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 | jobowen
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 5 Saint Charles, Michigan 
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1999-12-01 10546
Being new to loaders ( Real dumb) . I plan to purchase the John Deere 4100. How does the 410 loader perform? I have 21 acres of woods and plan to use it for dirt moving, lifting, etc. Also what types of jobs can a loader perform?
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| JonB
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-12-02 10558
Jobowen, I've a 4100 with a 410. It has moved tons of dirt and gravel --reducing days of back breaking wheel barrow work into a few hours. I've also used the 410 as a carry-all, moving bags of concrete, boards, stakes and other items. Using a chain it has pulled old fence posts, tree stakes, lifted and moved other implements from here to there. It has also lifted and held a metal barn door up while I fastened the door in place. This spring I'll be pulling old T-stakes, and that alone will save me days of work and months of back pain. My back thinks the 410 is the best implement there is. You can also get other implements to attach to it, such as pallet forks, but I've opted not to go there. I think you'd love one. Best of luck. ....
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| MichaelSnyder
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 0
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1999-12-02 10564
I love it! I unfortunately cannot compare its "real world" performance with Kubota, NH, ect.. I can compare its controls and ease of use, and can tell you it was one of the deciding factors in our decision for JD. The only problem I've encountered, assuming it is a problem... is the bucket will drop a few inches over time, and the bucket itself will start to tilt forward slightly. Maybe this is normal..But I cannot remember this problem on any other loader I've used...All of which have been significantly larger,, Not that size should matter. ....
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| Brent
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-12-02 10566
I know this is going off on a tangent, but MLS I would check with the dealer that sold you the 4100 and ask if the loader drop you discribe is normal. I would not think it is. I have a Yanmar 30hp with a Koyker loader I installed and I can leave it up without any drop. Once about 3 weeks ago, I left it up for 6 days without any drop. This was an experiment and not something I do often. I worry about the neighborhood kids getting squashed by a loader bucket should they mistake my tractor for monkey bars. ....
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| Larry
Join Date: Mar 2004 Posts: 0 St.Davids
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1999-12-02 10584
I have a 4100 with 410 loader also. I have used it for removing an old sidewalk, filling in the place where the old sidewalk used to be, hauling bucket loads of compost to the gardens, reshaping a gravel slope into an outbuilding, leveling the gravel portion of the driveway, and lifting the large cement cover on the septic tank when it needed cleaning. My back loves the 410 too. The ease of installing and uninstalling the 410 is incredible. My first project was removing the old sidewalk. That was a scarey adventure until I installed some ballast on the tractor. This is my first front end loader experience also. My unsolicited recommendations are to move slow, be extremely cautious, and wear your seat belt. I now find myself thinking of other projects that I can use the 410 for. That small pond that my wife has been wanting may become reality next spring. ....
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| craig
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-12-03 10596
You would be amazed at what you can use a loader for once you have one! Getting the garbage to the curb becomes a more enjoyable task. I grew up with a full size backhoe/loader in the backyard, so when I bought my 4100 last year, there was no question in getting the loader. It is a great loader, but you have to remember it is small. It will move lots of dirt a little at a time. Don't get me wrong, the loader has no problems handling a full bucket, the bucket is just small, after all it is a COMPACT tractor. I love having it and would not give it up for anything! BUY IT!!! You will come up with so many uses for it. ....
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| markg
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-12-03 10597
in response to bucket drop, i bought a new 3600 kubota with 680 loader, it now has 23hrs on it, in order to close my gate in the barn i had to leave the bucket up . after one week i came back and found the loader laying on the gate, it had droped about 2 feet. is this normal? now when i park it i stick a 2x4 between the grill guard and the bottom of the loader. ....
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| MichaelSnyder
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 0
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1999-12-03 10600
Took your advise and called my dealer. What we are experiencing is fluid finding its way past the valve seals. He said JD and most others use..(I forget the name)so I'll just call em special plastic/nylon valve seals. Probably for production reasons. (Plastic provides a higher compensation for machining imperfections) My last post indicated that I didn't remember this problem on large farm tractors...Appearantly size does matter. Large tractors use metal (Brass Assumed) seals for the valves, which are better but have a much higher price tag to them. The additional cost is easier to absorb on a +75k unit, but most more appearant on a $10k unit. Can't speak for others, but JD allows a certain % of drop with a given time. Not sure what it is, but I have to test my unit to find out if it passes. MLS ....
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| Scott
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-12-03 10614
I also have the 4100 with 410 loader and love it! I haven't noticed any drop with an empty bucket, but with a full load of dirt it will drop a couple of inches within five minutes (rotates, actually). I assumed this is normal, given the load being placed upon it (as I drive down the dirt driveway with the load), but now I wonder if I should have this checked. I haven't noticed any obvious leaks in the hydraulics, but I'm new to this stuff too. Simply can't say enough good things about the 4100 and loader combo...Now I'm wondering what would be the next most useful implement to buy??? Any suggestions? ....
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| Roger L.
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 0
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1999-12-03 10619
MLS, did you "buy" that seal explanation? I agree that the drooping is internal and is fluid either making it past the internal lift cylinder seals or back through excessive clearance in the loader valve body. It would not show as an external leak. Seals are dirt cheap and will handle more manufacturing slop than is normal when making the cylinders. Loader valves are tight tolerance devices and normally rely on high quality ground fits. It just doesn't ring right with the high quality that JD is famous for having. There just isn't much money to be saved here, since although valves are high-tolerance items, the methods of making them are so well worked out that they are not expensive.
A drooping loader won't hurt anything. You shouldn't leave it in the up position anyway. But I'd ask for another opinion.
Roger L. ....
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| jobowen
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 5 Saint Charles, Michigan
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1999-12-21 11372
Thanks everyone - Merry Christmas - I will join the loading crew in 2000. ....
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| MichaelSnyder
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 0
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1999-12-22 11390
Roger,
Unfortunately I know little about the internals of small loaders, although I cannot imagine they would be much different than larger units. I do know JD allows for a certain % of drop..what that % is, I'm not sure. My dealer agrees that it shouldn't be that way..but.... ....
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| Bird Senter
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 962 
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1999-12-22 11396
MLS, I don't know about the John Deere, but when I bought my 1995 B7100 Kubota, the loader bucket would gradually lower itself and when I was mowing or tilling, I would raise it 3 or 4 inches about every 10 minutes (it was not a quick attach). My dealer said it was "natural" for one to leak down over a period of time when the engine was not running, but not while the engine was running. They "rebuilt" the cylinders with new seals, and when that did not correct the problem, they eventually replaced all four cylinders and corrected it. I now have a B2710 with about 70 hours on it and have never had the bucket leak down that I can tell. ....
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| markg
Join Date: Posts: 1
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1999-12-22 11403
....so since my 3600gst with 25 hrs on it leaks down about 6 inches over night with no load should i make the dealer aware? ....
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| Roger L.
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 0
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1999-12-22 11406
Mark, whatever the reason for the leakdown, my own experience is that most loaders suffer from it. My own tractors tend to leak down between six inches and a foot an hour - more if lightly loaded. Half a foot overnight would sure be acceptable to me, but then mine are old and much used. The rate of fall has not changed in years, so at least in mine it is not a progressive fault.
I always lower the 3pt and the bucket when I walk away from the machine anyway. Not because of mechanical reasons, but because of worry that an unknowing person might trip the lever and get hurt by the falling implements. ....
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| johnny
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 11 hugo,ok
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1999-12-22 11407
Most likely leakage is occuring in the valve. Typically, the valves are made with no seals on the spools in the area of the inlet and outlet ports. There are seals on the ends of the spool to prevent external leakage. There needs to be some clearance between the spool and valve body so you can move the spool without a lot of effort. Nobody wants a joystick that works hard. So a small amount of oil will leak thru the clearance and result in loader drop. Depending on tolerences, some valves will leak a bit more than others. Typically, 10cc of oil leakage per minute at some nominal pressure is allowed. Trouble is, with the small volume cylinders on these little loaders, a little oil leakage results in significant rod movement!
Moral of the story is, never leave an unattended loader in the raised position. ....
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