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bobkro32
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 38 Mill Spring, North Carolina
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2005-11-01          118771

I'm looking for a used compact utility tractor (25 HP or less to do light landscaping/mowing on 6 acres). I stopped by an equipment rental store, which also sold the Simplicity brand of tractor. The dealer said the Simplicity brand was really a Massey Ferguson, just with different decals. I certainly know of the MF.

Does anyone have any experience with the Simplicity brand?

Appreciate your response.

b


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Peters
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 3034 Northern AL
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2005-11-01          118772

The small MF tractors are Iseki, made in Japan. Whether AGCO the parent company of MF owns part of Iseki or not is not known. AGCO sells the same line as of small tractors as Challenger, AGCO and MF.
Simplicity manufactured one of the better lawn tractors. The only Simplicity in the line which is a subcompact is the Legacy XL. It looks like a garden tractor on steroids and a north american design. MF sells a GC series. Which is a larger tractor. The simplicity might use Iseki components, by I doubt it is built by Iseki.
....

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beagle
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1333 Michigan
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2005-11-02          118781

Not going to claim to know exactly what the Boardroom ties are, but AGCO and Simplicity have a business arrangement of some kind. Massey Ferguson is a "marketing label" that belongs to AGCO. AGCO and Simplicity market some of the same products under different names, but are seperate business entities.

Your dealer had something a little backwards for the sake of making you feel like you were looking at a tractor. It is true that AGCO markets the exact same tractor as the Legacy, as both an Agco and MF. The Simlicity Legacy is not a MF, Simplicity manufactures the Legacy, right here in the USA, and sells them under their own label and under AGCO marketing labels. A Massey Ferguson is really anything but any more, as the previous poster pointed out. The MF is just a marketing label that belongs to AGCO.

By the way, Simplicity makes an excellent product. The people in Port Washington do a great job at what they do. The quality of the legacy is every bit as good as the Gree, Orange, and Blue tractors discussed on this board. But, The Legacy is not a Sub-compact yet. It truly is the best garden tractor you can buy. The problem Simplicity has is that you can get a sub-compact for the same price. They re-designed the Legacy a couple years ago, but stopped short of turning it into a sub-compact. But, best garden tractor you can buy. ....

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bobkro32
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 38 Mill Spring, North Carolina
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2005-11-02          118800

Beagle and Peters--

The model that I looked out had a FEL, MMM, and a rear PTO/ class 1 3 point hitch. As you say, it looked like the Green, Orange and Blue models I have looked at. The price was higher than any of those models, but maybe my price info is a bit out of date for the other models.

If I understand correctly, the Legacy's performance would be equivalent to the corresponding Green, Orange, and Blue models. Is that correct?

tks

b ....

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AV8R
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 882 North Central Wisconsin
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2005-11-02          118802

...But, The Legacy is not a Sub-compact yet... Beagle said.

I will concur after looking at them as well. They are a large and well made garden tractor, but a sub-compact utility tractor (Orange, blue or green) is a miniature farm tractor. There is a huge differance. Look closely and you'll see. ....

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Peters
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 3034 Northern AL
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2005-11-02          118804

From the pricing you could get something like a Kioti CK-20 which is more than a sub compact tractor. ....

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beagle
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2005-11-02          118805

We had a Legacy at one time, FEL, Rear PTO, 3-point, etc. This was before the XL model came out, but after looking at the XL, they made some valuable modifications, but fell short of making it a sub-compact utility tractor. I would put it a grade below the BX or 2200 series JD for size and capability. I would put it a grade above the rest for quality. They are an extremely well built machine, but the features don't match up. The hydraulic system alone is lacking to use as a utility tractor. The model we had used electric clutches for the PTO engagements, front and rear. The hydraulics might have been improved along with pto engagements, but these are a few features you should take a good look at before you decide.

Simplicity was a great company to deal with. The people in Port Washington were very helpful and knowledgeable. Just make sure you match your needs with the machine. And, besides the Kawasaki LC engine option, they are American Made. ....

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DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998
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2005-11-02          118811

The Simplicity is a nice machine, and it really fits somewhere above a garden tractor and below a sub compact, at a sub compact price. When I looked at one at a dealer it was apparent that it was not quite where the NH, Deere and Kubota are in the sub compact market. ....

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oldrental
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 13 Alaska
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2005-11-02          118827

Wasn’t Simplicity purchased by Briggs & Stratton over a year ago. ....

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BrendonN
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 89 Central Kansas
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2005-11-03          118829

To clarify a bit, the Massey Ferguson brand is part of the AGCO family (along with AGCO, Challenger, Fendt, Hesston, New Idea, White, Glencoe, and others) but Simplicity is not. Simplicity does make the lawn and garden tractors that AGCO sells under the MF and AGCO brand names. Once you get to the sub-compact GC2300 and CUTs, the tractors are made by Iseki in Japan. AGCO does not own Iseki but there has been a working relationship between the two companies for quite some time. ....

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beagle
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1333 Michigan
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2005-11-03          118831

This could get to be some fun. The owners manual for our Legacy was also the Manual for the Maassey Ferguson and the Agco tractor. All three were labeled on the front of the manual. Since I sold the manual with the tractor, I can't remember the model numbers for each, but we saw our Legacy with the Agco and Massey Ferguson name plates on it several times. When we talked to the Simplicity people about it, they would only say there was a sales agreement between Agco and Simplicity. Massey Ferguson was nothing more than a nameplate (any more) owned by Agco.

The Legacy was sold under three name plates: Simplicity, Massey Ferguson, and Agco. Simplicity manufactured all of them. Whether they still do or not, I don't know. It's been a couple years since we were involved with all of that. ....

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Peters
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 3034 Northern AL
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2005-11-03          118842

Beagle; any idea what diesel engine they were using? ....

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beagle
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2005-11-03          118843

They are available with Kohler Command air cooled gas, Kawasaki liquid cooled gas, or Briggs and Straton Diesel. I believe it is a 27hp diesel. The gas options ranged from 20hp to 25hp, but they may have made some tweeks to that to. ....

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Peters
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Posts: 3034 Northern AL
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2005-11-03          118851

The MF GC version is a 22.5 hp 3 cylinder which is the same as the 1523. I assume that it is an Iseki? Is the Briggs diesel a Daihatsu Diesel? Is it water cooled or air? Is it reliable? ....

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beagle
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2005-11-03          118855

It's definitely water cooled, and definitly available as 27hp. Other than that, Never checked to see if they manufacturer themselves or are buying them from someone. You never know any more. You might check out their website, it's pretty informative. ....

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Peters
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Posts: 3034 Northern AL
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2005-11-03          118885

Beagle I checked, it is manufactured in Japan by Daihatsu which is part of Toyota. Briggs has a commercial engine partnership with Diahatsu. I suspect they are importing the small Daihatsu diesels and placing their name on them. ....

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beagle
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2005-11-04          118889

Would not surprise me. The only thing we Americans seem to make any more is trouble, and there isn't anyone better than us at that. ....

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Peters
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Posts: 3034 Northern AL
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2005-11-04          118898

Well to me it may means there is a little hope. In reading Briggs and Daihatsu have been working together on engine design and fabrication. They built a new plant in Japan for the commercial engines. I think some of the improvement in the Briggs engines such as the V twins is part of this process. Having worked on British equipment one of my biggest fears is that we continue to develop the not invented here attitude. Ever worked on a Sea Gull Outboard? It looks and runs like 30's Johnsons. ....


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