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JD4110 ballast box

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johnson445
Join Date: Jul 2003
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2002-12-07          45840

I recently purchased a JD4110 hydro with a 60" front bucket, a 60" allied 3pt blower, a 60" Midmount mower, and a ballast box. Tractor have R4 tires. This is an outstanding machine. I looked at all s and this is the only one I was comfortable having my 12yr old daughter operate and she can handle it well.

My question is what should I fill the ballast box with? Concrete would be the heaviest but you could never empty it, then again if I fill it with rock I will probably never empty it anyway. Any suggetions from the board?


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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2002-12-07          45843

It is hard to overdo the ballast on this model. It has a very light rear end. I would go with the heaviest material listed.
I really doubt you will ever feel the need to empty it anyway.
If you get some heavy duty casters you can build a little wheeled pallet out of 2x4's and plywood to set it on when you take it off the tractor. It will be a whole lot easier to get it back on if you can roll it around. ....

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Green_in_MI
Join Date: Feb 2002
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2002-12-07          45846

If you fill it with sand, peastone, or rocks you will have all the ballast you will need. If you find some scrap pieces of steel that would help too. I would not waste it putting concrete in it. In the warm weather you might want to use it to carry water or a tree or shovels/rakes or something useful. ....

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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
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2002-12-07          45855

I have had the rear end of my 4100 off the ground a couple of times when I got the bucket lip stuck under a root. That was with loaded tires (+240#), me (285#), and 650# of three point ballast. Thank God the power steering had enough ompf to hold the tractor straight until I could put it back on the ground because the slope I was working on would have rolled the tractor if it didn't hold. Word to the wise......

Also, if I put my pallet forks on the FEL (they weigh maybe 90 pounds) I can lift the rear end of my unballasted 4100 off the ground with one hand and hold it there balanced on the front axle. I am not joking. I am stronger than average, but not that strong!

Trust me when I say it has a light rear end. ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2002-12-08          45864

Mark: I remember that discussion, and lifting up the rear would have been a real eye-opener for me. I also remember how bouncy my heavier 1710 was with loads of gravel in the fairly small bucket when I first got the tractor and before I had anything to put on the 3ph. The tractor has unloaded turfs. And, I remember having to use 4wd to back up a grassy ditch bank I drove down to position the tractor for the next post-hole. The weight transfer forward on the slope took most of the traction off the rear wheels.

I'd say that it's hard to overdo rear ballast in terms of tractor balance and that should be the first concern. There have been discussions here about the effects of excessive ballast. Shock loads to the frame from heavy bucket loads in transit are greater with a heavy rear end. Something to keep in mind, but I wouldn't think it would be much of an issue if I found myself on my nose.
....

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kiwi
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2002-12-23          46500

I went around half a dozen tire shops with the box in the bed of my truck and filled it with old wheel weights.Effective and free!! Estimate about 1000lbs of lead ....

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johnson445
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2002-12-23          46511

did they give you the wheel weights for free? I figured they would recylce than and they would have some value. ....

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Bill Jones
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2002-12-31          46770

I also have a 4110 hydro, I filled my ballsat box with gravel and topped it off with about six inches of concrete. I left it a couple of inches from the top and it gave me a nice place to store my chains, etc. ....

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johnson445
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2002-12-31          46778

excellent idea. You could bust out the concrete if you ever wanted to empty the box. Might also be a good idea to drill a couple drain holes in the side so water doesn't sit in the box. I have a 60" bucket on my 4110 and no ballast in the tires, do you think the ballast box alone is enough rear weight? ....

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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
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2003-01-01          46789

Johnson, a ballast box will do just fine especially if your land is fairly flat. The loaded tires are really handy if you are operating on slopes. My experience with the my 4100 is that a thousand pounds is not too much ballast if you are doing heavy loader work, especially if you consider that your loader and bucket weigh 400+ pounds and the load of dirt you are lifting in the bucket can easily go 600 pounds. ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2003-01-01          46790

It's a little hard to say. The steering on my Ford (with gimpy PS) can be a little hard when carrying load of gravel in the loader and an implement on the 3ph but I can't say that I've ever felt that it has been 'rear end bouncy' when an implement is mounted. I have unloaded turf tires. Most of my implements are around 20% of the tractor's GW plus loader. For comparison, I think concrete weighs about 125 lbs. a cubic foot and gravel somewhat less. Maybe somebody knows for sure.

Different CG's, terrain, wheel-bases and weight-distributions might change things though. I think I'd approach it pragmatically, try some weight and see how it feels. I'm not sure I'd want to depend on ballast alone to ensure the safety of a 12-year old operator. However, that is about the age my uncles started letting me do simple fieldwork on my own.

I would keep in mind that it's possible to be too heavy in the rear and a concrete ballast box sort of defies ballast adjustment, and of course it's not there at all when a 3ph implement is mounted. The weight of an implement also doesn't contribute to ballast when the implement is on the ground working. Without wheel weight, it's a little hard to add rear weight for extra traction when using a 3ph implement. However, wheel weight doesn't lighten hard steering when carrying heavy loader loads as will weight on the 3ph.
....

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Ron
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2003-01-01          46816

I have a JD 790 w/ballast box. I filled mine with a few inches of small gravel on the bottom for drainage, then topped it off with sand. The sand sure comes in handy for sprinkling on those icey driveway spots after im done pushing the snow. I also use the sand to clean my garden tools in the spring. I force the shovels, hoe etc.into the sand and it cleans all the gunk and rust off.
I understand your thoughts about the concrete.It does seem that you would have more weight, but it's so permenant. Using sand would give you more options down the road.
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JAZAK
Join Date: Jul 2003
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2003-01-02          46851

RON: nice idea, I was also thinking on this issue,no more! ....

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marklugo
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Posts: 281 Tifton, GA
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2003-01-02          46852

Try really wet sand! ....

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CompactUser
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2003-03-01          50317

I have a JD 4000 compact with a front end loader. I know the manual recommends putting wheel weights on as well as a tremendous amount of weight on the 3 point. I am only using this to remove snow, and do yard work (plant ball trees, move small piles, etc.) If I have 400-500 lbs on a 3 point, do you really need ballasted tires? ....

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CompactUser
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2003-03-01          50318

((P.S. And, BTW in reference to the above. I bought 60 lb plastic bags filled with sand, and just dropped them into the JDeere ballast box. That way I can remove them, if lets say I want to haul in them, etc. And, also no sand leaking over the floor and driveway.)) ....

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marklugo
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Posts: 281 Tifton, GA
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2003-03-01          50324

The one problem that is critical to the thinking of the ballasted tire issue is that it places no load on the axle bearings. All the weight is self contained on the rim and tire rubber. What happens is that these tractors are built light and lean and don't have much in the way of casting reinforcements and bearings. There is a tendency for the rice krispy elves to make a visit on your tractor (snap krackle, then POP!)The weight of 500 lbs is multiplied when installed on the 3 pt and is hanging a foot to the rear of the tractor. Old front End loaders from the early days used rear ballast. They also used weights as well. But then remember, these units weighed 4X's as much and were much sturdier. ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
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2003-03-02          50343


Tractors are ballasted for balance as well as for traction. Snow removal might take some traction and extra weight might be desirable.

Tractors should be designed to carry some ballast but as Mark said weight on the wheels is less stressful to the tractor than weight on the 3ph. On the other hand, weight on the 3ph or in the loader is better than wheel weight for balancing a tractor. There is another recent thread where max ballast specs for 4100's was discussed.

....

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