Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce: Landscape Design  -- Landscape Discussion Forum and Review Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce: Landscape Design -- Landscape Discussion Forum

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 10-13-2003, 21:37 Post: 66167
Ducati996



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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce


Hello everyone,
Need advice on building a privacy barrier w/ dwarf fur or spruce (open to suggestions) I have at least 128 ft that i would like to build a nice barrier that will cover a 6' chainlink fence between properties. How do I estimate how much dirt to build a mound ? how high do I make the mound?and how do I estimate how many trees? I do not want a tree to grow full size like a 30 ft spruce, just high enough to give some protection (under 10ft), so i would assume a dwarf species?
This is not my strong suite (as you can tell) so any advice is appreciated. I'm located in NY (long Island) so the climate conditions are typical NE conditions.

Thanks in advance
Ducati996






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 10-14-2003, 07:03 Post: 66179
TomG

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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce

I'd look at how fast a species grows in your area. You likely want privacy now and many trees are pretty slow growing in some areas. Some species limb up from the ground after they start maturing and then there goes the privacy. Some species are Christmas tree shaped and also wouldn't provide great privacy. If you ever want to take them out it might be good to avoid species that tend to form taproots. Poplar grow fast and provide decent dense bush for a few years till they get bigger but they loose their leafs in the winter and again there goes the privacy. Besides most deciduous species make for pretty ratty bush--especially during winter.

I know these are issues rather than suggestions. I'd probably think of something like a cedar hedge myself and that would still take a few years.

I don't know about mounding. Here in logging country reforested areas are mounded only if the soil is bad enough that only jack pine would grow very well. A nursery where the stock would be bought could advise on spacing for a particular species as well as species that hedge up well.






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 10-14-2003, 08:21 Post: 66187
DennisCTB

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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce

I assume you are talking about building a berme and planting on top of it? This is a very common solution to privacy issues. A berme can take alot of dirt, a tandem load is about 20 yards and can make a pile about 12 feet wide, 4- 5 feet high and about 20 feet long. Of course that is loose soil and will compact somewhat. Where I am if it were high end screened enriched topsoil the load would run about $600.

The most common thing on bermes in NJ is a combination mix of white pine, douglas fir, and a few hardwoods, along with some leafy shrubs only my wife knows the names of.

These trees all grow quite big, but if you like to trim you can prune them like shrubs if you like. If you have deer like I do avoid the white pine the deer think it is pretty tasty in the Winter time, use doug fir they don't ever eat it, in fact they will eat juniper instead (gotta be hungry) and leave the doug fir alone.

If you have a very narrow width and want to delay trimming you could use Alberta Spruce which are very small dwarf plants that only get to be 4 feet in diameter,by maybe 10 feet at maturity but this will be very pricey costing you $65 for a 3 foot plant, that grows painfully slow.

There is also a bluish tint plant that is very cheap narrow and tall that I don't care for that is very popular for privacy screens that don't have much space available.

Dennis
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 10-14-2003, 09:20 Post: 66192
Chief



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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce

Have you considered Austrees? They are of the species Salix matsudana x alba, a form of Willow tree. They are not for everyone or all locations but I can tell you that these things grow FAST and if you keep them pruned you can train them to grow into a bush, tree, or hedge. I planted them on my property and they grow faster than anything I have including Tulip Poplar and they are fast. They need LOTS of water and do not like drought. They have survived the winters here in TN but not sure how they would do in NY. They are easy to grow new trees from cuttings so you don't have to buy more if you want more later. Here are some links to some pros and cons:

http://www.colostate.edu/Depts/CoopExt/4DMG/Trees/austree.htm

http://www.linnextension.org/mg/public/austree.htm

http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/homestead/Countryside/Wc85ad8f91c5c9.htm






Link:   Rocky Mountain Austree Inc. 

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 10-14-2003, 09:57 Post: 66198
Art White



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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce

Where you are looking to do the hedge is it in the sandy type soil on the end of Long Island? They do have plenty of shrubs growing out there to sample from.






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 10-14-2003, 11:06 Post: 66210
Ducati996



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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce

Some good ideas !! Dennis gave me some dimensions based on 20 yrds worth of fill. I think 12 ft for me is too wide, I'm thinking 6 ft max. and I think 4 ft heigh would be the max. I want to go. I know have to think total lenght to cover is 128 ft. straight line. Alberta dawrf sounds close for sure, I'm not looking into a fast growing maintence freak of a tree !! it will be watered of course, and the soil content is the north non-sandy part of Long island(very good).The existing fence height is 6 ft vinyl chain link, to give some privacy between properites. I like my neighbors, just dont want to see them everyday in their yard. We have enough space 2 acres parcels
but line of sight on one side is open. This is a very common application, which I'm now ready to start thinking about doing ( Now that I have my JD4100 that is). I think I will spot the same layout on someones yard, and take a digital picture of what I want. Just dont know how to estimate the amount of dirt, or plants (with space for growing)....
You guys are very helpful indeed, I appreciate it fully !!

Ducati996






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 10-14-2003, 12:14 Post: 66215
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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce

Ducati, take it from experience, you will not build a berm that is 4' high but only 6' wide, not unless it is made of concrete. The maximum you should make a slope is 2:1 (two horizontal feet for each vertical foot) which works out to 8' wide, EACH SIDE of the center line for a total width of 16' for the berm.

If you want to be able to comfortably cut the grass on it with a riding mower you should stay to a maximum of 3:1 for a width of 12' each side of center for a total width of 24' not inclding any flat area on top, or a set-back from the property line. Some municipalities require a set-back in case the soil slumps down off the hill, that way it doesn't run out onto a neighbours property. In your case you mentioned a chain-link fence, in this case you should leave the berm back from the fence at least a few feet to allow you to cut the grass there without getting stuck in the fence.

IMHO, unless you are REALLY stuck on the idea of a berm, I would suggest you seriously consider planting a double wide row of swamp (white) cedars along the fence line. The cost will be a lot less and it will be easier to maintain in the long run.

Best of luck.






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 10-14-2003, 15:53 Post: 66236
Ducati996



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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce

I'm probably not explaining clearly how I invision it.
Its common around here, where a row of Dwarf trees (evergreens, pine, fur or other)line up next to the fence line. The mulch/fill part will not be mowed, smaller berme than whats being described is used. An actual application
which I just got feedback on, was using Arborvities and/or white pines and the berme was no bigger than 30" high and 8 ft wide. Mulch was the covering w/ weed control cloth underneath...does this paint a clearer picture? This will be butted up next to the fence line, so no mower will be used between berme and fence line.






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 10-14-2003, 20:37 Post: 66258
Cutnfill



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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce

Just a couple of thoughts. You will have to figure on watering trees planted on a berm more often than ones on flat ground. Your plant material will be limited if you want to berm, stay around 6 feet tall, be evergreen, and not be triming constantly.

Dwarf Alberta spruce grows very slowly and thus makes it a very expensive piece to use. They also can be prone to insects, Red Spider for one. A nice looking plant could become ugly pretty quick.

Dark American Arborvite would do well. They do have a 12'
top out range if never trimed. Your best bet would be to use upright Japanese Holly if you want a hedge where you can easily control the height. Dwarf Burford Holly or Chinese Holly if you want to leave space between the plants.

Number of plants depends on the plant you choose their size both at planting and maturity and effect you want instant or with time. If Bissett Nursery is close to you talk to them for ideas.






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 10-15-2003, 06:42 Post: 66279
Ducati996



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 Need advice on building a privacy barrier w dwarf fur or spruce

cutnfill,

You must be familiar with this area called Long Island. Bissett is close enough, and the largest nursery I would say on the island..your tips are very much welcomed!!
I'm glad the size I'm trying to descibe is a little clearer.
I know exactly what application Murf described, and I would apply that type if I'm building a barrier to filter out lets say road noise and its view. Too big for what I'm doing. How does one calculate the amount of fill need for 128' with an approx 2' height, 8' wide max berme...
I will go to Bissett this weekend...

Thanks again,

Ducati996






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