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Undecided b7800 vs L2800

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matthewh
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 57 sanford, nc
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2005-02-20          106506

I was sure I was going to buy a b7800. Then my dealer started to introduce me to the l2800. Both will have loaders.
He said (on a message) that they were about the same in price.

WHATS THE DIFFERENCES IN THESE TRACTORS?

I see that the L2800 is a little heavier. What else. I'll be using this around my 3 acre property and to landscape. Which means I'll be trailering and using it in peoples yards. Is the L2800 too big for this? I'll be speaking with the dealer tomorrow.
I really was convinced the b7800 was the machine for me, and had heard nothing but good about them.
Please advise.
Thanks.
Matt


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matthewh
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2005-02-21          106541

Oh boy. My dealer has angered me. I want the 60" bucket on the b7800 and I understand that for that option it will cost more. BUT he want to charge me the freight to get it there also, which will be about $100 more. Is it just me or is this bs???

By the way, the price dif on the l2800 quoted by him was $400. Same options ie hst, 4x4, loader, etc.
Matt ....

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beagle
Join Date: Jan 2004
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2005-02-21          106544

matt, I have the 7800 and really like it. I have about the same size property as you, just under 3 acres, and have found that it does everything I want it to. I also trailer it to the vacation home, so find the size of the B-series very convenient.

I think for general landscaping, mowing, and loader work, the 7800 is a great tractor. You may want to look at the 3-pt controls. The 7800 does not have position control for the 3-pt.

Regards ....

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matthewh
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 57 sanford, nc
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2005-02-21          106545

Beagle,
Yeah, I've followed your posts. You have a great looking tractor LOVE THE REMOTE HYDROS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
OK, so am I out of line on the $100 shipping deal. I'm going to be paying 15500 for this tractor and they want 100 to ship an optional loader. To me, they can eat that.
Other questions, with filled tires and a box blade, do you find the b7800 to be fairly stead doing loader work. I'll be digging and moving more than anything else with the loader. I'm ordering a toothbar.
Also, how tall are you and is it comfortable. I'm 6feet 3 inches tall and need some leg room (thats one reason I liked the flat deck on the b7800.
Please provide any info, as I love research and want to make the RIGHT choice for ME. This aint chump change (i'm only 26 years old and run my own bus.)
By the way, I had a beagle named molly for 16 of my 26 years and what a dog!
Matt ....

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beagle
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2005-02-21          106550

matt, I have filled r-4's, and do a lot of loader work without putting the box blade on. I wouldn't recommend that to anyone, but the tractor handles pretty well even without the box blade. I run it that way because I have a hydraulic dump wagon that I fill with the loader, and haul and dump. Wouldn't be able to do that with the box blade on.

If you've seen my pictures, I added a position indicator to the three point to overcome the lack of position control. Pretty happy with the way it compensates for the 1/4" valve.

I'm only 5'-7", the wife is 4'-10", so we wouldn't be the best people to comment on legroom. All I could tell you for sure is that we have plenty. I keep the seat about half-way back. I would suggest you ride them both and determine which feels better for you. ....

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matthewh
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2005-02-21          106551

I could'nt make out your 3ph indicator. Could you elaborate on this?
Thanks.
Matt ....

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beagle
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2005-02-21          106553

Look at pics 2 and 4. It is the box mounted behind the loader tower. It reads the elevation of the 3-point arms in 1/4" increments so I can repeatedly set a rear implement at the same level. ....

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matthewh
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2005-02-21          106560

Would'nt it work just to write the increments with a permanent marker or a paint marker on the fender beside the controls? That is if you don't add hydraulics I mean?

Anyone have any comment on the l2800?
Matt ....

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beagle
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2005-02-21          106569

Marking the fender would not work. The 3-pt control lever does not position the arms, it only moves them up or down, in 1/4" increments, or full flow. Positioning the lever would move the hitch until it stops in either direction, full up, or full down.

Believe me, I would not have gone through the trouble of building the indicator system if all that was needed was markings. The hydraulic controls are completely different, with a hydraulic feedback system, on position controls. The feedback system controls the position of the 3-pt depending on were the control lever is placed. ....

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jarndt
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2005-02-23          106649

The L-series machines are built on a larger platform than the B-series. I would tend to think an L2800 is too much tractor for 3 acres. You'd probably be happier with the addtional manuverability of the B7800. If I were buying, I wouldn't even consider an L-series tractor below 10 acres unless there was a very specific requirement that a B-series tractor couldn't meet. ....

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matthewh
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2005-02-23          106650

Thank you so much for that. Thats what I'm looking for.
My consideration not only involves my property 3 acres,
but I'll be trailering a good bit for landscaping jobs. I focus on residentials, so I'll be accessing backyards etc.

The specs show the l2800 to have a longer wheelbase and sit lower by 1 inch but the b7800 is slightly wider.

I just can't see where the weight is on the l2800, it weighs over 1000 lbs more.

I just wonder if the xtra weight and hp at the pto is worth the xtra money to purchase and difficulty to haul and chance I'll have to turn jobs down for accessabilitys sake.

Its a big purchase for me (second only to my house) and I can't afford to make a bad choice so I'm looking for comparison comparison comparison.

THanks,
Matt ....

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beagle
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2005-02-23          106651

I believe a lot of the extra weight is in the castings. The B-Series have a lot of alluminum castings, were the L- Series have iron. If you compare the B-series to many of the competitors products, you will see that they come up lighter than most any other tractor brands in thier class. This isn't necessarily a bad thing. Not only are they easier to trailer, they have a much better power to weight ratio than the heavier tractors. In other words, you can do the work of a heavier 35hp tractor with a 30hp B-Series ( 7800 or 3030 ), with about the same feel, except the obvious reduction at the pto.

Some will cetainly prefer the weight and the iron. I put the weight on when I need it, but can shed it when I don't. The B-7800 has a reinforcing "frame" in the drive train to avoid over-stressing the clutch housing, which nornmally takes the beating first. I've been told that the 7800 is reinforced enough to mount a three point backhoe, as long as the top-link bracket is replaced with the reinforced bracket, which I am planning on doing this spring.

We really enjoy our 7800. If you have any other specific questions about the machine, let me know. I, like you, did a lot of reseach when we traded for this tractor.

Regards ....

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matthewh
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 57 sanford, nc
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2005-02-23          106657

Does anyone know whether or not the maneuverablility of the b7800 would be much greater than that of the l2800?
Another point of interest is that the l2800 has no mid mount pto, so no belly mower in the future.
Research is the hard part of buying a tractor, I can make the money. But it is crucial.
The l2800 motor makes 29 hp and about 3 or 4 more hp at the pto.
The b 7800 makes 30 hp and a few less hp at the pto.
Also the l2800 is a 3 cylinder vs the b7800 4 cylinder. What difference does that make overall?
THANKS SO MUCH< I MEAN IT
Matthew ....

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beagle
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2005-02-23          106663

The L2800 you are comparing to is probably the gear transmission. Gears loose slightly less hp than the HST. Look at the L2800 HST, you will find they are about the same. The B7800 has about a 1 foot smaller turning radius than the L2800. Therefore, a little more nimble.

Four cylinder engines run smoother at lower rpms, 3-cylinder engines develop more torque than a four at comparable rpms. ....

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jarndt
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2005-02-23          106664

The hydrostatic tranny on the B7800 will be vital to residential work. For that reason alone I would discount the L2800DT. The cost difference for an HST version will be more. Don't get me wrong... a family member of mine owns an L2250DT (very similar to the L2800) but it resides on 33 acres and is used for hobby farming, not landscaping or finish mowing. I also wouldn't get too wrapped up in PTO HP. Both tractors should have plenty for landscaping work. ....

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JParker
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2005-02-23          106672

I'm suprised nobody has mentioned the B2910. Although I have the B7800 and love it, the only weaknesses in my opinion are the lack of position control and rear hydraulics. Both of which can be gotten (I think) on the B2910. Give it a look. If you are planning on a lot of final grading you will really want one or both of these options. The lights are a bit better too, but that is fairly easily fixed if necessary.

Add a roof and rear work light to whatever tractor you order.

- JP

P.S. - Forgot one thing. FEL's are more like a snow shovel than a spade. They aren't really for digging as much as scooping and lifting. they can dig some, but that is really back hoe territory, or box blade with the teeth down. Mine like to dig with the box better than with the FEL. ....

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kubotaguy
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 360 Shepherdstown, WV
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2005-02-23          106674

Matthewh,
As far as being tall, my brother is 6'4" and has used my tractor and didn't complain about anything except for the boomer rang HST pedal that he had trouble getting his size 14's accustomed to.
I do most of my loader work with nothing on the back but I do have loaded R-4's. However when I do use the box blade on the back I can tell the tractor is a lot more stable, but my box blade weighs about 500 pounds. I have 6.5 acres and the 7800 has been plenty for me. As far as the cost of the shipping, I wouldn't let it be a deal breaker since you are all ready going to drop $16,000. Maybe ask the dealer to do the 50 hour maintenance for you which would work out cheaper for you.
Good luck ....

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beagle
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2005-02-23          106682

The 2910 is going the way of Oldsmobile, so you may be able to get one at a decent price. It is being replaced with the B-3030. Both have position control.

I agree, lack of position control is the only weakness of the B-7800. ....

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matthewh
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 57 sanford, nc
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2005-02-23          106694

Ok, first let me say that whatever I paid for this membership was well worth it. Thanks for the help so far......

I wear a size 15 shoe. I sat on the 7800 again today and if I buy it I'll need to mount the seat back from where it is, which is something I can do. The l2800 looks too big, I also saw it today put together. They now have a hst.

Having said that, i've done plenty of good grading without a position control, so I'm confused. In my past, I've just used a lever stop with a wingnut so I came back to the same spot. Why would'nt that work.

Also, I disagree still about the shipping charge. Why can't they absorb that? I still haven't told them that it is a dealbreaker for me, but it is. Does'nt seem right.

....

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beagle
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2005-02-23          106702

matt, think of a position control system like a power steering system. Place the steering wheel where you want it, and the steering cylinder will move to that position, and stop. The steering system valve hydraulic feedback sets the postion of the cylinder in a set location. In contrast, with a hydraulic system without a feedback valve, you have a 'flow' or 'no flow' condition. This is the case for a three point system without position control. The amount you move the lever only determines how fast the arms move, and cannot indicate to the arms where to stop. As long as the lever is not in the nuetral postion, there is flow to the cylinder, so the arms keep moving until the cylinder strokes out, or in.

This is completely different than postion control, and the modifications required to turn Kubota's 1/4" valve to postion control is cost prohibitive. I checked into it when I was upgrading my 7800. What you described with a way to hold the lever in position indicates the hydraulic system was set up for position control.

Hope this helps. ....

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kubotaguy
Join Date: Nov 2003
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2005-02-24          106739

The 3 pt hitch on the 7800 is similar to a log splitter in that you push and hold the handle down until you want it to stop and it stays there. You pull it up and hold it to where you want it to stop. Like as said the problem is in fine grading. Try to stop a wood splitter in the same place several times in a row.
You say the shipping is a deal breaker for you. I'm not positive but I think this is how that works. The dealer normally gets a large amount of inventory and then if they have to order other items they have to pay shipping on those items so they are passing the cost to the buyer. Instead of being completely honest, most dealers will say the item is a $250 upgrade which would be $150 upgrade and $100 for shipping. It seems like your dealer is being pretty honest with you which would be worth more than a $100 to me. A good honest dealer is worth their weight in gold.
Most people get the 54" bucket on the 7800 as I think the 60" bucket was a light duty bucket. I've bent my 54" bucket all ready so I wouldn't think the 60" bucket would hold up as well.
As far as moving the seat, you may want to be careful as that could possibly void your warranty. You may have to look at another brand of machine to be comfortable. I've heard New Hollands work better for tall people since their seats go up as the go back. Keep your options open.
Good luck. ....

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beagle
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2005-02-24          106752

The 1/4" valve does allow better control than a log splitter valve. I am able to return the arms to the same postion using the indicator and the 1/4" action of the controller.

Still not postion control, but as close as you can get without the real thing. ....

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Archdean
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2005-02-24          106755

We sell B7800's 20:1 over an L2800, Reason Fits your property better than anything on the market, I have the same size and I use a B7510 with Back Hoe!!And there isn't anything this little guy won't do!!!

Most that have a need for a L2800 quickly pass it by for a 30 40 or even a 50 something!!

hope this helps you and Just go with the B7800 and be a happy camper!!

Dean ....

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matthewh
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2005-02-24          106759

WAIT!!!!!!!!!
I was ready to go to the dealership tomorrow (fri) and order this tractor like I spec'd it out on this forum, UNTIL I read the light materials comment.
I wanted the 60" option for mulch, but I'd use it like crazy for everything else anyone with a loader would use it for, everything. If it is made with thinner steel and is more prone to bend, that changes everything.
Please advise?
Also, beagle, did your tractor come with the seat thats on it, I like the arm rests.
Matt ....

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Archdean
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2005-02-24          106765

Matt my friend, you are over analyzing this problem!!

I can assure you as others have as well (Beagle and others)
Which gave you very good advice, Kubota makes every product well, the L2800 is yesterday's technology not that, that is bad but we didn't get to the Moon in a Cast Iron Rocket Ship!! Did WE?

From what you said I still stand by my advice to go With the B7800 and the truth be told I would further advise you to go with a B7510), they are better appointed and shorter and stronger on that account alone!! Now stop fretting and Drive them all and then MAKE A DECISION AND BE HAPPY!!

Kubota will give good service no matter which you choose!! Or in retrospect save your money as something tells me that you are just not ready yet!!!

Sincerely and the best of luck with whatever decision you eventually make but sooner or later you will have to make one or the other!!!

Dean ....

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dklopfenstein
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2005-02-24          106766

This is coming from a JD guy...but the B2910 (and its new replacement) does have position control on the 3PH. Along with that, better lighting, easier adjustment on the 3PH, and a nicer seat if I remember correctly. Other than that, it is the same tractor as the B7800. IMO, it would be worth the extra $$$ for the position control and the better lighting...7800 has severe light problems. Good luck... ....

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Archdean
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2005-02-24          106767

dk,
the B7910 is history and not made anymore, look to the 30 series now!!
Dean ....

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matthewh
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2005-02-24          106768

Yeah, I've made the decision, I just want to get the details right. And I really do value the advise. I'm sure I'll be happy. I just hear the bucket thing and think, oh no, I'll surely bend the 60" more, and I'm paying an xtra 200 for it!!
In my life I've bought a house and an 8k mower, so this is a big purchase for me. I don't have fears, just concerns.
Matt ....

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beagle
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2005-02-24          106769

Sorry, I'm an engineer, over analyze everything.

The seat is a modified 7800 seat. My wife bought me the arm rests from a 2910, and I fabricated the bracket to attach them to the seat. I would agree with the extra $$ for the 2910, or the 30 series B's when available. If you look at my 7800, I spent $$ on 2910 parts; rear and side fenders, arm rests, lights, etc., not to mention the position indicator. The 7800 is a great tractor, if you want to start economy and do the modifications yourself, it was a bit of fun putting it all together.

It's been a bit of fun talking about it.... for some of us. Sorry for the over analyzing, bad habit. ....

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Archdean
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2005-02-24          106770

Beagle the Engineer, I do believe you got your wires crossed, Sorry for the misunderstanding I simply was trying to rescue Matt from the tall weeds of buying a tractor , I support the statements you made!!

BTW I copied your light setup and said privately (this guy has got all his eggs in the right basket)!! As well as some 6 or so that copied my front lift platform idea but I guess thats just and old pilot thing!!

When Young Matt finally gets off the dime I'll bet he won't shut-up for 6 months!!

All my best to all of you and no one gets a bigger thrill from listening to a fellow Kubota owner pontificate that his paticular decission/tractor was the best thing since***********/or ***

Dean
....

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matthewh
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2005-02-24          106771

Yeah, I can't wait.
Beagle, I LOVE to tweak things, to add on, modify, and customize. I've got a 73 scout ----not an elderly man thats prepared :) ----------that I literally belong in because of all of the mods that i've done to it.

So.....I can't wait to take delivery on the tractor.

You guys make me smile "off the dime".

Great forum.
Matt ....

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Archdean
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2005-02-24          106772

Atta-Boy Matt!!!
I enjoyed it also, keep us posted!!!
Dean ....

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jarndt
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2005-02-25          106777

matthewh,

Don't worry about bending the bucket. Buckets can be reinforced easily with steel angle and a MIG welder. Chances are you'll eventually bend it anyway. When's the last time you saw a perfectly straight bucket on a landscaping tractor? It'd be like a work truck without a dent!

Another thought... If you're using this tractor for your business and your business does well, you should be able to upgrade to a more fully featured machine later!

Get the B7800 and call it a day. Good luck, and let us know how your sales experience goes. ....

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beagle
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2005-02-25          106783

Forgot to mention, I have the 60" bucket. The I added a bolt on pice of HSS 3x3X1/4 accross the top of the cutting edge. I use this for lifting and hoisting, and it also acts as the top rail for my bucket forks. I've lifted some pretty big bundles of fencing with the forks, and drug and lifted all kinds of stuff off the lifting lug without bending anything.

My neighbor bent his the first day he got the machine trying to pry a stump out of the ground by curling the bucket. The hydraulics and stump won, the buchet lost.

Use and abuse. It's definitely a light bucket, but with a few modifications...... ....

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GrayFox123
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2010-01-16          168096

I have owned New Holland sub compacts, numerous John Deere tractors and the B and L series Kubota. My favorite is the L series in Kubota. Of course the B7800 is no longer available so you would have to compare the B3200 to the L2800 or L3200. If you compare the L2800 to the B3200, the price difference, for me, was $300.00 I checked them both, operated them both and chose the L series. I like the heavy bucket verses the B series then bucket on the loader.
I like the heavy duty L rear end, larger axles, beefy supports for loader arms, and there was more metal and the B had more plastic. If you need a light tractor for transport choose the B. If you want a solid frame, well built tractor, choose the L. They are both reliable. I am
6'3" and the L fit me better. It seemed to have more traction, larger tires and felt more comfortable. I have rented both B and L also and when working, the B seemed to bounce around more which makes me feel sick after while. I like to work and feel more grounded with less bouncing.
Anyway, you will be happy with either, but personally, I would rate the L series a 9 and the B series a 7. We get a lot of snow in Michigan along the shores of Lake Michigan and the L has a larger bucket, more traction and the operator platform seems much more comfortable to me. The L has a heavier rear PTO area and handles the heavier and larger blades better also. ....

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