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1999cobra
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 28 Vermont
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2005-05-23          111387

Looking at a small utility tractor have looked at the following up close (with sales droid in my face of course) JD 2210, Kubota BX23 and 7510, and now looking at the Kioti CK20 and 25.

The Kioti's are real impressive and I am making a trip to look into those machines VERY closely they look like real workhorses...



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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2005-05-23          111394

Most of the smaller Deere's and a couple not-so-small are completely made in Japan. Hard to find a more trouble free tractor than a 2210.

The BX23 is like a swiss army knife on a camping trip. It will do a hundred small jobs, but skinning a buffalo might be best tried with a bigger tool.

The only practical difference between a BX and a 7510 are the bigger tires.

The best way to buy a tractor is to start with what you want it to do. If you need to brush hog 30 acres don't even bother with the BX or 2210. ....

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1999cobra
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 28 Vermont
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2005-05-23          111397

Well the JD salesman told me that the diesel engine of the 2210 is made by a company called Yanmar...

I don't know, maybe your right - but I just don't like the fact that they are pieced mealed - whether it's in Japan or the US. Plus the PRICE is astronomical completely out of sight!!!! I suppose that's why the company caters to the yuppie crowd.

Plus I don't like the idea of buying from a company that does business with Home Creepo... ....

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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2005-05-23          111398

The whole tractor is Yanmar. You have to shop for the best prices. ....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-05-23          111400

Some people downgrade John Deere because some of their products are made in Japan. Some downgrade them because some of their products are made in the US. Others downgrade them because of where their products are sold. Others downgrade them because of their pride in their colors.

You can't make everybody happy. Most farmers are proud of displaying their green. They ain't yuppies. I presently don't own a JD CUT tractor but my next one will be! And that is for sure!!! ....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-05-23          111401

If you want an American made CUT you need to get a JD model starting with 4 cylinder diesel. I'm told they make the whole thing including the engine. That's a whole lot more tractor than you are looking at. ....

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funchy
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 128 north eastern corner of Maryland
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2005-05-23          111402

the bx23 and 2210 are both compact tractors, not designed for huge jobs. Don't knock the CUTs till you've been on one awhile; I was amazed what my bx23 could do! I opted againt the Jd because theirs wasn't really designed for the BH. They'd have to add a bunch of hoses and a valve and some other stuff (compared to kubota where it's totally designed to run a BH). New Holland was even worse-they wanted me to remove the MMM every time I hooked the BH up (stupid!)

Tell us what you want to do and how big the mowing -plowing - digging projects will be and we can give you a better answer.

I would ignore where the tractor is made. Even "american" cars are assembled of parts made anywhere in the world. Focus instead on the warranty and on the quality of your local dealer. ....

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Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2005-05-23          111403

Yooper the closest we have to an american made cut is probably the Cadet not Deere as the chassis's are made up to and including many of the four cylinders by Yanmar. ....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-05-23          111407

Art:
Several JD dealers have told me that the new 4120's and larger are made by Deere. Sorry if that is incorrect! ....

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Billy
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 975 Southeast Oklahoma
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2005-05-23          111416

1999cobra, With only 3+ acres, a BX would suite you fine. Don't be afraid of being categorized. If it works for you, why would you care?

Far as that goes, you could probably get by with a Murray from Wally World. ....

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1999cobra
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 28 Vermont
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2005-05-23          111421



Well honestly, I don't think a Murray will move dirt, and dig out stumps, pull a York rake or a tiller do you?

Am I being catorgorized because I own 3 acres?

See where I live you pay taxes on the land you own - more land, more tax - I'm a firm believer in just using the amount of land I need and letting the other guy pay taxes on his 20+ acres. If I'm not farming and I'm not - why pay taxes on land I'm not making $$$ on or using ...?

Just good business is all...
Thanks... ....

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Billy
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 975 Southeast Oklahoma
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2005-05-23          111424

Sorry, my mistake! I missed what you were going to use the tractor for.

As far as categorizing, I was talking about tractors and maybe you being titled a yuppie. ....

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1999cobra
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 28 Vermont
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2005-05-23          111438

Well I'm about as far from a yuppie as you can get - definition of yuppie Y oung-U rban-P roffesional...

I'm not young over 50 - I'm not urban, I live in Vermont (very rural) and I'm not proffesional - I'm retired...

So that just about sums it up I guess... Now back to tractor talk... ....

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chevytruck13
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 19 Bismarck ND
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2005-05-24          111455

Is it just me or is Cobra a little touchy and almost wants to pick a fight. Billy just said don't be afraid to buy which ever tractor you want and be labled whatever because of it and he goes off on how he is not a yuppy. Cobra there is all types here. Some may call me a yuppy. Under 30 definately a professional but live on 2 acres. Call me what you want. I use my tractor and don't hire anything out. None of the machines that will do the work you want will be cheap. But in the long run it will be cheaper than hiring someone to do it and you get to have some fun at the same time. If you think playing on the tractor is fun which I do. So lighten up. The Deere 2210 and Kubota BX2230 where within $250 in my area so they are usually quite comparable. I don't know about the Kioti though. ....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-05-24          111456

1999Cobra:
Before we get back to tractor talk, I'd like to see some of your pics. Vermont has some beautiful country and cities. By your handle, I'm assuming you have a Cobra. I'm also into cars, guns, etc.

The size and brand of a guy's tractor is up to the individual. It should match the tasks at hand and be comfortable to operate and have ease of accessory attachment. Most of us have different needs and requirements. In my opinion, dealer location and service is also important. We can give you some input based on our experiences but the purchase decision is yours.

Myself, I like bigger tractors in both size and HP to handle the job in a quicker fashion. The most fun in a tractor purchase is the hunt for the perfect one. ....

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kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2005-05-24          111463

I used to be a yuppie. Still have some good yuppie friends, but I got older and moved to the country. If I was once a yuppie will I always be one? :) ....

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kubotaguy
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 360 Shepherdstown, WV
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2005-05-24          111466

Ken,
Once you rolled your tractor, I think you officially lost your yuppie status and became a crazy country person like myself.

Of course I wonder if I am a yuppie? I work in Washington D.C. and wear a shirt and tie everyday as a professional, however I live in the country. As far as the age, I sometimes feel like I'm 50 and my hairline is probably equivalent to a 50 year old, but still under 35. ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2005-05-24          111467

I was never a Yuppie, I lived in the suburbs, is there a Yussie ?

Then for a while I was a DINK, Dual Income No Kids.

Then I got divorced and became Cougar bait.

Then I got re-hitched and moved to the country where I became a City Slicker (country house, city job).

Then health issues made me Squire, a retired country gentleman.

Now the missus says I'm a PITA.

How's that old song go "signs, signs, everywhere are signs..." maybe we should change it to "handles, handles, handles...".

Best of luck. ....

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1999cobra
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 28 Vermont
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2005-05-24          111469

Murf -You are a riot ... LOL

I think I followed your suit - and no I'm not picking fights just expressing is all - having fun trying to find the right tractor... ....

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AV8R
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 882 North Central Wisconsin
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2005-05-24          111475

I guess that makes me an OINK (one income no kids) hoping to become a DINK soon. (sigh.) ....

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shortmagnum
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 848 Wisconsin
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2005-05-24          111477

This one's pretty bad but...

I'm a TOOT'N TOMAS: Three out of the nest, then one more appeared suddenly.
Dave ....

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DennisCTB
Join Date: Nov 1998
Posts: 2707 NorthWest NJ
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2005-05-26          111557

I think that sub compacts are great machines. But after buying a B7610 with the LA 352 loader I cannot see why people would buy the sub Deere 2210 or the BX instead of the Deere 41XX or the B7510 or B7610.

The Deere 41XX or the B7510 or B7610 can go just about anywhere a plain old Garden Tractor will go so why go smaller. As I see it the subs are made to a price point and also to look less formidable/threatening to the potential buyer, the sub appears to counteract the fear of overbuying by appearing to be not so large, making the potential buyer think it is really just a great garden tractor.

The sub compact tractor is a great business for the manufacturers as they can get more buyers to enter the market, and if the buyer eventually needs more they trade up, another win for the manufacturers. And for many people this works, you do not always have to buy more than you need. If money is not an object I would forget the subs. If it is the subs are a great choice, they have lower lift capacities and smaller loaders but they are hard workers, not garden tractors, still a great tool.

Moving up from the subs is more than just bigger tires when you step up out of the sub category. You cannot ever put bigger tires on a BX or Deere 2210. My neighbor owns a BX and he stopped by to look at my B7610 when I got it. He made alot of hmmmmmm's and ahhhh's after he looked at it. I kept on trying to tell him it was just like his BX. But being an engineer he was not buying it. He could see how everything was quite abit more heavy duty. ....

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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2005-05-26          111559

There are some engineering differences, for sure.

My point has alway been that there is little or no "functional" difference between the 26 inch wheels on the BX and the 30 inch wheels on the 7510, especially when folks try to tell me that a 7510 is "a real tractor" and the BX is some sort of toy.
....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-05-26          111567

Mark:
Any tractor like the 4100 that you can lift the backend off the ground while a FEL is on the front, isn't big enough for me. However, I realize you are a big strong guy.

To me adding that many weights and fluid to the tires is not acceptable. Beside that, your power to weight ratio is too high and I feel it is dangerous to operate! To me, that is the big issue!!!!!

P.S. I like my front tires to be about the size of the rears on a 2210 or even bigger. ....

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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2005-05-26          111571

I have to agree..... the 4100 was too light and it is also gone. The 4115 is just enough heavier and longer to make a noticeable difference.

I might have bought a bigger green machine, but they just don't have the reliability of the smaller Japanese units.

Speaking of heavier..... I am pretty impressed with the Kioti's I saw at the new dealer in town. ....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-05-26          111572

I'm still thinking of upgrading. I like my current tractor but something new would be fun. First I have to find time to get my attactments, etc. together and get it sold. Am torn between a JD 3720 or 4120 and am also looking at the CNH DX 33,35 & 40. My Case dealer has been good to me over the years. Have done some business with the Deere guys and also have been treated good. It is a hard decision. ....

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Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2005-05-27          111605

There are many people that really don't need the BX or any compact but they sure are handy! I see people that get really carried away with the tractor on size and then wind up with a zero turn as there compact can't get around easy enough. ....

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mscott6799
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 57 WV
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2005-05-30          111709

The BX23 is like the little kid you use to pick on in school and when he decided he had enough kicked your butt. Anybody else remember? ....

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1999cobra
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 28 Vermont
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2005-05-30          111714

I am retired - I will be using this tractor just about everyday, in everyway. Summer, fall, winter and spring. (not just a weekend warrior, like most) and when I don't have anything to do with it maybe I'll just drive it up and down the street just for fun - (cause I can)

Snow removal, BH duty, clearing, planting, digging, post hole digging, trenching, improving all characteristics of this land etc,etc.

Thirty acres, 100 acres, 300 acres, I can own 1000 acres and have three cleared acres I use the tractor on. Acreage MEANS NOTHING it's what you want to use the tractor for and then what you need in terms of tractor size vs job.

Really though, when you get down to it - it's all about you, your wallet, and what you want to spend - who gives a rat's a$$ what crusty the clown rides around on next door it's none of my F$$kin' business, just like it's none of his what I do.

Hell - what if I had a postage stamp size lot with a double wide on it but always wanted my own tractor (cause my dad beat me over the head with an old john Deere model tractor when I was a kid it's nobody's business) I think that's what happened I have flash backs - HELP ... LOL

Reason for rant: In the short time I've been looking for a tractor, (going to dealers and reading mounds of material and posts) - I've seen and heard the same story old over and over again - "I bought to small - I coulda', shoulda, wished I had" - blah, blah, blah. More used tractors sitting in the lots at the dealers people who bought small and then took a screwing by the dealer to take the trade. I'm trying to avoid that - If you buy to small you can't do a thing to improve that condition, except trade-up, then take it in the bum from the dealer and that's what I'm trying to avoid (the regret wagon) ....

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oneace
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 1490 south central pa
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2005-05-30          111722

Everybody situation is different. You are right what you do is your business nobody else's. A tractor is a big purchase and you should take you time to find the one that suits your needs the best weather it be a sub compact or a 200 hp monster. You are the only one that has to be happy. I also have to say that regardless of what manufacturer you buy from as long as you keep the unit in good shape and maintain it they all have excellent resale value. ....

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lbrown59
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2005-06-24          112713

want to avoid astronomical sales tax) in NH or NY any ideas...???
1999cobra
===============
You can't legally avoid sales tax unless you
1*Get a vendors Tax Exempt number
or
2*Have your property listed as Agricultural if it qualifies.

....

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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2005-06-24          112714

Or...... buy out of state and pay cash or arrange your own financing. ....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-06-24          112715

I live in small town USA. The local tractor dealer leaves the keys in it. You could avoid taxes but other penalties could apply! ....

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