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judd
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2002-06-06          39371

I'm looking to buy a 3010 or 3410 Kubota and can't decide which transmission to buy. Any thoughts/opinions would be greatly appreciated.

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TomG
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2002-06-07          39376

Seems like I'm ducking, but I'm going to suggest reading some in the archives. The issue comes up periodically. Reading the archives may answer most questions, or it may raise some new ones that can be brought up here in other posts.

A search on HST will yield many discussions, for example a recent thread of 43 responses has the title HST vs Gears.
....

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DennisCTB
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2002-06-07          39383

The thread Tom was talking about is listed below ....


Link:   HST vs Gear

 
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Mark in WA
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2002-06-07          39392

I purchased a 3010L with HST last Fall (my first tractor). The HST is probably the thing I like best about the tractor. You will read that the hydro is better for loading which is true but what I don't think gets discussed is the fact that it is so precise in close quarters. You have the ability to inch forward or back with great precision which present a huge safety factor. Not only can you move the tractor extremely slowly or very small distances when appropriate, you do it under full power. When you compare it to slipping a clutch to make small movements, there is no comparison. Iam also always jumping off the tractor for some reason or another and with the hydro I don't have to put it in neutral, just jump off. If I am on a hill, I will set the parking brake but usually, even on a slight grade, I don't bother and the tractor will not move. Unless you want a tractor that will seldom back up and never be used near an obstacle, I can't imagine a better choice. ....

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Harley
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2002-06-07          39400

Hey- got the bucks? Get HST. ....

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cutter
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2002-06-08          39412

If I am not mistaken, the 3010 has a shuttle transmission available. I have used that on construction equipment and it is the best of both worlds. If I ever move up to that size and it is available, the shuttle would be my choice. For what it is worth. ....

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nettek98
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2002-06-09          39429

I bought a L2900GST this winter and could not be happier with the shuttle transmission. As stated many times on this site, the GST provides the best of both worlds, a gear transmission that can be shifted without clutching. It is extremely handy when doing loader work. ....

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TomG
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2002-06-10          39440

There was some discussion awhile back about GST's having a lag when shifting. That seemed to be a problem for some people and something others adapted to OK. I seem to recall that one person said the rpm fall off enough between gears to make a noticeable difference in the cut of finish mowing. I don't know if anybody else has these problems.

Myself, I have 3-speeds plus reverse synchromesh. I still haven't gotten around to see if I can manage clutchless shifting with the plain-old synchromesh gears as I used to in my '60's Air Force 1/2-ton. But even if I could, I'd probably just be wearing out the synchronizers rather than the clutch.
....

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DRankin
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2002-06-10          39447

If you have wife, kids or other occasional users of the tractor, the HST might be better. If it is going to be a full time mower it might be better also. But for a general-purpose workhorse with limited operators, I like the gears. ....

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Greg H
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2002-06-10          39450

I own a L4310GST and like it. For extensive loader or grading use the HST is a better choice. For plowing , I think GST is better. When using the loader, many people tend to "ride" the clutch which shortens it's life considerably. It is a tossup I suppose but I like what I got.
Happy tractorin

Greg H ....

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lost-myuername
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2002-06-14          39553

The HST (3710) is excellent in tight situations it is very smooth. The tractor can be moved when standing next to it. By applying hand pressure to the Pedal the tractor can be inched forward and backward without climbing in and out of the cab. This is handy in many loader and backhoe situations such as installing engines or lifting, loading and moving equipment.

The 3710 have three ranges; high range is good for flat ground and speed. The medium range is a good general-purpose loader, mowing and towing. There is a loss of speed/ RPMs on a hill, just ease up on the pedal and the motor comes back up to speed and let the power take over. Low range for heavy loader work, deep mud, working on hilly terrain and moving buildings.

I have a question, can anyone tell me how to use the left and right break pedals with a HST? It seems one needs a third foot!
....

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cutter
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2002-06-14          39554

Only way I have found is by using the hand operated cruise control on my 2910, thereby freeing the foot to brake steer. Don't know if you have that option on your machine. ....

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pbenven
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2002-06-14          39557

lostusername,

I use my heel on the hydro pedal and the ball of my foot on the brakes. You're right though - could be easier. ....

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DennisCTB
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2002-06-14          39560

lost-myuername,

If you are having a problem with the CTB member process please let me know and I will help you or fix what is wrong.

Just send an email to me by clicking on email in the menu at the top of the page or send to dennis@jplan.com

Dennis
CTB
....

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TomG
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2002-06-15          39567

I don't have the brake steering and speed pedal problem with my gear tractor. I've never heard of a good solution for it either. My problem is holding the tractor on a hill with one foot on the brakes and one foot on the clutch and then wanting to have another foot for the foot throttle to speed up the loader. An Australian performer, Rolf Harris, did a routine called Jake the Peg. Jake had three legs. It would be a problem buying overalls but maybe good for tractor operating.

Since I don't have a speed pedal, I can't inch my tractor around with the TX. I dig in the loader blade and inch the tractor around with the bucket curl. That might be a better way since there isn't the possibility of nudging the speed pedal more than intended.
....

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cutter
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2002-06-15          39570

Actually, I owned a 4100 that had the pedals switched to the left side when you purchased an HST model. I believe all of the 4000 series are like that. A very sensible solution that works. I assume the other manufacturers don't do it because of an additional cost in manufacturing. Perhaps thinking like that is why they cost a bit more, I don't know. And this from one that owns a Kubota. Actually, if the J/D had the adjustable lower links, tilt wheel and a couple of other conveniences, I would be willing to say it would be the best all around tractor on the market and worth the extra money. I liked my 4100 and in particular the use of the steer brakes on the HST for loader work. The ONLY reason I traded it was for more HP. The Kubota does allow you the same convenience in a different way. The hand operated HST will allow limited use of the brakes, as long as you don't have to be operating the loader at the same time. In that case, you would need three arms as opposed to three legs. Can't have it all I guess. ....

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dgavin
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2002-06-18          39664

Had the same issue.
I went with the HST mainly because of the loader work i had planned.If you use a loader with GST you need one hand on
the loader the other on the GST controls.....who the heck is driving?
I don't have three arms and my left foot is amputated because of a tarctor accident so i can't clutch either.

Go HST! ....

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Art White
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2002-07-03          40009

For those of you with the brake steering problem I found out years ago it doesn't make much difference if the wheels are a few inches off the ground or a foot. By leaving the tires just off the ground you can still steer as one will keep on the ground to guide. ....

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Morgan
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2002-07-30          40805

One thing about the HSD is that it robs about 1 HP from the tractor. For a small tractor that's maybe 15 instead of 14 HP and that can make a difference. If all you do is mow or plow or brush hog, or skid logs, and you are going forward most of the time, there is no reason to get the HSD and it may be a disadvantage because that 1 HP might prevent you from plowing up a certain hill. If you are using your tractor as a front end loader, then HSD is more convenient but maybe you'd be better off getting an actual loader, not a tractor. Little Japanese farm tractors make lousy loaders anyway because of the little front wheels, and what do you get, maybe 1/8 yard per bucket load? A real loader gives you 2 or 4 or 7 yards per scoop and it won't EVER tip over because of the big front sheels. ....

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Morgan
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2002-07-30          40806

Then again, wheel loaders cost $75,000 but who's counting? ....

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Peters
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2002-07-30          40807

Morgan? What is the point of the post? I know what a real loader can and can not do. I real commercial loader is not much of a landscaping tool. It is a little large to have around the house. About a month ago my neighbour brought one home from work to move the remains of a large tree from the yard. I helped him cut them up and get them out.
I had a couple of stumps that were sitting in areas I was seeding and one on the lawn from a blow down. Believe me you do not want a real loader on the lawn.
A small tractor is a multpurpose tool. If you were a full time landscaper you might want a skid steer or small tract loader like a Dingo, Bobcat or Ramrod. The contract mower would want a zero radius turn mower for finish work or a larger 4x tractor for road work. My point is that you are always going to find a better piece of equipment for a dedicated task. A compact utility tractor is just that a tractor with many uses.
The question is whether you want a HST or not. Where does the HST have advantages, finish mowing, moving earth, leveling earth. Where does it have its disadvantages? Field work? plowing harrowing etc.
According to the people in the know we are not giving up reliability for the HST only a few HP to the wheels.
It seems to me that americans have been doing this for years in their cars for convenience. At least in the tractor it is not wasteful as it actually lets you get more work completed in less time.
If you are looking at 15 hp tractors then you are on the wrong board those are sold as subcompact tractors or garden tractors. ....

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Ted@ABBEYWOODS, LLC
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2002-07-30          40835

Maybe the loader in question is one of the excellent articulated Kubota R420 / 520 machines. They are easy on the lawn, lift a goodly amount of weight, and have many attachments for both front and rear of the machine. There are similar units made by TCM and Yanmar. These machines are smaller than a full sized unit and make great landscapers' rigs.

About the GST vs. HST, I own both. My L35 has GST and my Cub Cadet 7275 is hydrostatic. I just can't seem to get used to the GST, it is spooky throwing that lever and not pushing the clutch! I bought the L35 because of its superior hydraulic flow, superior backhoe, and superior loader rating. The L35 is not anywhere as easy to drive as an HST, but is better than a normal clutch machine. I've had a few mornings when I've had both machines on the job and had trouble transitioning from one to the other. But then again I'm not too gracefull. ....

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Morgan
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2002-07-30          40845

The Kubota R series wheel loaders are great little rigs. They have 4 equal size wheels, articulated frames, and buckets that hold around 3/4 of a yard. The transmission is really different from either gear or HST, it's more like an automatic car transmission because it automatically changes according to the demand. If I had the money I'd buy one pronto. Can they pull a bush hog?

Peters, I'm not on the wrong board, lots of Kubota tractors have only 15 HP, such as the low end of the B series like the B-7400 the old B-6200 and lots of others. And they sure ain't lawn mowers! Crimminy, even the fabeled B-7500 is not much more HP. ....

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Peters
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2002-07-30          40847

Well Morgan if you are going to finish mow using a 7500 lb - 9500 lb machine on 16" tires then you will have nice lanes in the lawn. It might be a little had to get the FEL off that piece of equipment.
There are good compremises made which are the articlulated compact tractors such as the Steiners, Ventrac, Branson Etc, but most of these are much more money than the conventional compact tractor.
Having had a compact tractor in the 19 hp range. I would not recommend anyone go that low unless they are puttering around a couple of acres.
Kubota uses the term subcompact not I. ....

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Art White
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2002-07-31          40858

Rather ironic that it wasn't to many years ago that the B-7100 was the most popular compact tractor in our area. We sold a lot of the B-5200 and 6200 tractors too. They are classified as compacts but yet smaller in horsepower than the sub-compact BX line. Times change many things, tractors too! ....

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Peters
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2002-07-31          40865

By the way Bobcat has gotten away from tearing up the lawn by adding 4 wheel stearing to some of their loaders.
It is also a jackknife of compact loaders with its many attachments.
Dispite this I still would not necessarily spend the money for one around the house/small farm.
Around the construction site?
Peters ....

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DRankin
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2002-07-31          40867

Eric. My uncle has been using bobcats since they were kittens. ....


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Billy
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2002-07-31          40873

I've had both, gear and hydro. I've found I can do a lot more work in a lot less time with hydro.

Billy ....

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dgavin
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2002-07-31          40876

Wow,people really get off track here!
I just bought a 3010 hydro.I planned on doing alot of loader work so i went with hydro.If you go with the GST plan on having one hand on the shift level and another on the loader and none on the wheel.
I hope this helps......by the way save the money a 3010 is only 3hp less than a 3410 and $1500 cheaper.Everything else is the same. ....

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MOrgan
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2002-07-31          40882

Bobcat attachments can be really pricey. A 4-foot brush hog for a Kubota can be bought new for under $1000, but the Bobcat's equivalent is a front mounted hydraulic brush cat that costs around $4000. I think is does more work with the 40 or 45 HP motors that Bobcats have, but that's alot of cash for a brush cat. Hogs are cheaper than cats. And Bobcats weigh about 2 or 3 tons. ....

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Alan L
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2002-08-11          41168

For loader work HST is the way to go. It was never so evident as yesterday when I was moving 5" to 10" granite rocks from the pile where the dump truck left it to the creek where I was building as swale crossing, and to a draw where I was covering up some debris.

The rocks are so big that its hard to just slip the bucket right in there and get a full load, so it required some back and forth movement, all the while raising the bucket. This back and forth movement was very fast, done with one foot while the right hand was on the joystick and the left on the steering wheel. Having to shift while working this particular pile would have been quite a pain. I was able to get a good bucketfull every time because of the absolute control over the tractor.

They say you lose some power through the HST, but I just don't see it. I lose traction or RPMS on bites that are too big for the tractor. Gears would not have any effect on that.

HST tractors have better resale I'm told, although I don't have first hand knowledge of that.

If you are doing a lot of plowing and need constant measurable speed one of the other transmissions might be more desireable. Having said that, I pull a disk with my HST and its works fine. ....

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dgavin
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2002-08-12          41183

(I'll try to stay on track with the original question)

Just spent 10 hours on a L3010 hydro.I would say that the hydro sucks up horse power beyond the mentioned 1hp.Other than the lack of power it's great.
Size your tractor to your needs,add additional engine size
for hydro.

(I have a L3010,FEL,backhoe and loaded tires with hydro.
it's a little under power.) ....

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Art White
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2002-08-12          41185

SAturday AM was a lot of fun for me and I did get a sale from it, actually two sales. A fellow had called who "had" a TC33. Told me he didn't like it as it had no power to dig and just seemed like he wanted more horsepower. Well after listening to the clan here as well as several customers that had owned them I went to his place to appraise the trade in and looking like new, 119 hours on it when I got there and a general grumbling of no power on the hydro when using the loader or bush hoging on the hill. I saw his pile of dirt he was playing in and went at it, first I dropped it in to the medium range, couldn't believe I could fill the bucket and move the tractor so aggressively as he put it. Got talking and told him how and why to run the tractor. He felt bad after and told me he didn't need to swap with what he had just seen, but we did swap. His neighbor had called the shop when I got back and knowing his fanatical neighbors tractor was not bad bought it over the phone. Just remember that you can't do it all in high range and in tough conditions some times you might even need low range. ....

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Morgan
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2002-08-12          41192

Wow, really? Use the low range for loading? Wow, thanks for telling me. I never would have thought of it.

Then again, there's the new computer operator who thought the CD Rom drive was a cup holder... ....

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TomG
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2002-08-13          41198

Regarding power and ranges: I think that engine output is divided among hydraulics, PTO, TX and PS. More demand of anyone of those means less power available for the rest. Using low range for loader work wouldn't surprise me at all.

I have gears, but I know that in general, my turf tires don't have enough traction to lug the engine except in high range. The hydraulics also will stall before the engine lugs. The only times the engine lugs is if I'm using several things at once. Examples are: going into a pile of gravel and lifting the bucket; backing into a snow band with a blower; pulling up a running auger from a deep posthole.
....

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