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Forums > Active Threads > Other Tractor Brands > Jinma Farmpro Agracat Nortrac

Post Message Jinma Farmpro Agracat Nortrac

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clutch replacement

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kennyl70
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 8 missouri
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2011-09-07          180265


Ok so i have worked most all the bugs outta this tractor i think. i have a 254 agracat i believe it is a 2001 to 2003 year model. lol dont know for sure the seller was not truthful with pretty much anything. anyway the one thing i see for sure is it need a clutch. slips when it is in higher range gears 1st seems to be ok but 2nd and 3rd is a no go on uneven ground. works super great in lower range gears. I believe the pilot shaft seal is leaking alittle and thus got hydro oil on the clutch causing the slip. I need the clutch and the pilot seal. guessing on the pilot seal but more than likely what it is. is there a sure fire way of knowing its a 8 or 9 inch clutch and do you guys knows what seal the pilot seal is as far as ordering.
thanks in advance
kenny

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greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2011-09-07          180266


Where do you see oil? Because I don't know of any seals related to the clutchpack. Pilot bearing yes, but I'm hard pressed to identify a pilot seal. There's a seal at the rear of the engine to keep the engine oil forward, and another at the front of the mid-connect to keep the gear oil back. But none per se in the bellhousing.

It does however sound like your the drive disc is slipping. But before getting any parts, you should actually confirm if it's caused by an oil leak of some kind. Because if the clutchpack is otherwise dry, in some cases the slippage can be adjusted out.

//greg// ....

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kennyl70
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 8 missouri
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2011-09-09          180296


OK what i meant by a pilot seal is the seal around the pilot shaft coming from the tranny. I at first did think it was the rear seal on the engine, but i removed the starter and ran a screwdriver down in the bell to see if in fact oil was in there and it was about an inch of oil. i removed the bottom bolt on the loader tower to remove the oil and left it out to see how bad the leak was. and its not bad at all really, i have ran it and watched the hole where the bolt is gone and the leak it almost none. i assume its just collected in the bell for the last several years. anyway the oil smells like hydro oil not engine oil. i was assuming there was a pilot shaft seal from the tranny holding in the fluid. also when i drained the oil the clutch over the last few days has become alot better and not slipping as much but it still needs a replacement clutch just to get a clean one in there...... oil free ....

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greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2011-09-09          180298


A lot of folks don't know there's a weep hole at the bottom of the bell housing. The diameter is pretty small though, I used to have to clean mine out at least twice a year.

And whereas it's convenient to replace the whole clutchpack, you may only have to replace your friction discs (and degrease the pressure plates). Plus it's cheaper. Give a shout if I can be of any help.

//greg// ....

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kennyl70
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 8 missouri
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2011-09-09          180299


OK I did see the weep hole right above the drive shaft going to the front. but nothing was coming outta it so i thought it was just a casting hole of some kind and didnt go all the way through. thanks i will clean it out and replace the bolt. so do you get what i am saying about the pilot shaft seal? there is one right? do you sell parts for the tractor??
thanks again
kenny ....

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greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2011-09-10          180300


I'm not in the business of selling spare parts. But I have had 4 Chinese tractors over the years, and still have plenty of spares on the shelf that stayed behind when I sold or traded them. So whereas I'm not a dealer, I occasionally have a part or two on the shelf that might help with a topic under discussion.

And yes, there are three seals and a gasket actually. There's a FB35x55x12mm oil seal between the outer shaft and the pass through bracket, a formed gasket (paper I think) between the bracket and the housing, and a pair of 25x2.65mm O-rings sealing the gap between the nested shafts.

//greg//

....

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kennyl70
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 8 missouri
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2011-09-11          180302


wow. ok then. i was thinking it was alittle simpler than that. thought there was just one shaft coming from the tranny to the clutch. i am guessing i will have to break it down to see which one it is huh? do you know of a good supplier of parts? ....

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greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2011-09-11          180303


Well, I'm guessing you already know that AgraCat went out of business about 8-10 years ago. But the model you have is just a rebadged Jinma (JM254), so any reputable Jinma dealer should be able to help you with those parts. But before you contact one, write down the info from the tractor data plate and the engine data plate.

But those particular seals are generic, matter of fact I may even have them in my spares box. Since I don't own any Chinese tractors any more, they're just sorta setting there gathering dust. Or if you're interested, I can easily put together a set of metric oil seals, a set of metric grease seals, and a set of metric O-rings out of my sparees. However any tractor dealer (or NAPA) should carry the individual seals/O-rings, and the gasket is simple enough to cut by hand from bulk stock.

//greg// ....

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kennyl70
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 8 missouri
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2011-09-11          180314


Ok. you hav been alot of help. Yeah i seen they went outts business and had seen somewhere about it being the same as a jm254, but you saying it confirms it. thank you so much. i have notice again today since i got the oil outta the bell housing the clutch is working muchhhhhhhhhhhh better. something about that oil on a clutch disc lol.
anyway yeah i might ask you to do that if i break it apart and cant find what i am needing at the ol NAPA store. I already changed the oil in it and crossed a napa filter for the oil filter and getting ready to do the same with the fuel filter. man you have been a big help thats for sure and i thank you.
kenny ....

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kennyl70
Join Date: Sep 2011
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2011-09-12          180315


wanna ask another question...... i see alot of different people using different things in their trannys. i use hydrolic oil..... some use 80/90..... some use engine oil........... i mean holy cow. which would you say???? ....

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greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2011-09-12          180317


Lubrication varies with tractor design. Yours is a conventional geared tractor with a manual gear boxes and a separate hydraulic sump. This type tractor takes regular gear oil in the front diff, the creeper, the tranny, and the rear diff. 80W90 is just fine for Missouri, unless you want to fpend the extra bucks for 75W90 or 85W90 synthetic. Expensive though, as we're talking 5 gallons total in your tractor. The separate hydraulic sump (under the seat) takes regular hydraulic fluid, either AW32 or ISO100. Synthetics are available too, but not really necessary. Caution: don't confuse AW32 machine oil with AW32 hydraulic fluid though.

What is/was in the bellhousing was not necessarily oil. A lot of dry dirt and moisture mixes with clutch dust, and has nowhere to go but out the weep hole. Sometimes that mixture has the appearance of oil, but only when allowed to accumulate. Otherwise it stays dirty, but relatively dry. Water gets in primarily from condensation (sitting outside day and night), but can accumulate a lot faster if you pressure wash. This is especially true if you have the vented inspection window covers. My tractors would stay outside for days - sometimes weeks - at a time, and I'd pressure wash them at least once a year. Under those conditions I made damn sure to keep the weep holes open at all times.

//greg// ....

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rogerjdundee
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14 greers feery,arkansas
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2012-06-06          183785


I have the same seal problem,I removed the 4 bolts that holds the bracket that covers the seal, cant get the bracket to release from the transmission so I can replace the seal ....

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greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2012-06-06          183787


Might I suggest a jack?

//greg// ....

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rogerjdundee
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14 greers feery,arkansas
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2012-06-08          183801


I finally used a rope and hitched it around the bracket and tied a winch to it and tapped lightly in all directions,then the bracket bearing and large spline with a couple gears came off as one unit.I checked if something got broke but looked ok,waiting on 2 oil rings and seal to go on shaft ....

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greg_g
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2012-06-08          183803


Quote:
Originally Posted by rogerjdundee | view 183801
then the bracket bearing and large spline with a couple gears came off as one unit.I checked if something got broke but looked ok,waiting on 2 oil rings and seal to go on shaft
Um, you're gonna have to be more specific. When I responded to your question, I thought you were trying to remove the loader brackets from the bell housing.

Apparently you already have the tractor split it half. Please elaborate on what you're actually trying to do, so that I can get on the right track here.

//greg// ....

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clutch replacement

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rogerjdundee
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14 greers feery,arkansas
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2012-06-08          183811


Sorry,I had oil leaking from transmission end ,getting on clutch and dripping out of holes under neath,causing clutch to slip,broke tractor in half on agracat 254 and could see drip coming out of clutch collum--the part the throwout bearing slides on!.I removed 4 bolts and the bracket would not come off until I tie a rope around and hand winched it out while tapping with a rubber mallet,it came out with bearing still inside of bracket with large spline and a couple of small gears,nothing seems to be broke,but Im still trying to get bearing out to replace seal and o rings are on order ....

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greg_g
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Posts: 1816 Western Kentucky
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2012-06-08          183815


Ah, now I see. We just don't speak the same technical language. When you split at the bellhousing, the clutch is in the front half. Sounds like you're working on the back half. Right? So what you call the "clutch column" is likely the creeper input shaft. And the leak you're talking about is actually coming from the mid-connect/creeper housing.

If I'm understanding you correctly, you removed four bolts from the plate that has the shaft protruding through the center. If true, that's a bearing carrier. Behind it is a flat gasket. It's probably trashed, and I'd recommend cutting your own replacement out of bulk material suitable for oil and fuel. Too bad they didn't use an oil seal here, but nothing can be done about that now.

But assuming you removed the circlip that's in front of the bearing, I don't know why the guts came out. You may have a little extra work in store for you when it comes to putting this back together properly. But here I gotta stop, and ask which mid-connect box you have; one inspection plate on the right side? or a pair - one on either side?

If I'm not understanding you correctly, tell me where I made the wrong turn.


//greg// ....

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rogerjdundee
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14 greers feery,arkansas
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2012-06-09          183829


there is a plate on both sides ....

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rogerjdundee
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 14 greers feery,arkansas
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2012-06-09          183830


Quote:
Originally Posted by greg_g | view 183815
Ah, now I see. We just don't speak the same technical language. When you split at the bellhousing, the clutch is in the front half. Sounds like you're working on the back half. Right? So what you call the "clutch column" is likely the creeper input shaft. And the leak you're talking about is actually coming from the mid-connect/creeper housing. If I'm understanding you correctly, you removed four bolts from the plate that has the shaft protruding through the center. If true, that's a bearing carrier. Behind it is a flat gasket. It's probably trashed, and I'd recommend cutting your own replacement out of bulk material suitable for oil and fuel. Too bad they didn't use an oil seal here, but nothing can be done about that now. But assuming you removed the circlip that's in front of the bearing, I don't know why the guts came out. You may have a little extra work in store for you when it comes to putting this back together properly. But here I gotta stop, and ask which mid-connect box you have; one inspection plate on the right side? or a pair - one on either side?If I'm not understanding you correctly, tell me where I made the wrong turn.//greg//
....

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greg_g
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2012-06-10          183832


Quote:
Originally Posted by rogerjdundee | view 183829
there is a plate on both sides
Ok, this might help then. http://johnstractor.homestead.com/files/ClutchHouse.jpg

//greg// ....

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rogerjdundee
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Posts: 14 greers feery,arkansas
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2012-06-10          183833


Wow,thats it,thanks ....

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herribe
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 2 Oklahoma
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2014-01-09          188634


Roger,

How did your repair turn out? Did it all go back together the way it was supposed to? ....

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