tractorpoint.com - The leader in Tractors from Compacts, to Utility, to Full Size Tractors! Kubota, John Deere, New Holland, Kioti, Case/IH, and Others. Keywords=Compact Tractor, Kubota Tractors,  Kioti Tractors, JD, John Deere Tractors, New Holland, Case Boomer, Used Tractors, Classifieds, Dealer Directory, Tractor Pictures / Images
  parts   |   discussion   |   photos   |   podcast   |   reviews   |   specs   |   dealers   |   classifieds   |   contact   |   faq   |   myProfile   |   home          Login Now | Sign Up

Forums > Active Threads > Home and Garden > Home Improvement

Post Message Home Improvement

 Go Bottom
____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
brokenarrow
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1288 Wisconsin
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-05          90124


I have a garage that is 200' from my closest power source (my cabin) I use a 250' piece of 12ga house wire right now with plug ins on the ends when I need power out there. As you probably can imagine that is getting old, rolling it out every time I am there and back up again when I leave not to mention the hassek everytime I want to move equipment from garage to house or for field work.
I am moving in less than 5 years to this place and plan to build a house attatched to the cabin along with anouther garage. When I do move and build I will be using this garage for 110 everyday while building the house. I also have never had electric strung out there in winter (ever) and that makes it a pain when cutting up deer or what ever!
I have been around this block once before so I am not making the same mistakes twice!

Would it be ok to run a uf wire underground from the house to the garage and (temporarily) only put it 12" under the ground? My thinking is to put in a post next to the cabin with an outdoor box on it that I could hook up a short extension cord to to provide power out to the garage. This way here I would only have the cost of the wire and box that I would eat in a few years. Untill then I would only be using the electric for small hand tools maybe a table saw or chop saw sporadically and a few flouresent lights.
I plan on making part of this garage into a workshop and may add on to it so I really dont want to wire it up yet because my plans may change.
How un-safe would it be to run the wire the way I said?
We have NO zoning/inspections where I live so I would like to be half way safe yet dont want to spend too much and eat it later.
Thanks
TOM


Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
harvey
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 1539 Moravia, NY
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster  View my Photos  Pics

2004-07-05          90140


You can run UF under ground. Most of my yard lights and the run to my shed is in UF. The shed is 180' from house and is on 12/2 power it is a little iffy for large circular saws.

Very few of my wires like that are more than 6-8 inches down. I did draw out maps for the next residents after I do not need this stuff anymore... :-)

Nothing pissed me off more than having to make a trip to the shed for some obscure part I packed away because it might come in handy some day and have to search with a flashlight for it...

Good Luck Harvey ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
JAZAK5
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 276 coxsackie,ny
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-05          90145


200' is really "iffy" on 12/2 your lucky to get 10 amps with out dimming your flouro lights.

run 10/2 and a 20 amp breaker that should run a 3-5hp compressor intermediatly. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
loghouse95
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 87 missouri
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-05          90150


I think you are asking for a lot a trouble trying to run any power tool on what is essentially a 200 foot 12-2 extension cord. At 10 amps The one way distance for an acceptable 2% voltage drop is only 70 feet Trying to run 180 feet you will very likely burn a motor up.. Remember a 1hp motor electric motor needs around 2200 hundred watts of surge to get started. You might want to consider running 220 volts to a sub-panel at your garage. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
brokenarrow
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1288 Wisconsin
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-05          90154


Log houses and other here
This is the kind of info I want. I had used that extension cord while building the garage and it just keeps coming out everytime I need it. So far I only used it for small compressor (nail gun and buzz saw work) I dont plan on using it for the burial since that wire is not uf and also I did not think it was large enough for what I need it for over the next 5 years.
I am looking for the cheapest way to get power out to the garage to run a table saw (sporadically while building my newer house portion) but mostly for lighting in the garage and maybe a buzz saw.? I am NOT planning on keeping this set up. after I build I will run a main line with 220 to a panel. I just dont want to jump the gun and run power to a spot that I may need to move in the future. Also I dont know exactly where other utilitys will be so I may have to dig up the electric source later. That is why I dont want to do it right (the first time) SO
What would you run for a 200 foot run for what I described if you wanted it to be expendable in a few years?
Thanks again ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
loghouse95
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 87 missouri
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-05          90159


Brokenarrow I sure wish I could recommend a cheap and safe way but....... By your reply I assume you are going to need a minimum of 2400 watts i.e., Table saw, lights... I would recommend running 10-3 with ground from your main breaker box. this will give you 220 volts and a acceptable 2% drop in voltage at 225 feet, this would provide with the power you will need and you could use the wire and sub-panel later on for other projects.... Good luck ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
AV8R
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 882 North Central Wisconsin
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster  View my Photos  Pics

2004-07-06          90166


Arrow: I agree with Loghouse, please use the (10-3) 220v and mount a small temporary breaker box. My neighbor buried a small (12-2) 110v line and ran it about 250 feet to a shed in the back yard. The fire inspector said the cause was electrical. House was a total loss.

I went with a complete 2nd service to a 200 amp panal in the workshop because my main house 200 amp service was full. Watching the house acrossed the street burn kind of put the fear of God in me. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Tractorpoint Parts
Fast Delivery!
Low Prices
Tractor Driveline PTO for sale
Driveline Components
Assembly | Clutch
Half CV
____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-06          90171


I have over 100' of 100A flex line to a 100A service panel that's mounted on plywood. Various receptacles are wired to the panel and also mounted on the plywood. I used it in the sound buz when a stage didn't have adequate AC. Bare ends were on the feed end of the flex line and were 'tied' into a service panel rails with clamps. The flex line had to be adequately protected. That's a fairly inexpensive way to get many 110V and 220V circuits temporary locations for weekend festivals and it would good enough to get passed fire marshals. The 110V receptacles used for on-stage circuits were GFI protected.

Since the sound buz days, I replaced the bare ends of the feed with a 30A 220V plug for my generator. The line and panel is overkill but it's something I already had. I'd check local regs but maybe something like 8-gauge flex line from a drier recpetical into a 30A subpanel (with it's own disconnect and the neutral/ground bond removed) would suit your needs. The flex line isn't exactly cheap though but it might remain useful if a remote work site had to be supported from a generator. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7155 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster  View my Photos  Pics

2004-07-06          90178


Tom, maybe I'm missing something here, maybe I just haven't had enough coffee yet.

If it's only 200', and it's only going to be temporary anyway, why bury it at all?

It seems it would be a lot less work to put 2 poles & makeshift anchors in the ground than to trench 200' and I know the wire will cost a LOT less.

If there is an electrical contractor in the area go and talk to them. You will need some pro help once you start building anyway, most have poles, temporary service panels and rolls of used wire for putting up on job-sites like yours. For a few bucks they will often 'rent' them to you, especially if they get the work to do your new place.

Best of luck. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-06          90238


Murf: Sorry I wasn't more clear. The idea of flex line is not to bury it. Just drag the line to the house and plug it into a drier outlet as needed. Some planking might be needed in traffic areas.

That's the way it's done in the sound buz and without contractors or permits. Technically it does take an electrician to tap into the rails of a service sub-panel though, but in this case an existing receptacle would be used. However, the idea should be checked with officials to see if it'd fly in a particular area. It's basically just a heavy-duty extension cord that might have some on-going use. The panel could be used as a sub-panel in the permanent wiring.

Overhead line might even be cheaper. It may also start looking more like a permanent installation and be more subject to code--don't know about that though. What ever is done should be safe and not run afoul of insurance or regs. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
brokenarrow
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1288 Wisconsin
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-06          90245


All of you are right, this is why I ask questions when I am not sure what to do. I see your points and your all right so I thank you for talking sense into me. I can afford it, I dont know why sometimes I try to get away saving a few bucks, just nature I guess. So here goes the new and improved question. I have plenty of room in my breaker box 200amp service left. So what should I use (keep in mind that later I will put in more power out to the garage probably from anouther location since I am building 1800 more sq. ft on to the existing 900sq' cabin so The power location will change. I am coming out of my service panel and going directly outside and underground. I will only be burying it 12-16 inches so I will watch the way I route this and note it for any future excavating. (THER IS NO INSPECTIONS OR ZONING WHERE I AM) Safetey is up to the home owner. What wire would you use: For this temporary set up I will put in a box in the garage. From this box I will want 2- 20 amp plug in outlets and I will be lighting 6 flouresent light fixtures. the 2 -20 amp plug ins will be enough for what I plan on running.
Can I get away with the 10-3 uf to supply the power out there? I will not be using anything that requires 220 untill I wire it correctly all my equipment is 110 right now.
Let me clear things up a bit. When I build the new house the main power will be re-routed by the electric company to the main part of the new house, so ALL my power needs will change I am sure in 5-6 years.
Look at my pic 12, running over head wiring is not practical we get storms as of late that are out of this world with winds and trees flying all around (look up the Ladysmith Wi. tornado LOL) and many more bad storms the last ten years.

What would you do in this case, I was thinking of calling in a electrician but maybe it is something that one of you have come accrossed. When I built this place 4 years ago, I put in a ON DEMAND ELECTRIC hot water heater, it uses
"up to" 65 amps when fully engaged!!! It works perfect for what I need (5 people getting to the cabin at 10pm at night on a Fri. and my wife requireing ALL of us to shower before we dirty her sheets! LOL.) Tank water heater is out of the question untill I get a basement!
Anyway, when we DEMAND HOT water the lights in the house tend to flicker just a little bit? This has been going on for 4 years, I was told many reaons this may happen but none ever really made sense. We have not ever broke a circut breaker.

I wired the whole house including putting in the outside meter box. I had it checked out by a friend (who is now passed on at a young 55 yr old) He was a qualified electrician and told me I done fine job but he passed before I could ask him about this situation? Any ideas? ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
loghouse95
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 87 missouri
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-06          90248


Brokenarrow, I will tell you what I would do, maybe one of the other guys has a idea you will like better. At the main breaker box i would install a double pole 20 amp breaker, at the garage I would install a sub panel..If you plan on burying theline 18 inches I would put the cable in, cover with nine inches of dirt and then lay in colored surveyors tape just in case you forget or someone else digs,and finish covering the line....good luck ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
brokenarrow
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1288 Wisconsin
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-06          90249


What size cable? 10-3 uf? And thanks alot!! ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-07          90257


A 20A 220V branch circuit off the service panel into 10-3 direct burial (DB) line should work. That way there'd be no unprotected line. I'd probably use 3/4" plastic flex conduit to protect the line going out of the house and into the trench and also into the garage and terminate it into a 20A disconnect.

Two 20A 115V circuits could be wired off the disconnect. 10-gague line would support the circuits plus provide extra gauge for the length and motor start up surges. A shallow temporary trench should still have a fair amount of rock free dirt in the bottom--especially if vehicles might drive over it, and it might be good to leave some slack at each end in sort of a frost loop.

....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
brokenarrow
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1288 Wisconsin
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2004-07-07          90320


Will do, thanks! Tom. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo




Tractorpoint Parts
Fast Delivery!
Low Prices
Tractor Cab Glass for sale
Cab Glass
____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
brokenarrow
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1288 Wisconsin
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2006-02-24          125093


Aamazing how you can go back in time and revive old posts!
I am going to start this project asap like when it thaws and dries enough to excavate. 10-3 is what I bought almost 2 years ago now and has been sitting in my garage.
Crash course here.
How big of a breaker should I use in my main service panel in my house that will protect this wire?
When I get into my garage with it and into the sevice panel there, Should I have more breakers? (I was planning on it but thought I should ask? Am I correct on this thinking? The breakers IN the garage panel box would protect the lines and tools I use off of the electric lines in the garage. THEN If something should happen to the wire from the garage breaker box (under ground) to the house, the house's breaker would protect the house from damage????? IS this correct thinking or is this over kill or under kill (or not correct at all)? ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
harvey
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 1539 Moravia, NY
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster  View my Photos  Pics

2006-02-25          125096


BA on the 10/3 I'd use a double 30 at your feed panel if you need 220 at the barn.

From there it depends on how you want to do it and if you want to involve a code guy.

You can put in a small sub panel with a 30 breaker and a couple of 15 or 20 amp circuits + a light duty 220 outlet. or just wire the stuff onto jumper circuits.

I'd opt for the small sub panel. The intial cost is there but it allows you so much more flexibility later if you need it. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
brokenarrow
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1288 Wisconsin
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2006-02-26          125159


Thank youy Harvey, I was leaning towards a panel. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
steve4300
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 71 NH
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2006-03-02          125455


burial depths
24 inch uf direct burial
18 inchs pipe
12 inches uf or pipe if gfci protected

Now if it was me I would run a 2 inch pvc pipe to a sub panel in the garage, install the 10-3 uf minum to feed it, now 10 years down the line, because we all know 5 years means at least 10 years, you could pull up to #2urd aluminum 4 cond. witch is good for 100 amps. Most multi curcuit panels have a minimum rating of 100 amps. I would also run 2- 1" pvc pipes for phone and cable. Now around here they are sell a #2 mobile home uf 4 condutor wire, that is only about 50 cent more than 10-3 uf per ft. I do believe it can be direct buried but around here we have to many rocks and to much frost so wires do take a beating. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
dkheckmanl
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 134 Middleton, ID
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster

2006-03-02          125456


Going back through this thread made me wonder what happened to TomG. Also AC5Z0 came back for a while and then left again. I miss the posts from those guys. ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo


____________________________________________________________________________________
Underground Wiring

View my Photos
WillieH
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 543 New England
TractorPoint Premium Member -- 5 Tractors = Very Frequent Poster  View my Photos  Pics

2006-03-03          125486


Interesting that you mention that...I was wondering that a little while ago as well. Anybody know what happened with these folks?

- Willie H ....

Reply to | Quote Post Reply to PostQuote Reply | Add PhotoAdd Photo



Return to index    Go Top


Share This



Tractorpoint Parts
Fast Delivery!
Low Prices
Tractor Driveline PTO for sale
Driveline Components
Assembly | Clutch
Half CV