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NH TC21 and Oil Filter Quality

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bruce
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1999-12-06          10694

i am trading my ford 1120 for a nh tc21d. my 1120 has been flawless for 8 years. does anyone have any information on the reliability of the the tc21d? is it still made by the same japanese company?

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KG
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1999-12-06          10700

I only have about 75 hrs. on my TC21D and it has been perfect. My bigest complaint is the cost of the filters for the 50hr service. The only one the auto parts place could cross reference was the fuel filter (which is the cheapest anyway). The tractor does have a made in japan label,I believe it is the same factory. ....

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bruce
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1999-12-06          10701

i am thinking of getting a 5 ft finishing mower. do you think the tc21d will pull it or should i stick with a 4 ft. my 1120 did well to pull the 4 ft. ....

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JimBinMI
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1999-12-06          10703

I have a TC18 Hydro and it does a great job pulling a 3 pt. 5' rear discharge Woods finish mower. The only problem was the weight on the rear and I mainly solved that with front weights, I don't have a front end loader. If my TC18 can handle it, then I know the TC21 will. I have about 40+ hours on mine and I couldn't have made a better choice in a tractor, Dealer, value, quality! This is one rugged little tractor, I can't wait for snow to fly to see how it handles that, don't know yet if I'll need chains or not. Jim ....

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NH TC21 and Oil Filter Quality

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greg h
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1999-12-07          10705

this is in response to KG's whining about the cost of the oil filter. I am amazed when someone pays good money for a tractor and complains about the price of the most important parts of the tractors systems. They may be pricey but necessary. Just take good care of your machine and it will repay your efforts many times over the owner who skimps on service. Guaranteed.
Greg H
....

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bo
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1999-12-07          10710

Greg- KG wasn't "whining" about the cost of the oil filter. He's not stupid and knows that oil filtration is important. If you were perceptive you would know that he was disgusted in having to pay 100% more for a product that if it was available out of the dealer loop would drop the price from $8 to $4. KG wanted value for his buck. You probably believe that price=quality. Got a news flash for you, ain't always so. Dealers love people like you-pay going rate no questions asked and believe the myth of P=Q. I'll stick with guys like KG , they keep manufacturers honest. Incidently, what kind of filters do you put in your cars or does jiffylube do it and you have no idea. Webmaster-Mls- this sound familiar? ....

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KG
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1999-12-07          10713

Bo and Greg relax. Maybe I was whineing a bit about paying $100 for the 5 filters I bought. But this seems like the perfect place to do just that. mostly I was just trying to share information with other folks who are comparing different brands of tractors. If everthing else is equal but the filter change cost 3x times what it should, that can be a deciding factor. Lets help people make good choices by sharing as much info as we can. ....

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Roger L.
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1999-12-07          10720

Has anyone looked at the oil filter study at minimopar.simplenet.com? Interesting stuff. ....

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bo
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1999-12-07          10722

Roger- I was a diehard Fram user until I read the filter study and now I am a diehard confused person searching for the right filter. A good piece of work done by that guy. bo ....

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Bird Senter
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1999-12-07          10723

Bo, just don't overlook the fact that they guy who did that "study" admits not having the technical knowledge; just one person's opinion (and I don't have the technical knowledge either). It's been 40 years since I sold Fram oil filters, but I'm still using them, and I've never had a lubrication related problem with ANY engine in my life. We've each got our own personal quirks, and one of mine is to change the filter EVERY time I change oil; not every other time, and since I bought a new Kubota this year, I did buy several spare Kubota filters (don't know yet whether Fram makes them for this new model) and of course, those Kubota filters cost four times as much as a Fram, so I'll be checking later to see if Fram has filters for this tractor. ....

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JerryG
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1999-12-07          10725

I don't think I'll use a Fram filter on my Massey Ferguson 1250-4 again. A while back I put a Fram hydralic filter on. After that my tractor wouldn't lift as much,it had pump noise, and the valve under the seat would sound like it had a leak. I have now found out the problem. It was the Fram filter, It had the same number of oil holes, but they were only half the size of the ones on the Massey Ferguson filter. ....

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bo
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1999-12-07          10729

Bird- yeah, I realize that the guy admitted to no special tech. expertise. I also agree with all you say, change oil frequently and filter and the fact that the oem filters are a "gotcha" and I hate being got. Two things have caused me pause, the fact that the visual inspection revealed the fram and some others to be "cheezy" in construction and the letter he got from the guy that works for fram who wouldn't touch fram with a ten foot pole. I also have never had a oil related problem and have used frams for about 25 years -but- there is a distinct possibility that fram has cheapened the filter and has price lined their filters for mass sales. Doing research today is next to impossible and I appretiate that some one did something even if it didn't have a whole lot of scientific validity. If individual components are cheapened then it is rational to assume that could be other problems as well. Big question is which one to buy for quality and value. One producer can produce for many brand names and the consumer never knows. He sorta blew apart Mopar filters and I just bought a Napa gold for a 99 van and glad that I didn't put in a oem Mopar. On the other hand, He found no difference visually between the gold and silver. The differenc in price is $2 , should that be spent when the things might be the same? Hell, I beat this filter thing to death with the webmaster and mls about 3 weeks ago. I guess it is a crap shoot.
....

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Bird Senter
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1999-12-07          10730

Unfortunately, I'm afraid in many cases it is a crap shoot for most of us. And if Fram filters are worse than others now; well, it wouldn't be the first time a good company degraded and tried to survive on past reputation. I had a Kubota B7100 for 4 years and used Fram oil filters, but I never found a Fram to replace the hydraulic filter, so I had to stay with Kubota filters. Of course I'm still using Frams on my wife's car and my pickup. Maybe there was a reason, JerryG, that Fram didn't list a hydraulic filter for my B7100. Now that I have a B2710, I haven't had a chance to look at any catalogues to see whether anyone besides Kubota has air, oil, fuel, and hydraulic filters for it. I always kind of assume (and that's sometimes dangerous, too) that you can't go wrong following the owner's manual, so I may just stay with Kubota filters, but like some other people, I don't really like to pay 3 or 4 times as much as I should, even if it is a small amount. ....

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Peter
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1999-12-08          10765

Here is my $.02 on the filters. I think your OK to switch, but you MUST do your homework. Just 'cause it spins on, and fluid doesn't come shooting out, doesn't make it the right filter. Many times, you can EXCEED the manufacturers specs, and get a cheaper filter at the same time...Look at the size of filtration, the flow rate, check valve construction, and rating.

I've been given a fram filter wheni asked the dealer for a filter.

BTW- I used to be a diehard Fram user, but anymore I think their check values are a weak link ....

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bo
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1999-12-08          10769

Peter- ok, I'm ready to do my homework and check filtration, flow rates, etc. Just how do I do this? ....

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MichaelSnyder
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1999-12-09          10803

I ain't say'n a word. ;) MLS ....

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Cliff
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1999-12-09          10830

Well I'll throw in my $.02 worth. I have New Holland 1320. I just did the 50 hr. maintenance on it. Replaced the HST filter with a New Holland and the hydraulic filter with a Wix (have used wix ilters all my filter changing life). I now have a problem with squalling hydraulic pump @ full throttle. Stopped by a New Holland dealer to pick up a New Holland hydraulic filter but he didn't stock one. I am going to slap the old one back on to see if this eliminates the problem and then replace with factory filter. Believe it or not the factory filter was cheaper than the Wix replacement. Will post the results tomorrow.

Cliff ....

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Greg H
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1999-12-10          10844

bo i saw another post from you and really understand your ideas. But just because you dont respect you equ. and have had some luck doesnt mean the rest of of are so lucky or callous. Just because you havent obviouly harmed the equ. doenst mean you have helped it. Although you do have a point about going overboard on things. I admit to that one.; Also my statement about the "whining" was wrong sorry for that one too. I guess some issues and this is one just gets me going. Bottom line is use what you want when you want. I am comfortable with how i handle maintenance as you others are. Although in the long run i spend more than i have to, i feel in the long run it will be worth it. all my other equ. i s still running after most of my friens has worn out long ago some i must be doing something right. Sorry if i ruffled too many feathers.
Greg H ....

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bo
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1999-12-10          10847

Greg- I don't think respect has anything to do with mechanical objects. My equipment is expensive and requires care and maintenance. This I give it on a regular basis. "luck" was just a word I used, I don't really beleive that I'm lucky that my stuff runs good. Lucky is when you abuse and don't take care of the stuff and it still happens to function. The environment-we can make it or break it, let's make it. Your original comment on "whining" sorta lit my short fuse and I was a little tough on you. That was uncharitable of me. Later. bo ....

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wade
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1999-12-11          10907

Oil filters differ greatly in their ability to protect components, and that ability is related to the design specifications, and manufacturing tolerances specified. All meals cooked in your kitchen do not taste the same based on the ingredients you use, and the care taken to make the meal.
In a filter, the filtration media can differ greatly without looking different with the naked eye. Also, a car engine burning gasoline, and a diesel engine burning, well, diesel give an oil filter completely different things to take out of the oil. Also, a hydrostatic transmission has different needs than an old gear pump meant to run one simple hydraulic cylinder as was the case even 15 years ago. Remember that when oil is cold it does not all get filtered and is bypassed around the filtration media within the filter. A good filter will have a device that reduces as much as possible a "backwash" that pulls the stuff you have already filtered out of the oil and puts it back into circulation. Of all the filters not to cheat on, I would suggest looking at the hydraulic system. Good luck with filters, Wade ....

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bo
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1999-12-11          10925

Wade--agree with everything you said about oil filters, but, here's where the rubber meets the road, which one? bo ....

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wade
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1999-12-12          10930

Bo, check filter prices between dealers. This will tell you if you are being taken advantage of locally. If you want, ask the dealer to explain the difference between oem and aftermarket filters. If they cannot do so in detail, call New Holland and as a recent buyer, they will have a field service representative contact you and they should be able to give you a detailed answer. Also, check the procing on some current products out there that have been releases in the last few years for their filter pricing. In doing this, you may find that all machines filters may cost a lot more that they did a few years ago, but when you compare the recommended change intervals the overall cost of ownership is lower as a result of the improved oil additive packages that have been developed, and new synthetic filter medias. You may want to consider using the oem filters during the warranty period to avoid any arguments should there be a problem. Chart your maintainence costs during the base warranty and decide if they are out of line as a result of filter pricing. If they are, when the base warranty expires and the whole tractor is 100% your responsibility you can do what you want. That will be the true test. I expect that the yearly cost of using the filter designed and spec'd for yur machine will be within reason ovwer the long run. Keep your oil clean, Wade ....

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Dan Wisconsin
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2000-11-30          21984

I have TC21D with 400 hours. Only a couple of minor problems.
....

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