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RichT
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 33 SOCAL
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2003-06-10          57246


I've owned mine now for about 9 months and VERY satisfied...until...

Just finished my 50hr checkup this weekend including a complete fluid/filters change. Since I emptied the trans I pulled the trans screen filter (on suction line accessed in left wheel well). To my surprise, several relatively large metal filings had attached themselves to the screen.

After a bit of detective work, I discovered the filings were produced by cross threading the screen filter with the transmission housing, apparently during factory assembly. Of course, I don't know if any smaller metal material penetrated the filter screen. None were evident in the extracted transmission fluid.

Complete story and pictures at link below. Would appreciate suggestions from owners and dealers alike on my next step.



Link:   Filter Screen Problem Link

 


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Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2003-06-10          57247


At our dealerships I have not heard of this problem and it very well maybe just a one time thing. When assembling tractors or cars or most anthing often there is foreign particales of metel loose in the housings. Sometimes it might be brass from the hammers they use or in this case the threads from the filter. That is why they change the fluids at 50 hours the first time instead of a longer interval. ....


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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2003-06-10          57269


Yikes!
Rich, FYI, when I pulled my screen at 50 hours it had several small metal chips on it.... not slivers like in your pictures... more like assembly/machining debris/leftovers.

It will be very interesting to see what Kubota does about this. I have seen similar problems repaired on oil pan drain holes that were cross threaded. ....


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RichT
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 33 SOCAL
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2003-06-10          57285


Update: I contacted the dealer today and explained the issue. The dealers initial response was "I wish we would have done the 50hr checkup...", the inference that perhaps I was somehow responsible. I promptly put that one to bed.

The service manager feels there is low probability that metal from the stripped threads entered the trans. He believes that the screen properly filtered the metal particles. He went on to say that if metal particles did penetrate the screen, they would almost certainly be less substantial than common machining and assembly debris. Further, such debris is typically not problematic.

He said the only viable option to repair the stripped thread area would be a transmission replacement and "that might create a lot more probs than it solves." I found that to be an interesting statement.

He did recommend I document this matter with Kubota, which I was planning to do anyway. I'll probably use their website and send them a letter. ....


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WillieH
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 543 New England
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2003-06-10          57291


RichT -

Those shots truly tell a story...maybe more often than not, maybe not. I don't personally have a BX22, however I have other oranges.

I know on the other B series oranges, the location of the tranny filter screen and bung assembly, is loacted on the bottom rightside of the tranny housing facing the rear right wheel. I can tell you that it is almost impossible to get at these, let alone remove it with out the removal of the rear right wheel assembly. To reinstall with the wheel in place, is almost impossible to get a straight alignment with the chamber.

With this in mind, if the location on the BX22 is similar, and again I don't know because I do not have a BX22, then it would be conceivable that, possibly someone tried to save time by removing it and reinstalling it without the wheel removed guaranteeing proper alignment within the chamber threads.

I would not know why anyone, (dealer), would need to remove at such an early time interval, i.e: at point of sale, however stranger things have happened. My guess is that it was assembled incorrectly from the gitgo. Just kind of surprised that it seated properly and did not show signs of dripping.

Willie H.
....


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Glenn-D
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 54 Westmont, Illinois, summer home in Mountain Home Ar.
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2003-06-11          57308


Just did my 50hr service on my BX22 and have some service notes to share. The strainer did have some debris, but nothing unexpected for a new machine. A blast of carb cleaner and then a blow dry, the strainer went right back in. The trans took almost all of a 5 gallon pail of SUPER-UDT fluid. Spec is 2.7 gallons in the owners manual. The manual specifys super udt and there is no other spec given to cross over to another brand of hydraulic fluid. I don't mind using Kubota specified fluids, but I either went to or called 5 dealers before I found one that stocked super udt. One dealer even told me it was special order. Thats crappy.
Glenn ....

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WillieH
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 543 New England
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2003-06-11          57309


Glenn -
My dealers up my way all carry super-udt as a normal stock item. It is pricey by comparison to other oils of lesser grade, however they carry it regularly. You're right...that is kind of crappy!

Willie H.
....


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homedad5acre
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 103 N.E. PA.
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2003-06-11          57311


Interesting, I think I will put this on the list for the dealer when they do my 50hrs service. The maintenance is for the most part fairly simple, but it might be best to try and establish a good relationship with them and let them handle it while under warranty. Of course under close inspection afterwards.

I do have a belief however, that if a dealer actually finds something seriously wrong or otherwise, they will allways try the least expensive fix even if not total, or give "lets wait and see " or "that might be worse" type answers until the warranty expires. I know I'm a bit cynical when it comes to warranties, mainly because companies know when they give a warranty that the warrantee(the customer) is the sole enforcer.

As Mark put it "It will be very interesting to see what Kubota does about this"

Mark, Did you find it necessary to remove the rear wheel when you checked/removed your transmission strainer? ....


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Glenn-D
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 54 Westmont, Illinois, summer home in Mountain Home Ar.
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2003-06-11          57312


The easiest way to get to the strainer is to use the backhoe outrigger to jack up the left side of the tractor and take off the rear wheel. I don't know if the strainer would come out without taking the wheel off. It is tight back there.
Glenn ....


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RichT
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 33 SOCAL
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2003-06-11          57315


WillieH - the filter screen is in the same place on the BX22 that you describe for other orange models. I had to remove the left rear wheel to find it. Since I had to use a breaker bar to get it loose, the wheel had to come off anyway. Without removing the wheel, it could be crossthreaded without too much trouble. I suspect the factory got a little careless and then bumped up the torque to get the assembly to tighten. I don't understand why the entire housing thread wasn't stripped.

Glenn-D: my refill of super UDT took approx 2.6gal.

For those interested, link to my Kubota ltr is below. ....


Link:   Letter

 

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Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2003-06-11          57318


Just a quick note on this from a dealer. The filter screen comes installed from the factory. Depending on what BX grouping they have come different ways to the dealers even with no tires and wheels installed. The service manager was being cautious as to the type of repair which I appreciate. As an owner you want everything perfect! The fact is, your dealer does to! The job of changing a rear end housing easily might take 20 hours to accomplish. Can it or could it be done now, yes. Is the dealer or are dealers busy right now, they had better be as this IS there busiest time. Work with him if you really feel the need to change the housing and let him schedule it for a slower time of year when there will be less stress. There are a lot of parts to remove and install and you wouldn't want to have someone in a hurry again to leave something loose or stripped. ....


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slowrev
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 231 Winchester , KY
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2003-06-11          57325


Looks like an aluminum housing to me. Would not be likely to happen if the housing was steel or iron.
....


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WillieH
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 543 New England
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2003-06-11          57329


RichT -

Thanks for the info.

Willie H. ....


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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2003-06-11          57336


I did not pull the wheel off but I did not have the B/H on at the time.

To avoid cross-threading in cramped quarters I use a little trick I learned years ago when I worked on Artificial Kidney Machines. I put the fitting in the hole and turn it in the direction that it loosens and apply a little down pressure at the same time.

This allows me to feel exactly where the threads "bump over" one another, which is also the exact place you want to be for perfect alignment/engagement. ....


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Glenn-D
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 54 Westmont, Illinois, summer home in Mountain Home Ar.
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2003-06-12          57455


Rich T.
Maybe by me picking up the left side of the tractor it drained more than if it was picked up level? I used the left outrigger to pick the left tire off the ground about 2 inches and took off the tire. The drain plug is on the right side of the trans and maybe it drained out more than expected. I measured a little more than a gallon left out of a 5 gallon pail after refill to the top markd and a new filter. I dunno why this one would be that far out of book specification for a oil change.
Glenn ....


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WillieH
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 543 New England
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2003-06-12          57456


Glenn -
Any chance that the fluid spec in the book is relating to the tractor without the FEL. While you were refilling, maybe more was needed to replenish as the FEL circuit was bleeding itself and refilling as well, rather than just the tranny.(?)
Just a thought

Willie H. ....


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RichT
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 33 SOCAL
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2003-06-13          57492


Glenn-I think WillieH is on to something. I was having a hard time figuring out how you could pour an extra 1.5gal into the tranny. I'm not sure what the hyd circuit capacity is, but it seems possible that since it was engaged there might be a relationship. When I drained mine (and replaced), it came out to nearly 2.6gal in both cases. ....


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RichT
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 33 SOCAL
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2003-06-13          57493


...and when I lifted the left side to remove the tire, I used a floor jack. After removing the tire I lowered the left side to level the tractor, before I changed fluids. ....


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WillieH
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 543 New England
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2003-06-13          57536


Glenn -
Be mindfull that the tranny dipstick/hydraulic stick does not read excessive fluid. The whole intent behind hydraulic fluid use, besides its ability to withstand alot of heat, is to be able to expand, which allows for a faster reaction time for the action of the contol valves.
If your chamber/reservoir is over full, your gonna run the risk of blowing a seal somewhere to relieve the system of expansion pressure.
Be warned...if a seal doesn't let go, something else might, possibly a hose! Check that level on the level.

Good luck

Willie H. ....


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RichT
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 33 SOCAL
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2003-06-17          57866


Update on my orig issue. Kubota apparently received my letter documenting the screen fastener issue and contacted my dealer who called me and left this msg -

"Kubota corporate office received your letter and have it documented. They agree with me [dealer], just go ahead and run it. You still have plenty of warranty left. They have it documented in case of any future problems. Feel at ease. We got you covered."

What do you guys think?...should I take their advice or press for a tranny replacement? ....


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homedad5acre
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 103 N.E. PA.
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2003-06-17          57873


Everything Kubota and the dealer advised you is meaningless unless it is in writing and even then it will be up to you to get representation in the event you have any future problems. This is just my opinion.(now I'm covered) Good Luck! ....


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Glenn-D
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 54 Westmont, Illinois, summer home in Mountain Home Ar.
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2003-06-17          57890


Well folks, we will find out soon since the clock went over 70 hours today. 100 hour service interval is comming up fast.
Glenn ....


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Auggie
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 21 Northern Virginia
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2003-06-20          58063


Back to the shavings issue, let me add this. For unknown reasons on my BX2200, the mid-PTO shaft came off last year and busted my tranny. Kubota replaced it after a little wrangling. In fact, the corporate guys were great. I took it in for servicing after about 30 hours and the service department said they found shavings in the filter. They made it sound unusual and warned me to keep an eye on it. How, I don't know. After another 50 hours, it's going back for a real servicing only because I figure the dealer understands this stuff. But it raised a question. I thought it was standard to have a few shavings in a new piece of equipment, but the dealer's concern and the above thread of messages have me thinking there's a larger problem. ....


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stevenc
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 190 North Carolina
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2003-06-20          58071


I use to own a Kubota,,BE sure you get everything in writing,,they are tough on Warrantee ....


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Glenn-D
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Posts: 54 Westmont, Illinois, summer home in Mountain Home Ar.
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2003-06-20          58072


Hey Auggie,
You should probably start a new thread. How did you bust the mid case? Some junk should be normal in first trans oil change.
Glenn-d ....


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