1710 Hydraulics Failure: New Holland Tractor Review  -- New Holland Tractors Discussion Forum and Review 1710 Hydraulics Failure: New Holland Tractor Review -- New Holland Tractors Discussion Forum

  parts   |   manuals   |   discussion   |   photos   |   podcast   |   reviews   |   specs   |   dealers   |   classifieds   |   contact   |   faq   |   myProfile   |   home          Login Now | Sign Up


FAQ:   What is a tractor?

Forum Index

Kubota Tractors
  Kubota News
  Kubota Price
  Kubota Review
John Deere Tractors
  John Deere News
  John Deere Price
  John Deere Review
New Holland Tractors
  New Holland Tractor Price
  New Holland Tractor Revie
Other Tractor Brands
  Articulated Tractors
  Belarus
  Bobcat Tractors
  Case
  Cub Cadet
  Hinomoto
  Kioti Tractor
  Long
  Massey Ferguson
  Mitsubishi
  Other Tractor Brands
  Other Tractor News
  Shibaura
  Yanmar Tractors
Lawn and Garden Tractors
  Craftsman
  Cub Cadet Garden
  John Deere Garden
  Kubota Lawn Garden
  Other Garden Tractors
  Simplicity
  Toro Wheelhorse
  Ventrac Lawn Tractors
Antique Tractors
  Allis Chalmers
  Case David Brown
  Farmall IHC
  Ford
  Ford 9N 2N 8N
  Fordson
  Harry Ferguson
  John Deere Older
  Massey-Harris Ferguson
  Minneapolis Moline
  Oliver Cletrac Cockshutt
  Restoration
  Tractor Pulling
Tractor Attachments Implements 3ph
  Back Hoe
  Field Mowers Brush Cutter
  Grooming Mowers Finish Mo
  Loaders
  Snowblowers / Snow Plows
  Tillers and Ploughs
  Tractor Implements
  Trenchers
  Wood Chippers 3PH
Tractor Maintenance
  Diesel Fuel Lubrication E
  Tractor Engine Repair Reb
  Tractor Tires
Utility ATV
  All Terrain Vehicles
  John Deere Gator
  Mule Utility Vehicles
General Tractor
  Farming Ranching Agricult
  Photo Contest
  Size Tractor Needed
  Tractor Projects
  Tractor Safety
  Welding
Chinese Tractors
  Jinma Farmpro Agracat
  NorTrac Tractors
  Other Chinese Tractors
Cars
  All Brands
  Audi VW
  BMW
  Car Tires and Maintenance
  Chrysler
  Exotic, Sports, Racing
  Ford Cars
  General Motors
  Honda
  Hyundai
  Mercedes
  News
  Nissan
  Subaru
  SUV and Trucks
  Toyota Cars
Trucks Trailers
  Chevy Pickup Trucks
  Dodge Pickup Trucks
  Ford Pickup Trucks
  Toyota Pickup Trucks
  Chevy Pickup Trucks
  Dodge Pickup Trucks
  Ford Pickup Trucks
  Toyota Pickup Trucks
Home Building
  Alternate Electric Energy
  Barns Pole Barns
  Buying Ranch Farm Acreage
  Carpentry
  Contractors
  Electric
  Excavation
  Moldings Finish Trim
  Other Home Building
  Pellet Stoves
  Plumbing
  Wood Stoves
Tools
  Electirc Power Tools
  Gas Power Tools
  Generators
  Shop Tools
  Techniques Howto
Landscape
  Flowers Shrubs Garden
  Golf Course Maintenance
  Irrigation Systems
  Landscape Design
  Landscape Lighting
  Landscape Maintenance
  Lawn, Turf, and Grass
  Vegetable Gardening
Construction
  Caterpillar
  Komatsu
  Wheel Loaders
Current Events Health Happiness
  Current Events
  Dogs and other Pets
  Electronics And Computers
  Food
  Health
  Just For Fun Off Topic
  Movies Music Games
  Personal Finance Investme
  Sports Outdoors
Tractorpoint Site
  Member Photos
  Site Members
  Website Operations Howto


New As Posted | Active Subjects



Click to Post a New Message!

Discussion Boards > Active Subjects > Messages as Posted > New Holland Tractor Review Forum

Page [ 1 ] |
Reply | Pop Up Window Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo
 02-08-2003, 14:55 Post: 48883
fmtrvt



Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: NJ
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 7

5
Filter by User
 1710 Hydraulics Failure

Thought this may have been discussed before, but can't find it.

I have an '84 1710 with FEL and 1300 hrs. I went to use it today for the first time in about 2 months and was able to bring up the bucket and rotate it, then back the tractor out of the shed. I made a slight turn then went to alter the bucket position and found that I lost all hydraulics, including power steering. I've checked the fluid level (OK) and this load of hydraulic oil has only 100 hrs. It's been cold in this area for the last months (NJ).

I'm planing on changing out the filter (just because) and will bring down a pressure gauge for the diverter valve on my next trip. Does anyone know if this hydraulic pump has a key to it's drive gear? Anyone have a history for this issue? Any suggestions?

Jack (first message; long time lurker)






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 02-08-2003, 15:52 Post: 48884
hardwood

TP Contributor

Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: iowa
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 3582
 1710 Hydraulics Failure

Jack, if the fluid in your hyd system was not Ford NH product it may not have had the proper cold flow specs. to get thru the micron size of your filter, which could stop flow. I have had a key shear on a hyd pump (not a Ford NH), and you do lose all pressure instantly. Some systems use a charge pump to feed the main hyd. pump with low pressure fluid from the sump to prevent cavitation in your main pump. Again I'm not familiar with the Ford NH system, but if either pump fails (charge or main, you're out of business. Just some thoughts that may help.






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 02-08-2003, 17:03 Post: 48891
fmtrvt



Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: NJ
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 7

5
Filter by User
 1710 Hydraulics Failure

hardwood,

Thanks for the reply. You bring up a good point in that the last change-out was with a VaLaughing out loudine product, since at the time I did not have the 134 fluid that is currently in 2 5gal pails next to the tractor for this springs change-out, of course.

The tractor is a single pump unit. I hoping it's a simple as a relief valve stuck, but my luck usually does not run that way. Other then a water pump, this would be the first major I've had.






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 02-08-2003, 20:42 Post: 48896
Peters

TP Contributor

View my Photos

View my Photos  Pics
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Northern AL
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 3034
 1710 Hydraulics Failure

With the cold weather there could be a number of things that cause the failure.
With lack of use you may have a little water in the system, which has frozen and is keeping a valve open.
You may have lost an O'ring internal seal but this is normally at lower temperature than you get in NJ. On a real cold day I have put my foot to the floor literally, but on the brake pedal of the car. The seals just shattered at the temperature despite warming the car.
I was curious as to how long you ran the tractor and warmed it before trying the hydraulics.






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 02-09-2003, 06:52 Post: 48906
TomG

TP Contributor

Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Upper Ottawa Valley
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 5406

3
Filter by User
 1710 Hydraulics Failure

Yes, there is a key (SBA034303013) and also a seal kit (SBA340490157). It's good to diagnose a specific problem before throwing parts at it, but the parts should be available through a NH dealer (it's better if the parts guy looks up the numbers though).

It sure does sound like a pump failure, although the suction line and filter might be checked for obstructions or breaks. 1710's do have a priority valve for the PS but I'd discount that as a possible problem since all hydraulics including the PS failed. Even if the PS relief valve failed and the priority valve diverted max flow to the PS, I'd still expect some movement from the loader etc. The PS high-pressure line is small and I wouldn't expect it to carry the full pump flow without creating considerable back-pressure.

I wish I had some specific experience to offer from my 1710 with 650 hours. My PS is gimpy but it's there and the hydraulics just keep working. I'd expect the pump service lift to be quite a bit longer than 1,300 hours. You might check with a dealer and just replaced the pump if it's getting close to the end of its expected service life. It's much colder here than in NJ and I use either NH F200 or an AGCO multi-season hydraulic oil. My dealer recommended the F200. The local snowmobile club's groomer is a converted NH farm tractor that uses 134D all winter. I can't compare 134D with the Valvoline oil, but 134D probably wouldn't cause a problem in your area.






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 02-09-2003, 21:18 Post: 48954
fmtrvt



Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: NJ
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 7

5
Filter by User
 1710 Hydraulics Failure

Peters,

As I've usually done, I let it run for about 5 minutes in the shed, then pull it out and run some more depending on the temp. Yesterday it was 30F when this happened, although earlier weeks went down to 10F.

TomG,

Thanks for the part numbers. I've got the service manual, but not the parts listings. I think it's the pump or key, although I'll check with a new filter in case it clogged. But I would suspect in that situation that the element would be suctioned into the pump. May be the case as it failed under raising and turning, not high load.

Does the seal kit cover all in the pump? If the key is sheared, I like to open the pump and see what is in there. Does the parts manual show what type of pump it is?

Thanks,
Jack






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 02-10-2003, 07:11 Post: 48974
TomG

TP Contributor

Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Upper Ottawa Valley
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 5406

3
Filter by User
 1710 Hydraulics Failure


Parts manuals can be sort of interesting in a twisted sort of way, at least for some people.

There are two pumps listed for 1710's covering from 1983 on. One is 8cc and the other 11cc. The 8cc pump has a note indicating the pump is for L/Power steering on 198484 Asian models only. There also is a different 8cc pump listed for 1510's.

However, the parts for 1710 offsets lists the same two pumps from 85 but the notes indicate the pumps are for L/power steering and W/power steering with no mention of Asian models. The 8cc pump is the same one listed for Asian model 1710's and not the NA 1510. At least the keys seem to be the same for all pumps and models, including the 1510.

Meanwhile, the seal kit for 1510's indicates that it contains 12 bolts and 5 o-rings but the drawing reference is to a box labeled 'kit,' so you can't tell what goes where. But for 1710's There is a note that no parts breakdown is available for 1710 kits since the kits come from the supplier rather than Shibaura. A good guess is that the kit is for the whole pump, but it is just a guess. Similarly, I'd guess that the pump is the 11cc pump.

One thing obvious from all this is that having a parts manual is good, but just having one isn't a complete substitute for asking a real parts guy. When all is said and done, I'm not really sure if this is helpful or not. What might be more helpful is that I recall there is a note with the priority valve parts. The note refers to a technical note issued for separating the priority valve from the pump. The note might be a good thing to track down.






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 02-11-2003, 19:12 Post: 49093
fmtrvt



Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: NJ
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 7

5
Filter by User
 1710 Hydraulics Failure

Update for those interested -

Today we had weather that hovered at 34F, so at the end of the day I left work and went down to the nursery to check over the tractor, change the filter (in case) and possibly remove the pump.

First started up the tractor, then tried to lift the bucket. Hydraulics work! I was able to lift and curl, although I did not try anything strenuous. But it went through the motions that it could not on Saturday.

So it may be possible the fluid has a high water content, and under the freezing temps, the system was not able to draw fluid. This is not how my normal luck goes, and working with hydraulics over many years, not sure I'm buying into this.

However, when I last changed the fluid 100 hrs ago I did note some water at first drain. The tractor is kept under cover, but condensation can get into anything. There also may be an area that is not sealed as well as it should be.

So my next move on Saturday will be to change out to the NH 134 fluid with a new filter if I'm able to lift substantial weight with the bucket. If not, pump is going to come off and I'll be dissecting it.






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 02-12-2003, 07:43 Post: 49115
TomG

TP Contributor

Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Upper Ottawa Valley
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 5406

3
Filter by User
 1710 Hydraulics Failure

Who knows, it just might be that good luck that eventually catches up with all of us. A hundred hours doesn't seem like much for appreciable condensation to build up. I guess it could if the hundred hours lasted was over a few years.

If the tractor had been outside in heavy rains it's possible for water to get into the TX through the shift boot. Water can collect on the TX top-plate and run into the TX through bad seals around the shifter. There's an inner and an outer seal. I haven't a torn boot on my 1710 I haven't gotten around to replacing. I rationalize that I don't really want to work the tractor in the rain and that if I had to, the canopy would keep water off the TX.






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
 02-25-2003, 15:27 Post: 50023
fmtrvt



Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: NJ
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster
Posts: 7

5
Filter by User
 1710 Hydraulics Failure

The final solution, sort of.

I wanted to put an end to this tread. So often you find open ended threads and never know what happened.

The weekend that I went to change out the fluids I started the tractor and let it run - again. Hydraulics still worked - up, down, curl and PS. Then I tried to let the bucket float and noticed that the bucket would slowly rise, rather then go down to the soil level. So the issue at least at this point appeared to be at the loader valve.

I ran some more and worked the bucket with some loads and after about 10 minutes, the float function worked again. I continued using it for another hour with no issues.

The fluid and filter were changed, but I did not have any evidence of water, which may be due to the hour long operation. Anyway no problems since so it appears water ice was the issue after all.

That to those for their input and assistance in looking information up.

Jack






Reply to PostReply | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Bookmarks: Digg It | Del.icio.us |
Reply | Pop Up Window Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


Page [ 1 ] |

Discussion Boards > Active Subjects > Messages as Posted > New Holland Tractor Review Forum

Thread 48883 Filter by Poster:
fmtrvt 5 | hardwood 1 | Peters 1 | TomG 3 |

 (advanced search)

Picture of the Day
videorov

Belarus - How do I get this part off the tractor so I can install a new one
How do I get this part off the tractor so I can install a new one


Unanswered Questions

Shibaura SD2203 rear axle oil
Mitsubishi MX55
Gator HPX ignition module
SL 1643
Removing LHS rear wheel beari
Gear Grinding 1200A - primary
Replacing a friction diskwashe
Bolens k1502 mitsubishi K3 ove


Active Subjects

Big country 4x2 utility vehicl
Operation
lift cylinder for 3pt hitch wo
Still have jerk in hydro
Flatulent gifts human and dog
front mount snowblower
Hydraulics Won t Work
4210 ehydro codes


Hot Topics

NorTrac Tractor Quality Review
Case 446 hydraulic pump
Long 460 hydraulic problem
Jinma Tractor w transmission p
Flatulent gifts human and dog
Generator set up ideas wanted
6X4 Gator Sometimes Shudders
Roof VP75 Brush Mower Manual


Featured Suppliers

Mountain Creek Labradoodles
      MountainCreekLabradoodles.com





New Forums on Gun Sport Shooting and Hunting -- BarrelPoint.com  New Forums on Horses ManePoint.com
Talk Horses at ManePoint
Hunting + Gun Sports at BarrelPoint



Most Viewed

+ New Holland TC33D Tractor Frame broke in Half
+ Boomer 8N CVT
+ TN-75 reliability question
+ AG vs Industrial Tires
+ Ls Tractors Rebadged New Hollands
+ Need advice before Buying Ford NH 1720 tractor
+ New Holland TC29D rear hydraulics
+ NH 7308 LOADER ON OFF
+ New Holland TZ25 DA - not feeling the love
+ Rear remote hydraulics

Most Discussion

+ New Holland TC33D Tractor Fram
+ Liquid Tire Ballast
+ JD 4210 or TC35D
+ New Holland TC 33D Hydraulics
+ TC 33D Blowing Fuses
+ Lights on ROPS
+ Buying TC34DA
+ Diesel Fuel
+ TC25D rear pto shaft broken
+ Boomer 8N CVT

Newest Topics

+ TC33D Telescoping steering column
+ TC33D won t move -
+ Soft Start Problems
+ Drain Cock
+ Air in 2003 New Holland TN75D Hydraulic system
+ Wiring schem
+ Adjusting the 7308 pressure relief valve
+ Tc29da
+ TN75DA Does Not WARM UP
+ new holland Tc 29 da glow plug light on dash
















Turbochargers for Tractors and Industrial Machines
Cab Glass for Tractors and Industrial Machines

Alternators for Tractors and Industrial Machines
Radiators for Tractors and Industrial Machines

Driveline Components for Tractors and Industrial Machines
Starter Motors for Tractors and Industrial Machines