor after every 2 feet or so of digging. My latest attempt is my own design based on what I learned from it plus a lot of eyeballing factory & aftermarket backhoes.

Other companies selling tractor mounted plans on the internet that I came across can be found at: http://cdp-backhoe.com/3PHM/backhoe.htm and http://www.geocities.com/pnfz/GardenTractorLoader.html. There is a also a pretty good looking towable unit at http://www.ubuilditplans.com/ which could be adapted to 3-point, but it's probably a bit large for your tractor.

As I mentioned earlier, one of the reasons I stayed away from 3-point hiotch mount was to keep the backhoe as close as possible to the rear end for balance. The length of the 3-point arms forces weight much further back. ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000
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2003-12-28          72448

You do some really nice work!!! I was impressed with the cab and now the hoe! You certainly have a great talent. ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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tamanaco
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2003-12-29          72577

Psimonson, Thanks for the feedback and web sights, sounds like you got lots of experence on the sub-compact BH area. I'd be interested in tapping into that knowledge base. How do I go about getting a copy of what you have? Looked at the pictures again, nicely done! ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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lbrown59
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2005-08-16          114955

Reach is about 10’ from the main pivot
======================================
A 10 foot reach appears like to much leverage on to light a tractor.
Also The ROPS / Cab looks to be to low for a BH.

Forgoing the 3 point was a wise move as poeple have been crushed using them with the to low ROPS.
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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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lbrown59
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2005-08-16          114957

I've been looking for plans to build a 3pt unit for a subcompact.
tamanaco
=================
Adding a BH to a subcompact is a safety risk and a 3 point BH is even more dangerous. The only small tractor you can safely add a BH to is the Simplicity Legacy XL. ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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jtfirth
Join Date: Aug 2004
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2005-08-16          114962

ibrown59,

I've been comtemplating an after-market BH for my NH TZ24 and I'm curious about your remark that a BH for any sub-compact other than the Simplicity ?? is dangerous.

Why? Please explain. ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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lbrown59
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2005-08-16          114973

tfirth
==============
For safety reasons tractors with back hoes require a taller ROPS than tractors without back hoes.
There have been reports of people being crushed to death between the back hoe and the to short rops.

The Kubota BX23 and the Massey Ferguson GS2310 are the only Sub Compacts specifically designed by the manufacturer for a BH. Part of this design feature is the taller ROPS for the BH.
Since the other Sub Compacts weren't designed for a BH the Manufactures do not offer a taller rops.
Just because a BH manufacture designs a BH for a given tractor it doesn't necessarily follow that the tractor is designed for the BH.
Just like Kubotas BX23 and MFs 2310 Simplicity Designed the Legacy XL garden tractor to accommodate a BH as well as designing a BH for the Legacy.
However unlike Kubota and MF who require you to purchase the BH when you buy the tractor Simplicity allows you to purchase the tractor only and buy the BH later if desired. Thus making The LEGACY XL the only Small tractor that you can add an OEM BH to after buying the tractor.

Both the tall and the short ROPS are available on the compact tractors.
However the same safety hazard is encountered when people buy a Compact tractor with a short ropes then later add a back hoe be it an OEM back hoe or an After Market back hoe but fail to replace the short rops with the taller one.

This isn't an issue of OEM BH vs After Market BH.
It a matter of miss matching Back Hoes and ROPS.

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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psimonson
Join Date: Jul 2003
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2005-08-17          115001

lbrown59

I don't think you're giving the 2210 enough credit. It is certainly as capable, if not more capable than the Simplicity. (I am a former Legacy, albeit pre-XL, owner.)

In the year and a half since I built my backhoe Woods came out with the "groundbreaker X" series with subframe mounting for the 2210 and most other small tractors. My JD dealer has delivered 6 of them on 2210's and claims they've been extremely capable and trouble-free.

The Woods setup uses a seat mounted to the tractor, not the backhoe like I did, but they end up in about the same location. I'm 6-3 and I have no trouble at all with ROPS clearance either while getting on/off or during operation. It seems plenty high in stock form, the only possible drawback is it doesn't fold. When operating the backhoe the seat position places you inside the ROPS structure with the upper body ahead of it.

I don't know anything about the accidents you mentioned but the way the seat is positioned it seems very unlikely that someone would get caught between the backhoe and ROPS on a 2210. The backhoe or ROPS would have to bend for this to occur.

I will admit the reach on mine is probably too much for a production machine where they have to be a bit more conservative and flexible. My goal was to reduce the number of times I had to reposition the tractor when trenching. I use only a 10" bucket so I don't swing a lot of weight way out there. I'll occasionally bounce the front wheels off the ground but that's always been from boulders or roots, nothing to do with being at maximum reach.

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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JDFANATIC
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 119 Southington, CT
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2005-08-17          115003

It's amazing that a couple of years later, voila, this post has popped back up. That just goes to shows the timeliness of it still. Anyway, I have seen psimonson's backhoe, as well as a few other of his well thought through projects, and trust me, if Deere does comes out with a BH for the 2210 (there is a new number model floating around on the Deere intranet that so far doesn't match known tractors) they would do well to learn some lessons from him -- such as making it a frame attach, and yet quick-tach; and running the hydraulics off of a separate PTO driven pump. As for the 2210 ROPS being too short for a BH, the label states it is good for models 4010, 4110, and 4115, which can have BH's. Also I do know the ROPS on the 2210 is TALLER than the ROPS on my 755 -- which had the tall ROPS for a BH.

Cheers

JDFANATIC ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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ScooterMagee
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2005-08-17          115006

If you look at the JD 46 BH option, under Accessories, there is a "Tall ROPS Upper Hoop Kit" that is "Required for Use with 46 Backhoe on Tractors". ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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JDFANATIC
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2005-08-17          115007

Scooter,

Upper? That must be for the folding ROPS then. I just know the ROPS is really tall on the 2210, again taller than the tall ROPS my 755 had.

Cheers

JDFANATIC ....

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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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lbrown59
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2005-08-22          115245

1* The 2210 . It is certainly as capable, if not more capable than the Simplicity.
2*Woods came out with the "ground breaker X" series with sub frame mounting for the 2210 and most other small tractors.
3* My JD dealer has delivered 6 of them on 2210's and claims they've been extremely capable and trouble-free.
4*I don't know anything about the accidents you mentioned but the way the seat is positioned it seems very unlikely that someone would get caught between the backhoe and ROPS on a 2210. The backhoe or ROPS would have to bend for this to occur.
psimonson
=============
1*So is the Kobota BX2230, how ever I'm not talking about capability {IE a tractors ability to handle a backhoe} I'm speaking about safety.
The difference between the Simplicity Legacy XL and the JD 2210 and the Kubota 2230 is the Simplicity was factory designed for a BH but the JD and the Kubota was not.
2*But the fact remains these tractors aren't factory designed for a BH and the correct ROPS for a BH is not available for most if not all of those tractors. The woods BH completely ignores this issue.
3*Again the issue I'm addressing is one of safety rather than ability or reliability,
4* A guy bought a new kubota B 7610 with a BH that had the standard shorter ROPS on it.
The Dealer ended up having to take the tractor back to the shop and replace the rops with a taller rops.
Must not have met federal safety regs.
When I. Priced the Kubota B series the Short ROPS came standard but it you ordered a BH you had to purchase the extra cost taller ROPs.
The BX kubotas only offer the short ROPS.; EXCEPT for the BX23 which only offers the taller rops.
This tells me there is something to the safety issue of properly matching Backhoes with ROPS.


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John Deere 2210 Backhoe Review

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lbrown59
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2005-08-22          115250

As for the 2210 ROPS being too short for a BH,
1*the label states it is good for models 4010, 4110, and 4115, which can have BH's
JDFANATIC
===========
1*It can be Good for models 4010, 4110, and 4115 and yet be wrong if these models have or add a BH.
Kubotas set up is a good example of this.
The short ROPS is good for all B models however if a BH is applied to the tractor a different higher ROPS is required for that application.
I don't know for sure; can't swear by it but I would assume the same probably applies to JD and the other tractor brands also.


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