John Deere  BH 46: John Deere Review  -- John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum and Review John Deere BH 46: John Deere Review -- John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum

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Discussion Boards > Active Subjects > Messages as Posted > John Deere Review Forum

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 05-01-2006, 08:01 Post: 128640
wingwiper



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  John Deere BH 46

As we were writting about and discussing last fall, my BH 46, back boom will drop 1 inch per minute with the engine running. I was told to run it with the travel pin in, because I had complained that by the time I could drive to the other side of the hole, the boom would tilt and cause the bucket to drag.
They cam out in November and replaced an SCV Valve, claiming that John Deere had gone to a different Manufacturer about 5 years ago.
This weekend was the first chance I have had to hook up and use the BH 46 since the repair. IT MADE ABSOLUTELY ZERO DIFFERENCE, it still drops just as fast as it did before.I didn't even get the hydralics up to a Hot temp and it was dropping. I just got off the phone with the dealer, no other ideas for solving this annoying problem. Keep in mind, this is under NO Load and with the engine running.
Oh Yeah Hey Dr, have you had a problem with that Grease fitting mounted on the very bottom of the boom I am referring to, shearing off? I have, everytime a rock rolls down and hits the back of the BH, it usually will shear off that grease fitting, I replaced it twice yesterday. I refer to the base of the boom where the two cylinders that make it go left or right, under that pivot, on the bottom side is suppose to be a Grease fitting, if you are like me, it probably looks like a Dipple.






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 05-01-2006, 08:12 Post: 128642
DRankin



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  John Deere BH 46

I had better go out and look after breakfast.

The basic cause for the droop has to be the scv valve. I have often wondered if they could be matched with another brand or rebuilt to tighter tolerances at a good hydraulics shop.

If I asked this before pardon my memory flux.... What sort of hydraulic oil are you using?






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 05-01-2006, 08:19 Post: 128643
wingwiper



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  John Deere BH 46


I had it serviced (50hr was actually 80 hr) in August and they put in the JD stuff, Purple, Yellow label on a white jug. I still have some in the container out in the yard.
They replaced the SCV Valve after I told them I had two friends who bought the Orange and they do NOT have a problem, at all.
DR the grease fitting is a 1/4" short and it won't come out with an extractor bit, I just drilled it and screwed the new one right in, twice.






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 05-01-2006, 08:19 Post: 128644
wingwiper



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  John Deere BH 46


I had it serviced (50hr was actually 80 hr) in August and they put in the JD stuff, Purple, Yellow label on a white jug. I still have some in the container out in the yard.
They replaced the SCV Valve after I told them I had two friends who bought the Orange and they do NOT have a problem, at all.
DR the grease fitting is a 1/4" short and it won't come out with an extractor bit, I just drilled it and screwed the new one right in, twice.






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 05-01-2006, 08:31 Post: 128646
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  John Deere BH 46

ww, sorry to hear about your issues...

My 46BH will drop maybe an inch per hour with the engine off. I have not noticed any dropping with the engine on.

No issues with the grease fitting either, but then again I don't do much work with rocks. You may need to bolt/weld on a small guard or something.

Jason






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 05-01-2006, 08:36 Post: 128647
DRankin



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  John Deere BH 46

First: I think I am looking at the same grease fitting and it points UP on mine and is protected .... no chance that a rock could hit it.

Second: Read the label on that oil. If it says Low-Vis it is a big part of the problem.






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 05-01-2006, 09:59 Post: 128655
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  John Deere BH 46

Based on past experience a hydraulic cylinder that self-lowers is usually caused by internal cylinder seals and NOT the seals in the SCV's themselves.

This is not say it cannot be a defective or otherwise compromised SCV seal.

Basically if you think of a hydraulic system under pressure like a chain, the weakest link will always let go first. In a hydraulic circuit that is almost always the cylinder seals.

This is because they are NOT protected from shock loads by the relief valve when in system is in the "hands off" position, and why they give you a 'travel pin' in the first place, to mechanically protect the boom seals (the most vulnerable) from shock loads in this 'hands off' situation. Doing things like driving while carrying large rocks or stumps or logs with the BH can destroy a seal in seconds.

Once a seal has been compromised it is garbage and must be replaced. It's not tough to do, nor even expensive, but it does mean the cylinder must be removed from the machine to do it. Luckily in the case of the boom cylinder this is remarkably easy.

This kind of seal failure is easy to diagnose in a BH, but is sneaky since it mimicks a SCV failure or leak because there is no oil visible, all the oil leaking past the seal stays on the inside.

BTW, the same is true of a FEL or 3PTH lift cylinder, exceeding load capacity can cause a seal to be FUBAR in seconds, and cause a major PITA.

Best of luck.






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 05-01-2006, 10:48 Post: 128659
wingwiper



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  John Deere BH 46

DR
Points up?? How can it point up? are you sure you are looking at the same fitting? There is one that you grease that points up, on top for the left to right movement, but look at the base of the boom that is closest to the tractor and you will see the bottom most pivot, where the back boom pivots up and down from. There is No fitting on the inside top, only the hose going to the cylinder, on the very bottom of that pivot, is where the fitting was put. Not only will a small rock rolling down get it as it did yesterday but if you scarpe the bottom of the BH over dirt or whatever it will also shear it off.
I believe it is Low-visc and was told to use it in Summer months, the dealer was the last to put the hydralic oil in, I will be putting new oil in, in about 15 hrs.
Murf
Supposedly the dealer checked the cylinder at the 50 hr service and again when they brought it back in November to replace the SCV Valve, they said it is NOT the seal. It has been doing it from Day one. It is very annoying and a hassle to always have to keep jumping off and inserting the travel pin.
I have worked many a Hydralic Appratus and have NEVER had a unit drop so badly, WITH THE ENGINE running as I do with this BH. Damn thing works like crazy but drops like crazy too.






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 05-01-2006, 10:51 Post: 128660
wingwiper



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  John Deere BH 46

I also doubt I am going beyond Load Capicity, because if it can lift it, I am OK. If it can't lift it, then I would say I am beyond load capicity. I think it is more SNAFU
I have no problems with any other section of the BH, 3 ph or FEL, just that one boom.






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 05-01-2006, 11:34 Post: 128664
Murf



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  John Deere BH 46

WW, that's why I said it's a sneaky one to diagnose.

Lifting is one thing, if the cyclinder seal is gone, as long as you're pouring in more fluid than can leak out, it will lift normally.

The problem only shows when you let go of the SCV, then the fluid that is leaking out is not being replaced, and down she goes.

The motor running has no bearing, on either the SCV seal, or cylinder seals, since the SCV, in a 'hands off' situtation, has no fluid going in or out to or from the BH, or whatever else is downstream of the SCV.

The test is simple, if you have quick disconnects, it's really simple. With QD fittings, put the BH boom all the way up, and QUICKLY unplug the fittings. If the boom still settles down, it's the cylinder seals, if it stays up the cylinder is OK. If you don't have QD's, you have to put a 1/4 turn ball valve (of suitable pressure rating of course) between the BH, and the SCV on both boom cylinder lines. Same drill, put the boom all the way & quickly close both valves fully.

Best of luck.






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Discussion Boards > Active Subjects > Messages as Posted > John Deere Review Forum

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DRankin 6 | JasonR 3 | kwschumm 1 | Murf 6 | ncrunch32 1 | wingwiper 13 |

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