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 | prothlauf
Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 25 Des Moines IA 
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2006-06-23 131324
ok I am the fng and for now only have 1 3pt att (5'rear blade) thinking about a single shank subsoiler or mid buster. does a cat 1 have down force or will hyd top link do that beside adjust vert angle of implement?
Thanx pat r
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 | kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon 
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2006-06-23 131325
There is no down force on the 3-point and a hydraulic top link won't provide it either. The hydraulic top link only adjusts the angle. ....
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| prothlauf
Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 25 Des Moines IA
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2006-06-23 131328
Ok that explains why when going down driveway approach the blade doesn't clean the 10" change in height over 3' till tractor is back level. Suggetions on how to do? used fel with weight off front wheels and drug back high to low and removal ....
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| kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2006-06-23 131332
Is the rate of drop knob turned all the way so it drops at its fastest rate? I've heard of putting additional weight on implements to help hold them down. If it reaches its mechanical limit neither of these ideas will help. ....
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| prothlauf
Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 25 Des Moines IA
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2006-06-23 131333
It would drop from raised to down in apx 2 seconds but sure screw tingy was not full open maybe 1/2 turn. so what you are saying if dropped and jpt lever jumps to mid/off it should still go down if not hitting a mech limit? Manual doesn't cover these fine points! ....
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| prothlauf
Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 25 Des Moines IA
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2006-06-23 131334
that was 3pt not jpt need better glasses/fingers. ....
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| kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2006-06-23 131336
If it dropped too slow for the speed you were traveling it may not drop fast enough and skip some spots. It should eventually drop all the way with the control in full down position and the rate knob somewhere less than full closed. ....
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| prothlauf
Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 25 Des Moines IA
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2006-06-23 131337
Thinking about what you said makes sense after few minutes. Need to screw knob all the way open to do the height change as fast as possible. Think was worried about warnings to not catch toes/speed down. Now I just need snow to try!! ThaNX again Patr ....
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| prothlauf
Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 25 Des Moines IA
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2006-06-23 131339
just looked at your pics slightly bigger(and diff color) than my unit!! I to got stuck but didn't roll it, suburban and chain pulled me out of rotted leaf pile going down 45 deg hill. learned lesson fast only 15 hrs on mach in 6 months so fng status thanx again ....
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| kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2006-06-23 131342
Welcome to the "I rolled it and I never want to do THAT again" club! Glad to help - some other folks who own BXs may chip in with more info. It's a little slow here on weekends sometimes. ....
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 | kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2006-06-26 131369
pro,
The angle of the point or plow on your subsoiler and middle buster normally pulls them into the ground. If you a really hard pan you may have an issue but not normally as that is what the subsoiler is designed for.
Boy, grading and subsoiling, two good jobs to find out the traction of your tractor and two good jobs for seatbelts. I would not want a subsoiler without a shear bolt or trip of somekind. Unless you have no rocks or roots at any depth it could reach. ....
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 | reason201
Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 91 Nebraska
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2006-06-27 131450
After reading the posts here, I have a question... If the hyd top link will not apply down pressure to the implement, why is it that if I extend mine fully with a disk harrow attached, the rear wheels of my 4710 lift off the ground?
I put the cylinder on this spring, I was plowing up brome pasture. with out the cylinder extended I could only score the surface, with the cylinder extended, I could dig in over 8". Even if I fully retract the cylinder and put all the force on the front discs it does not dig as well. Not sure why it works but I am sure glad that it does. ....
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| kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2006-06-27 131455
Yikes, that sounds like its putting an awful lot of stress on your lower hitch mount points. Maybe I'm just being cautious. What it's doing is converting horizontal motion to down pressure due to the geometry of the hitch. That doesn't seem to work on my tractor with JD TnT kit. Maybe you have an extra long top cylinder. Was that a JD kit or a 3rd-party product? ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2006-06-27 131457
It would be my thought a top link can be extended sufficiently to give you downward pressure if it is long enough whether the manual or hyd type. But whether that is good on the top link mount might be a concern, espcially if you are picking up your tractor with it. And if you are what about traction?
A question comes to my mind on the disk and the set up of it. If you have your disk gangs set an angles to cut, changing the top link on a 3 pt disk will change their contact with the ground. If you raise the rear of the disk you would be lifting the center blades, if you lower the rear you are lowering the center blades. It could be you don't have sufficient angle in your front gangs or blades and have more in the rear ones causing it to cut better with the rear end lower. It also could be your disk is a light weight model and needs the extra weight (have no idea how that will affect the bearings) the extended top link is giving you. Depending on what you are disking any disk can be a light weight model. Another possiblity is the front gangs are doing the same amount or very near the same amount of cutting either way but the rear blades are really showing the cut as they are the second action and with the weight on the front gangs only you have basically one cut being made and not two. Of course this is based upon my thinking you have a typical double gang disk.
Some trash is very hard to cut if dry. That is why if it is allowed to dry and depending on the amount many farmers will burn it off. There is a lot that can into play with a disk.
....
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| reason201
Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 91 Nebraska
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2006-06-27 131460
A bit of follow up... The cylinder I have is made by Carter & Carter. I don't remember the exact lengths is has but it is shorter than the original manual top link when fully retracted. The only time I have had the rear wheels off the ground is if I am standing still and fully extend the unit with the 3 pt fully down. If I am moving when I extend the top link it just digs in like crazy.
I have a 7 1/2 foot box frame disc from king kutter,(I think around 800 lbs.) I usually disk in 4WD so traction is not a problem. The only issue I have seen so far is having to cautious of overheating the engine. Even doing the heavy plowing in A range will heat the tractor up pretty well after about an hour.
As has been stated, some things are just a bear to disc and brome pasture is one of them. I had to make 7 passes just to get it to the point I could plant. Now that it has been turned, I hope the following years will be much easier work. ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2006-06-28 131476
Reason,
In reading over yout two post here, if you are "digging in 8 inches plus" with your disk and it has either the 18 or the 20 inch blades KK site shows, that makes me wonder if you are not running with the axle dragging which would cause it to push dirt and really give you a load and is part of the overheating problem. If you are running a disk with the axle in the dirt, you will be having a lot of fun and experience in changing bearings and the spacers between the blades. Doing a little math 20 inch blade probably has about a 3 or 4 inch diameter spacers between the blades leaving you at most 8 inches.
The issue of your tractor overheating could be as simple as (especially in disking tall grass or such) you have trash building up over your radiator and shutting off part of it's cooling ability. Also if you are running at higher rpm's that could be it. I would check for trash (it does not take much) and drop a gear and slow the rpms.
As to 7 passes, with the right established grass and dirt and moisture, been there and done that. If you face this often try it with different dryness level of the grass if an option and also in the soil. You should get best results with your gangs set at the max angle (both front and read). You may find the need for some other implement or action there also. If the roots are clumps above ground and you are able burning them off helps. Grass fires do move fast and hot. If time allows, disk and letting it sit for the grass to rot helps. Clumps of grass roots are tough. ....
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| reason201
Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 91 Nebraska
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2006-06-28 131490
KT...
I hear what you are saying about the idea of burning the residue if possible, that is my plan for next year. I learned a few things from this years habitat planting. For next years areas, I am going to hit them with roundup this fall and let them die off as much as possible, then next spring I will burn the area and then disc. After that, I will let the brome and weeds start to come up and in early to mid May, hit them again with roundup. That should give me a good shot at a cleaner planting bed for the food plots.
As for the disc axles draging in the dirt, they are not as far as I can see when I disc. I have the unit with the 20 inch notched discs front and rear. I set them at as much angle as I could with out them touching. (I think I have to respace the disc gangs if I want more angle)I may not be going down exactly 8 inches but it is close. Not sure if adding a bit of weight to the disc would be a good idea or not. I thought about placing my 25 gal. sprayer on the disc frame and filling it with water, that would give be a couple hundred pounds more weight. I am already discing in the lowest range possible on the tractor but I am running pretty high RPMs. Seems like the disc does a little better job at breaking up the clumps if I can go a bit quicker. Hopefully without all the residue, the discs will do a better job breaking up the soil. I did check the radiator and it looked pretty good, I am probably just trying to go too fast and working the tractor a bit too hard... just need to slow down a bit.
I have been amazed so far at the results from the habitat planting we have done so far, we are seeing so many more birds and deer, it really makes a difference. ....
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| kthompson
Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 5275 South Carolina
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2006-06-28 131500
Reason,
I looked at KK web site before I sent my last thoughts and am basing this from there. That disk has 4 or so different preset angles with a single pin to hold the angle. If you are not able to set it to the most aggressive angle without the gangs rubbing against the other side (you are wise to not let that happen) you probably need to loosen one or both the gangs and move them out so they will clear.
When are you planting the food plots? You may be better off to burn in the fall after the grass dies and depending on what animals you are feeding and where you are you may wish to plant a winter grain or grass.
Weight could help. Just be sure it is secure. Them there blades will have fun with a plastic tank. I rather have either old tractor weights or such. My brother has some old cast iron drainage grates that work great.
Running higher RPM past where you really need to be will run the enginer hot or does for me.
Hard dirt and/or trash for me cuts better at slower speed. Faster speed is better for clean and soft dirt.
As to the axle being clear of the dirt, run you hand under the bearings support on the axle. It will tell you quickly if you are bye the way they are worn.
If you are able to disk at a different angle for the second or third time that helps as you hit the clumps and lumps with a cross cut angle.
....
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