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JD-855-in-WI
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 36 Wisconsin
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2010-08-05          172825

Looking to update the wife's lawn tractor a Bolens QT16. We've been looking at the all wheel steer tractors. Looked at a Kubota but it didn't have power steering. We have 3 acres of trees and plantings to mow around and she doesn't want a ZT. I use the compact with a MM for the hills and wet areas.
Anybody have any experience with quad steer?


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earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2010-08-05          172827

My neighbor has one a JD. She likes cutting grass slowly. To me it's an just a gimicky, over-priced lawn tractor. Cub Cadet makes a zt-like machine that has a steering wheel, looks like a typical lawn tractor, but it has non-steerable (controlable) casters so it acts like a ZT. TSC sold them. I saw one being used and it reminded me of being in a bumper car. ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2010-08-05          172829

I have Kubota rider that is a non-power steering 4WS model, a G2000 HST.

Unless you are completely stopped the steering takes very little effort at all.

As for the steering itself, it's handy if you have things (like trees and garden beds) edged properly. In that case you never need to use a trimmer, and can cut 360° around and right to the edging of even a small tree in a single pass. It also makes making a 3 point turn in a small area really easy. Also, if you cut grass like plowing a field, leaving a piece of 'head lands' at each end, you can make a U-turn and go back down the next row with only about the length of the mower itself for turning around.

Best of luck. ....

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kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2010-08-05          172830

EW, Husky did have a mower along the line you are talking about sold possibly only by Lowes. Talked with Husky dealership and he was not impressed with them. Said they were slow mowing speed and think there was issue with steering.


JD, we used MM mower for years. 10 years ago we went to Rear Finish Mower on tractor and big improvement in cutting time. Then about four years maybe five we bought a ZTR for trimming or so we thought. We have about a 2 1/2 acre yard with probably 30 or more trees on it we cut around. Using the RFM mower 72 inch wide it took about 2 1/2 hours plus string trimmer. Using the ZTR with a 52 inch deck (same brand as the RFM so a very much fair head to head) we cut it in at least 30 minutes less and seldom need the string trimmer. Now we do use Roundup some trying to elimiate string trimmer either way.

Before we got the ZTR my wife said I will use the tractor and you use it which was fine. Still remember the day my wife began "trying" it a friend was there and he said..you have lost that mower. She rather run it by far than either the MM mower or CUT with RFM. Noted you use a MM mower on slopes and wet areas and the ZTR is not the best for those. Do I think every home owner needs or should have a ZTR nope. With the dual stick steer hard not to run full speed and be straight. I have a neighor who prossibly has Husky's finest MM Mower and it went down a week or so back. I took my ZTR and completed his yard for him and he told me...man was that fast. I need one of those. He is only 71 which is only 14 more than me. Our 12 year old neice who had only ever used a MM mower tried our ZTR a couple of weeks back and within 15 or 20 minutes was doing very well with it.

But your question was experience on the four wheel steer and I can not help you. But do remember at least some companies tell you the radius on those mowers and many people think diameter and don't realize you must double the radius to get the diameter.

If I had to cut that size yard would get a home owner ZTR. Realize there is a learning curve, set deck high and cut off and let myself or wife at maybe 50% throttle get in middle of large opening just play with it. Might be the most fun you ever had driving. Many dealers will have an area you can drive them there. One thing, have never seen a grass catcher for a ZTR that I like. ....

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auerbach
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 2168 West of Toronto
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2010-08-05          172832

Not that I've tried one, but if 4WS was successful, wouldn't it be more popular? Anyway, here's a story for the missus.

I've used my yannie since new for mowing and implement work but needed an effective leaf vacuum with a large self-dumping hopper. Most impressed with the Grasshopper, so got that. Wasn't planning to mow with it and was dismayed by its comparative lack of traction, so figured to fire it up just twice a year.

It happens to have a front mower on it (to chop and vacuum the leaves). So I tried it for some mowing while I was servicing the yannie. After a week of experience (took longer to really learn than I thought), it's so effective and agile that now the Yanmar mower's just backup.

Now I know why the lawn-care guys use zero-turns. And there are lots way cheaper than the Grasshopper. ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2010-08-05          172833

Quote:
Originally Posted by auerbach | view 172832
Not that I've tried one, but if 4WS was successful, wouldn't it be more popular?


It's like anything, there's always a percentage of the population that won't be frightened off by the sticker shock, but the vast majority are very price sensitive.

As an example, a Kubota T2380 (regular 23hp Kohler-powered rider with a 42" deck) has a MSRP of $5,593.

The same basic mower, a Kubota GR2010 (rider with a Kubota 20hp and 48" deck, but with the Glide-Steer option) has a MSRP of $8,950.

That makes the upgrade from Kohler to Kubota power plant and the Glide-Steer a $3,357 bump up.

Most people would go to a big box store and not even spend the $3,357 on the whole mower, let alone paying that much in options.

That goes a long way to explaining why they aren't that popular.

Best of luck. ....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2010-08-06          172859

I don't remember the model numbers or the cost but I have demoed Deere's four wheel steer and their stick steer mowers a couple years back. Both were fine but just cost to much for our needs, we have a flagpole and two trees in an acre and a half of lawn at the farm and three trees in a half acre of lawn in town, so Roundup is my string trimmer.
We've got two Deere 345's one at the farm and one in town with a total of about 1,100 hours between them and I seriously doubt that I can outlive either of them.
I would have a hard time buyig a new mower of any design again when the Deere dealers have so many good late model used ones on the lot that thay could completely stop building new ones for two years and never run out. ....

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kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2010-08-07          172875

Murf touched on this and Jd you were talking to me a very quality brand. I just wonder what percentage of those who buy the big box model are pleased and using that mower 10, 20 years later? At same time if you are not going to take care of it nothing holds up. ....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2010-08-07          172880

KT;
A late model low hour Deere, kinda average size, 54 in. cut, 22-24 hp. with power steering, non four wheel steer, cruse, hydro, etc. and usually with a decent warranty will cost twice what a new box store Deere does.
The big difference is the box store Deere is shot in a few years and the Deere store used one will with good maintenence and non abusive use outlast three or more box store ones.
Frank. ....

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JD-855-in-WI
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 36 Wisconsin
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2010-08-12          173051

I’d like to thank everyone for the input. We’ve decided to grease up the Bolens Qt and finish out the year with it. It comes down to a realization that there is 40 years of use on both of the Bolens and they probably steer almost as easy as day I bought them. But we both have 60 years of wear and tear we don’t work as well as we used to. We plan to buy a new JD all wheel steer in the spring and pass the current tractors on to the sons. I’d like to see any big box store tractors hold up like these Bolens have. Built too good, no return customers put them out of business. ....

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earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2010-08-12          173053

Perhaps the model Bolens you have is no longer made but Bolens is still in business.

The MTD website says they make them along with Cub Cadet, Garden Way, White Outdoor, Yardmachines and others. Now, they may "make" them but in reality they're under license and possibly a rebadged old MTD machine of yore.

Other websites say Bolens is made by TroyBilt, which could be another license agreement. I forget who owns TroyBilt. 30 years ago TroyBilt was a respecxted mfg. Today, not so much. ....

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treeman
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 251 Wisconsin
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2010-12-07          175601

The local deere dealer had a open house a couple years ago and we were able to test drive the equipment. My wife and I test drove the aws deere tractors and were impressed. They had many lawn obsticles to mow around and my wife did so with great control. I would trust her to mow around the yard trees without knocking the bark off. I would NOT trust her with a ZTR. I am trying to find a 700 series with a 24hp diesel with the 60" deck at a good price. They have a uncut circle of 12" (dia). ....

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kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2010-12-09          175636

Treeman, got tickled at not trusting your wife with ZTR and I understand that if due to no experience. One of the first times my wife ran ours she went down a steep ditch at her Mom's. However the first time I cut with ZTR went down that same ditch the same place. Think my wife or I will 99% of the time manage to cut to the bark on a tree with out any bumping. That is with about four years running ZTR for 1 to 3 yards depending on the family. We have been very pleased with ZTR and would not consider anything else at this point. THAT being said realize not for everyone nor every lawn. Bout like straight drive transmission...great if you know how to use them and like them. ....

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treeman
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 251 Wisconsin
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2010-12-09          175637

Some of my yard with trees is on a slope. I would think that would make it difficult for a ZTR to manage. The neighbor has a hard time mowing the slopes in the ditch with his ZTR. It's hard driving a ZTR with one hand holding a beer too. :) ....

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kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2010-12-09          175644

Treeman, the one place I do not like our ztr and would not recommend one is a slope that is wet. Since your rear wheels are having to do the driving and steering a wet slope to me can not only be fun (if you like sliding sideways) but terrible to cut. My mother in laws yard has a good slope for our part of the world than when it rains not only has run off but seepage out of if from field it joins. If it is wet my compact tractor and mower cuts that slope. The ztr does not want to even climb it but some of that is the difference in weight and tread. The all wheel steer here I just don't see but 99% of our lawns is near flat. ....

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JD-855-in-WI
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 36 Wisconsin
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2010-12-19          175863

Hello:

Just wanted to provide additional feedback, after trying out a number of tractors from different dealers, we purchased a X724 Deere with a 64" deck from a Deere dealer in Monroe WI. For our purposes this seemed like the best unit for our needs. We are happy with the handling, ease of access to service points and the increased width stability. Hope it performs as well as our 855 has. I wonder if these are built in Horicon, WI?

FYI: Bolens was build in Port Washington, WI back in the 60s/70s.

Happy Holidays and God bless our troops ....

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