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brokenarrow
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2005-03-20          108402

Tractor troubles
Families lobby for rollover protection
FOREST TOWNSHIP
THE FLINT JOURNAL FIRST EDITION
Sunday, March 20, 2005
By Robert Snell
Rollover history

Recent area rollover tractor deaths include:
Feb. 13, 2005: Richard Serrels, 32, of Forest Township died after the 1951 Ford tractor he was operating flipped while hauling a tree from the woods behind his house.

April 21, 2002: Daniel Shepp, 31, of Flushing was killed and his 2-year-old son injured when their tractor flipped backward as the father tried to pull out a large bush in Clayton Township.

Oct. 10, 1998: Charles Eldred, 48, of Linden died when a log he was pulling became entangled, causing the 1950 Ford tractor he was driving to flip on top of him.


How tractor fatalities happen

Tractors can roll sideways when riding along ditches or flip backward when trying to pull heavy loads or if they are stuck on something. Newer tractors have roll bars, seat belts and cabs that cradle drivers during rollovers.


Where to get help
The National Farm Medicine Center has an Internet guide that lets farmers see if rollover systems are available for various tractors. Visit www2.marshfieldclinic.


Safety features

All tractors sold today are required to have safety equipment installed.


Safety tips

To reduce rollover risks:
Avoid sharp turns and reduce speed when turning.

Avoid driving on steep embankments, near ditches and holes.

Hitch loads to a drawbar. Many rollovers happen when loads are hitched to axles.

FOREST TWP. - Relatives stashed the old red tractor deep in the woods, deep enough so that Gretchen Serrels couldn't see it.

Serrels wanted it destroyed - retribution, really, against a machine that killed her husband, Richard, 32, in a Feb. 13 rollover accident.

Spurred by Richard Serrels' death, three families linked by the tragic bond of surviving loved ones who were killed in tractor rollovers are uniting to raise safety standards and awareness of old tractors and rollover accidents.

All three men died while riding old tractors that flipped over on them. The tractors are common because they are durable and inexpensive - costing about $1,400, compared to new tractors that can run $15,000 and up.

But old tractors that lack seat belts and rollbars are taking a toll on farmers who are dying in preventable rollover accidents, experts say.

Reports indicate tractor accidents kill more than 300 farmers annually, more than half due to rollovers,. More than 34 people have died in Michigan from tractor accidents since 2001.

But only about a third of the tractors in the U.S. have rollover protection, according to a 2002 Iowa State University study.

"If nothing is done, you'll be writing about someone else (dying)," said Steve Dawes of Flushing, whose brother-in-law, Daniel Shepp, was killed in 2002.

The solution is a rollbar system that comes standard on tractors built since the mid-1970s. Many older tractors can be retrofitted with seat belts and rollbars, but doing so can cost up to $1,000 - in some cases, an option more expensive than the tractor itself.

State Rep. John Gleason, D-Flushing, spurred by a promise to the late father of one victim, is drafting legislation that would mandate rollbars for every tractor made before the 1970s. The bill could be introduced next month.

"It's incredibly frustrating," said Marc Schenker, chairman of the Public Health Sciences Department at the University of California-Davis. "Unlike so many other things where we don't have a solution, here we have one."

Dying words

Daniel Shepp was conscious after the tractor flipped and pinned him to the ground.

"Get my boy," he told the first people to reach him.

His 2-year-old son, Austin, had been riding in his lap after Shepp hitched a chain tied to the back of an old tractor to a lilac bush at his in-laws' property in Clayton Township.

As the tractor pulled, the bush didn't budge and lifted the tractor's nose in the air.

It was already too late.

Relatives believe Shepp, 31, a pipefitter from Flushing, had time to hurl his son free from the tractor, saving the boy's life.

Shepp's relatives want to return the favor by alerting farmers and rural residents who use old tractors as all-purpose vehicles.

"If we can save one family from going through losing their high school sweetheart, someone whose two boys will grow up without a father," said Dawes, 45.

Through the grief and heartache of Shepp's death, his relatives refused to sit idly by while people continued to die.

"Tell people how dangerous they are," said Shepp's widow, Larissa, 32. "People need to be educated."

Shepp's sister, Sue Dawes of Flushing, has been removed from stores that sell old tractors after asking salespeople if they told potential buyers about the safety risks. She often knocks, uninvited, on doors leading from driveways where farmers peddle antique tractors.

Dawes, 46, wants to give people the information her brother never had about the vehicle's dangers.

"He didn't know," she said. "That's what he was guilty of."

Before Shepp's father, Robert, died in May, a day after he was diagnosed with lung cancer, Gleason promised that he would push for a law mandating rollbars on old tractors.

"They just roll over too easy," Gleason said. "The most important thing is to make sure if they roll over, that the driver is protected."

He acknowledged the law might be tough to enforce, but it would be similar to helmet and seat belt laws.

"I'm going to push this as absolutely hard as I can," Gleason said.

One tractor safety expert said Gleason's campaign is a welcome but misguided attempt to make tractors safer. Instead, he said, victims' families should push for greater public awareness.

"The problem is not necessarily the equipment," said Howard Doss, a retired Michigan State University farm-safety specialist. "The problem has to do with the casual buyer-operator."

Many risks, one solution

There are many ways to die on a tractor.

Holes and stumps can hobble tractors traveling at higher speeds. Sudden turns and steep inclines kill, and sideways rollovers are common when riding along ditches. Hitching loads to the rear of a tractor can pull it backwards, crushing farmers underneath.

A combination of lax safety rules and a farm culture in which risk is accepted as much as rain and sun is leading to more deaths, safety experts said.

"There is a tradition of assuming risk," Schenker said. "This is a hazard, and it's the way my father and grandfather did it."

Rollover risks have been minimized on most new tractors that feature so-called rollover protective structures. The safety equipment includes two- and four-post frames, seat belts and cabs that cradle drivers during rollovers.

In 1976, the Occupational Safety and Health Administration required all new tractors be equipped with rollover devices. But the requirement only covers farms with more than 11 employees.

Overseas, Sweden has nearly eliminated rollover deaths. From 1984-90, less than one farmer a year died after the government instituted regulations mandating rollover protection, according to the country's Center for Product Safety.

About 93 percent of Swedish tractors have some type of rollover protection. Schenker wants to see the United States follow suit, suggesting farmers could receive tax credits for adding rollbars to tractors.

The Michigan Farm Bureau encourages rollover protection, but it does not believe the devices should become mandatory, said Legislative Counsel Jim Miller.

"We feel people can evaluate their own situations," he said.

Victims' families disagree.

Two of the three men who died - Serrels and Shepp - had little experience operating the machines and were driving borrowed tractors.

Both made fatal mistakes, experts said, when they hitched loads to the back of the tractor.

Charles Eldred of Linden made the same mistake, though he had considerably more experience operating his 1950 Ford tractor. This man's death illustrates how a fluke can prove fatal.

A General Motors technician and father of three, Eldred was pulling a tree out of some woods on Oct. 10, 1998. While dragging the log across a meadow near Silver Lake and South Seymour roads in Argentine Township, it snagged on a root the size of a thumb.

The tractor flipped and pinned Eldred, 48, to the ground. The crash broke his back, and Eldred, a safety-conscious man who relatives said knew the tractor's limits, died alone in the field.

"There was no getting away from that one," said son Brad Eldred, 34, who found his father's body.

Spurred by his father's death, Brad Eldred and a Mott Community College professor invented a kill switch that shorts a tractor's ignition if the front end lifts off the ground or approaches a steep incline.

"I just didn't want to see it happen to anyone else," he said.

He hoped the inexpensive device would be added to old Ford tractors, but he was rebuffed after approaching the company, he said.

Like Shepp's family, the Eldreds were repulsed when they learned of the Forest Township fatality. If nothing more, they want to reach at least one family and prevent future deaths.

"We see it again and again and again," said Diane Eldred. "We have a problem. If we can just get the word out and some of these people just listen ..."

Coming homeAs with the other families, Richard Serrels' death provided a grim introduction to the dangers of tractors.

"I had no clue that was even a possibility," wife Gretchen Serrels said. "I don't think he even had a clue there were dangers like that."

Police found the General Motors senior product engineer pinned to the ground on private property along N. Henderson Road, south of Willard Road.

The 1951 Ford tractor flipped backward while Serrels, 32, was hauling a tree from the woods behind his house. Serrels had hitched a rope around the tree to the back of the tractor.

The tractor flipped, and the steering wheel pinned him to the ground, suffocating him, police said.

The tractor is no longer hidden in the woods behind the Serrels home. It was returned to the relatives who loaned it to her husband, although Gretchen had other plans for it.

"I wanted to pay for it and have it destroyed," she said. "I didn't want anybody to have it."








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AV8R
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2005-03-20          108405

Reason number 7,436 that liberalism is a mental disease, not a political point of view.


RESPONSIBILITY FOR ONES SELF HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE GOVERNMENT, BUTT OUT! ....

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harvey
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2005-03-21          108432

I am guessing: according to this if you own or get killed on a tractor you are a farmer? Around here the people that get hurt are usually the weekend city people who have never been around machinery or are moving back to their roots and have forgotten much common sense.

2 years ago, the most recent real farmer incident I recall, we did have a "REAL" farmer get tangled in a tedder when he was removing hay that was wrapped around the spindle and when the pressure was released the mechanisims moved pinning him. No permenant damage just brusied and scabbed up.

Soon it will be if you own a chainsaw you'll be a logger? ....

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BrendonN
Join Date: May 2004
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2005-03-21          108435

As the article above illustrates, many roll-overs happen due to improper hitching of loads. If a load is hitched only to the fixed drawbar (NOT a crossbar between the lower 3 point hitch links), the wheels will usually spin before the front end comes up. It is natural to want to hitch high to get more traction when pulling stumps, etc, but that can be fatal. Also illustrated is the potential danger of using tractors as log skidders. The end of the log is chained to the crossbar mentioned above and lifted off the ground and away we go. Should something snag the front edge of the log, though, and the tractor could flip in an instant.

I own and use vintage tractors and equipment that lack many of the safety features that new machines have. My 50-year old John Deeres will never be as stable as low-slung utility tractors, so I must take more precautions of where and how fast I drive them.

Laws forcing me to install roll bars will not make the tractors physically less likely to roll over. It may, however, make users of old equipment more careless. And who will do the engineering and test work to verify that the axles and other ROPS mounting points on a 50-year old tractor are up to the task? What company would shoulder the liability of producing ROPS structures for every model of old tractor out there? Who would be liable if the axle on my 1948 JD M snaps off in a rollover because it wasn't designed to support a ROPS? Like was said above, sometimes the government gets involved where they should probably not go.

Be careful, be smart, and think through potential consequences of what you are doing before actually doing it. We owe it to our children to do nothing less. ....

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jdcman
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2005-03-27          108852

This isn't about liberalism --- just plain stupidity.

Brought to you by the same folks who drive Volvo's, play cop in the left hand lane of the freeway, believe that guns jump off tables and shoot people and hold this silly belief that humanoids are more deserving as a life form!

The fact is when you do something stupid and don't think, bad things can happen.

It's just a culling of the herd, sad, but true. Hopefully others will learn from the mistakes of the careless.

We've all done stupid stuff, taken that chance and after wards thought, hmm that was stupid.

Legislation isn’t going to fix stupidity, it's a learning process --- it's part of life. You can’t protect people from themselves; no matter how hard you try!
....

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serrels
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2008-11-28          158198

you dont have to be a farmer for this my daddy was just picking up r yard i know it was a tragidy but it happend ....

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serrels
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2008-11-28          158199

sry but my dad wasnt careless k ....

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earthwrks
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2008-11-28          158204

Sorry about your dad. However, if you're going to troll the web defending your dad, have some pride and spell correctly. We're adults here. You're not texting in junior high. Make your dad proud, ok? ....

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Murf
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2008-11-28          158205

Quote:
Originally Posted by serrels | view 158199
sry but my dad wasnt careless k


My condolences also.

I hesitate to even say so, and please understand the following is offered purely in the interest of safety.

I would point out however, the 'text book' definition of 'careless' would include operating a machine like a tractor without knowing how to do so properly.

A tractor is a very safe, stable machine when operated properly, and a VERY dangerous one when not.

I can only guess that a rollover that happened while "just picking up r yard" would be in the 'improper' category.

Again, my condolences.

Best of luck. ....

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kthompson
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2008-12-01          158266

Quote:
Originally Posted by serrels | view 158199
sry but my dad wasnt careless k


It is sad to loose your Dad regardless the reason. Mine walked in our home soon be 39 years ago to drop dead of a heart attack. May I make a suggestion from another Dad, there are some very good people here who may seem ruff and tuff (and are as needed) but have great hearts and would be very willing to help you learn so you can be a safe operator. Let them. It might prove helpful if you were willing to share the details of the accident. I must admit, texting type does not work for me either. ....

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candoarms
Join Date: Mar 2007
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2008-12-01          158268

Serrels,

Growing up in North Dakota, you might imagine that our local nightly news is pretty danged boring. After all, there is no crime to speak of; no terrorist attacks; no bank robberies either. The nightly news is composed of the little old ladies who are working hard to bring potential customers to a bake sale, as a form of charity for some young family who has a very sick child.

Every once in a while we hear of a local farmer who was killed in a farming accident, such as the old man who died on Christmas Eve, while giving his grandchildren a hay ride. He slipped off of the step of the tractor, and the tractor tire then rolled right over his chest -- in the presence of his entire family.

Tractor roll-overs aren't the most common causes of death on the farm. I've heard of several men who died after getting caught in hay balers, augers, and even crushed between the tractor and a building.

Roll-over protection structures won't prevent a man's leg from being severed by a grain auger. They won't prevent trucks from rolling over the driver. They won't prevent a cow from trampling its owner, either.

Every day of our lives, we face situations that could result in serious injury, or death. It is up to every one of us to provide for our own safety to the best of our ability. We aren't always successful, and most of us are lucky to be here to write in response to this topic.

Have a very safe and happy holiday season.

Joel

....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
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2008-12-02          158273

A man was killed just last week here in eastern Iowa when a combine cornhead he was working under fell on him. There are safety lockup devices on every combine to prevent this from happening, whether or not he had the safety device in place I don't know. Anything mechanical can fail even lockup devices, it's not likely, but possible. Most likely he got under without locking the cornhead up to adjust or unclog something, I've been guilty of the same thing, you are in a hurry and so what those hydraulic cylinders and hoses have held the cornhead up for twenty years it won't fail now. I like Joel have had plenty of close calls and did dumb things to put my life in danger mainly from being in a hurry. ....

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serrels
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2008-12-05          158413

i get u guys r adults but im a kid and this is my dad were tlking about got it good ....

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serrels
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2008-12-05          158414

no he was just picking up it was on a hill ....

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serrels
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2008-12-05          158415

im a kid what u expect im only 12 a was 8 when i lost so give me some slack ....

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kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2008-12-05          158417

Quote:
Originally Posted by serrels | view 158414
no he was just picking up it was on a hill


I think all are sorry for your loose and many here have lost their share of loved ones and some can tell you about their injuries also. At age 8 loosing your Dad had to be hard. I lost mine at age 16 which is also too young. This time of year really reminds you of your loss.

I do not understand your statement. It would be good if you were to use complete words and full sentences and not post part of a sentence at the time. Again, there are some great people here with bigger hearts than you might believe. ....

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earthwrks
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2008-12-05          158420

Serrels, I'm a fellow Michigander. Where are you from? I live near Metropolitan Airport in South East Michigan.

I haven't had a dad or a mother either for 20 years. And I lost a younger brother and cousin when they were just 14 years old. So I know what it is to lose a loved one.

That said, like I said before we are adults here. If you want our respect, understanding, and compassion---which is pretty obvious you do...otherwise you wouldn't have responded--then you have to learn that you don't make points with adults having a chip on your shoulder.

I don't want to sound ruff and tuff like my good friend Kenny Thompson (KT) calls me, but knock it off, and get with the program. At 12 years old you KNOW you know how to address adults AND write like you're suppose to---do it NOT just for yourself, but your Dad.

Like I said before, make him proud. You're smart enough to troll the web so put it to good use, okay? And try to have a good holiday, alright?

....

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cutter
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2008-12-06          158422

I'd say around here that the fatal tractor rollover is far less a factor than the equipment entrapment/entanglement resulting in death or dismemberment.

Either way, my sympathies to those on the board that have lost a loved one, does not matter how it occurred, it always affects the entire family. ....

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serrels
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2008-12-07          158444

well im from otisville im just sick of people saying it was stupidity amd alot of other stuff ....

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cutter
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2008-12-07          158445

I don't know how all of this got started here, but it needs to be toned down, including your remarks serrels. We are sorry for your loss but when someone posts political initiatives it is bound to draw debate.

As you have probably noticed, free thinking adults on this board do not take kindly to more government restrictions. That said, it is time to move on to other things. ....

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serrels
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2008-12-07          158450

sorry :-( ....

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cutter
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2008-12-07          158452

No problem, please stick around and enjoy the other threads :) ....

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serrels
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2008-12-12          158547

of course i wanna see whats being said about my dad :) ....

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cutter
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2008-12-12          158548

My guess is, probably nothing, this thread has run its course. ....

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serrels
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2008-12-12          158549

im just like still dealing with problems because my grandma just died so ya :( ....

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candoarms
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2008-12-12          158550

Serrels,

A near-by farmer was recently killed in a farm accident.

The grain dryer he was operating suddenly broke, throwing a very large fan blade, which decapitated the farmer.

As Paul Harvey would say, "He was 52".

Joel ....

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kthompson
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2008-12-13          158554

Quote:
Originally Posted by serrels | view 158549
im just like still dealing with problems because my grandma just died so ya :(


There is a difference in dealing with problems and dealing with memory. My Dad passed away this Jan 3rd 39 years ago. If you want a list of what he and I did that day can tell you for that day is locked almost detail by detail in my memory. Appreciate what he gave you and what he left you. Enjoy it and build on it. Remember you only miss those you love. No doubt with Christmas so near the memories are more tender than you may wish.

Feel free as has been said especially by Cutter, stay around. It prove more beneficial for all than you think.
....

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jonstark
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2009-01-03          159027

Quote:
Originally Posted by serrels | view 158547
of course i wanna see whats being said about my dad:)


Of course you want to see what others are saying about your dad. Remember that the purpose of this discussion is not to bash him or his memory. It is to keep us from suffering a similar fate. We didn't know your dad but we know that he made a mistake. Stuff happens really fast on heavy equipment and safety is or should be in the back of our minds all the time. Discussing someone else's mistakes will bring us greater awareness and could quite possibly save one of us in the future.

We mean NO DISRESPECT. You can count on that. It is the accident we would hate to see repeated.

That said, it appears that the greater number of members here are not willing to allow government intervention in the form of mandated safety modifications to vintage equipment. This may seem insensitive to you and your family but that's the way it is. We're all big boys here willing to self-assess risk and precaution. Keep the guvmint out of it.

jon ....

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Murf
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2009-01-05          159088

Quote:
Originally Posted by jonstark | view 159027
That said, it appears that the greater number of members here are not willing to allow government intervention in the form of mandated safety modifications to vintage equipment. This may seem insensitive to you and your family but that's the way it is. We're all big boys here willing to self-assess risk and precaution. Keep the guvmint out of it.jon


I believe that in most cases people are just against a Goobermint mandated waste of money as a knee-jerk reaction to an unfortunate accident that in almost every case would never have occurred had the operator been better trained, or just used some plain old-fashioned common sense.

As some wise old person said, "unfortunately common sense has become rather UNCOMMON these days".

Witness 3 wheeled ATV's that had to be outlawed because people would operate them carelessly (and or drunk) and then get hurt. I've had one since 1985 (yikes that's now nearly a quarter of a century!!) and never tipped it or had any instability problems with it yet. I know many others in the same situation.

Best of luck. ....

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serrels
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2009-03-27          161472

thanks for everything but im a little over it not really but once in a while i cry but i have my friends everything is okay...i wish ....

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earthwrks
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2009-03-28          161484

Have you considered that maybe Mom should take you to talk to someone who could give you some perspective on things? Everyone is affected differently by losses of loved ones. I lost a younger brother, and two younger cousins within months of each other so I know.

DO youreslef a big favior and don't get invlovd in drugs and drinking. They will NOT take away the pain. In fact that will only make it worse. Live every day to make your Dad proud. Be the best you can be--I jhave a hunch that's what your dad would have wanted. In your "alone time" talk to Dad. You will find a sense of peace. ....

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serrels
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 16 michigan
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2009-03-28          161494

dude you dont know me i dont need to go talk some one im not freakin i screwed up b-cuz of it my friends cu need to back off ur a adult im a little kid u serilously think ineed to talk to some one

i have lost alot of family members thats passed away so back off im sick off people like this............................. ....

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earthwrks
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 3853 Home Office in Flat Rock, Michigan
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2009-03-29          161503

By the way the forum is for adults anyway.

Don't hand me that crap. If you didn't want people to talk to here and tell you like it is--- you wouldn't be coming back so many times to let us know what you are feeling. The sooner you are honest with your self AND others, the better off you are going to be. And don't expect that you can just leave a message here and expect no one to reply. You wanted attention and now you got it. If you don't want attention, don't post anything. Got it? ....

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serrels
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 16 michigan
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2009-04-07          161813

what u mean by that i dont need attention!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:-( ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
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2009-04-07          161814

Quote:
Originally Posted by serrels | view 161813
what umean by that i dont need attention!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:-(


I can't see where he said anything of the sort.

All I saw was "If you don't want attention, don't post anything.".

There's a big difference.

Now, if you would like to LEARN about tractors, ask some serious questions and I'm sure many of the members here, myself included, would be more than happy to help out.

If you choose to ask for help though, please do everyone a favour and type it out in full (properly spelled) words, not cryptic letters and code.


Best of luck. ....

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kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005
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2009-04-07          161816

serrels,

I suspect earthwrks hit your situation much more honest than you want to admit. Sadly you are not alone even at 8 in losing a parent. At 12 you are older than many who went to work to provide for a family who lost their father and their family's income. Anyone does well to listen to others who have experience. earthwrks has lost a brother, have you any idea how hard that is? Losing a parent or sibling is very hard. I have lost parents and sibling. I also realize your attitude shows the need you have for what you are saying you don't, an adult you can trust to share with. Man there is nothing wrong to remember your Dad and shed tears over his passing. But playing a victim will only cause you hurt. ....

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serrels
Join Date: Nov 2008
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2009-04-07          161820

sorry ....

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serrels
Join Date: Nov 2008
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2009-06-10          163363

im sry but dude im dont have any attitude im not acting as the victim, im acting as daughter whos fater who died so just .....,ughggg ....

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cutter
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2009-06-10          163364

Two months have passed, I had hoped this thread was finished. I have my doubts as to its legitimacy. ....

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kthompson
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2009-06-11          163371

Quote:
Originally Posted by cutter | view 163364
Two months have passed, I had hoped this thread was finished. I have my doubts as to its legitimacy.


Your thought is well taken. Or is it tied to school being out or certain days such as birthday or father day approaching.

Regardless, when help is offerred and refused over and over...well the offers dry up. ....

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kthompson
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2009-07-23          164278

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSerrels | view 164268
I am Christina....Richard was my brother, he was not being careless in any way, all he was doing was cleaning up his yard....and I don't believe that grown people would attack a little girl for defending her father who recently passed away....kicking her off this site is not only a tragedy its also very rude and discomforting! You would think that instead of talking to her like that, you would try to console her....you people are very disgusting and I think that you owe her an apology!


I take real exceptation to your comments that we did not try to console her. If you read all the comments real sympthy was offered by many and more than once. If she is your neice may you make a real effort to see that she had the support you admit and some here really said she needed. However, with the internet it is very possible people post false info and are not who they claim to be.
....

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Murf
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2009-07-23          164281

Actually Christina, if you took the time to read the entire thread, you would see that not only was there sympathy offered, but sage advise based on countless numbers of years of safe operating by many members of this site, myself included, in an attempt to educate the public so this doesn't happen to anyone else.

If that ma'am is 'disgusting', you have a slanted view of the world indeed. ....

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CaitlinMarie
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 4 Davison, MI
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2010-02-04          168376

....

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CaitlinMarie
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2010-02-04          168378

....

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CaitlinMarie
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2010-02-04          168379

....

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bobbbyy
Join Date: Feb 2010
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2010-02-25          168792

You guys are about the immaturest adults ever.
grow up&&STOP KICKING ME OFF THIS WEBSITE THATS ABOUT MY #$%&* DAD! ....

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bobbbyy
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2010-02-25          168793

its really immature this whole thread is about my dad that is dead and has been for five years and i just want to know what you guys are saying and by deleting this makes everything worse so dont you think you could do me a favor and stop kicking me off this Thread!!!!! ....

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Murf
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2010-02-25          168797

First of all, nobody was "kicked off" this website. Some inappropriate comments and/or vulgar language was removed. This is a 'family' site and we intend to keep it that way.

Secondly, the website is not about your dad, in fact, this thread is not even "about your Dad", what it is about is tractor safety. That's why the very first post refers to three accidents, and yes, your late father was one of those mentioned.

The whole point is education. By teaching people that any machine, a tractor included, can be dangerous, and instructing people on the proper and safe operation of their equipment maybe another life can be spared.

Would you not want to help prevent what you went through from happening to someone else if you could? We do, that's why we're here and trying to teach people the safe way to do things.

Finally, if you wish stay I doubt there's anyone here who would object, I've seen many posts of condolences and sympathy offered towards you and your family.

However, there are rules and some basic manners which need to be observed if you are to continue posting here.

You could not act that way at school, in church, or as a guest in someones home, you cannot act that way here either.

Best of luck.

....

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bobbbyy
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2010-02-25          168799

Umm Thank You.
but i wish people would just not use these things they take peoples lifes and im sick of hearing about it.
but um this thread is about my dad && two other guys so dont you think you should show a little respect for me.
as i do for you.
yeah thats what i thought. ....

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Janette
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 2 Michigan
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2010-02-25          168802

Hello,
I am Janette Wisenburg i have a husband and two wonderful childerin! And the wasy that this little girl...rayelle is it is HIGHLY dissapointing! I would NEVER want my children to be talked to in this manner! I yes see that this shild was being cosoled...BUT a lot of the things that were being said were HIGHLY dissrepectful to the family! It has yes been Five years since the death! But there will still be sorness in the child! ....

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Murf
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2010-02-25          168803

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbbyy | view 168799
but um this thread is about my dad && two other guys so dont you think you should show a little respect for me.as i do for you.yeah thats what i thought.


I'm not here to start an argument, but what you said above, and the "You guys are about the immaturest adults ever.
grow up&&STOP KICKING ME OFF THIS WEBSITE THATS ABOUT MY #$%&* DAD!" which had to be edited to remove your vulgar language really don't say the same thing now do they. In fact I would suggest that a statement like that is far from "respect" as I know it.

As for people not using tractors, that's not a helpful solution. Aside from the fact that they are a necessary tool they are quite safe when used properly.

If you look at the statistics, you are far more likely to be hurt or killed in a car or pickup than on a tractor.

As I said earlier, if you want to be part of the solution instead of the problem. Please stick around and help out.


Best of luck. ....

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Murf
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2010-02-25          168804

Quote:
Originally Posted by Janette | view 168802
I yes see that this shild was being cosoled...BUT a lot of the things that were being said were HIGHLY dissrepectful to the family! It has yes been Five years since the death! But there will still be sorness in the child!


Janette, I very sorry for your and your childrens loss.

Can you show me a comment that was "highly disrespectful to the family", I've been over this thread several times and didn't see any.


Best of luck. ....

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