Go BottomJD 4600 Design Manufacting Defect Index
 | Eric Mullins
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2000-11-30 21997
Has anyone compiled an index of the various flaws from the factory on the 4600, or others? Front axle, metal shavings, etc?
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| kay
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2000-11-30 22006
I strongly suggest every reader try to sort out the wheat from the chaff, when it comes to complaints about different color tractors on the internet. It is easy to 1) complain and make it sound like a bigger deal than it really is, and 2) impersonate being an owner of a brand, and post ugly things that are not true.
Take all the information for what it is (and with a grain of salt), and check it out for yourself. Otherwise, you may be the real loser. Hope not to step on toes, but it is the danger of the web. Albeit, there is still a lot of useful information here. ....
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| Larry in MI.
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-12-01 22046
Eric, I am not aware of any compiled list of problems with the 4000 series of JD's though the posts on this board would indicate that there have been many. I would hope that JD has taken the time to compile such a list but they are unlikely to share negative information. As for Kay's message, my toes are a bit sore. 1) My JD4100 still does not run right, my dealer did in fact lie to me, I am a real person 2)I am not a tractor salesperson, and the internet is not an evil place filled with persons with mean spitited agendas. These are the same people that you work with every day only in different places. 3)Going one or two steps further..... I would be willing to say that I view this forum as a place to discuss compact utility tractors with a bunch of regular people that I would love to spend time with in their shops if I could only afford to travel to their locations. I suspect that Kay may be guilty of the very points that Kay makes. ....
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 | cutter
Join Date: Feb 2000 Posts: 1307 The South Shore of Lake Ontario, New York 
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2000-12-02 22059
Larry, what problems are you having with your 4100? I owned one for two years and really had no problems except lack of power for some tasks and the hst. pedals being overly stiff. The machine ran great. The salesman did take advantage of my ignorance at the time. He represented the machine as being able to do more than it safely could do. I was very unfamiliar with them and had to find out for myself. ....
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| Larry in MI.
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-12-02 22069
Hi cutter, my problem with the 4100 is cold weather starting. It belches large amounts of smoke and acts like it is flooded. The dealer took it in and claims to have rebuilt the injectors that were not spraying properly. The rebuild obviously did not work. The dealer claims that JD will not replace the injectors, that he has to rebuild them. Other than that I have been relatively happy with the tractor. Like you, I was not very familiar with tractor capabilities when I made the purchase. I wish I would have gotten a larger tractor. ....
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 | dsg
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 528 Franklin, Maine 
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2000-12-02 22070
Eric, I own a JD4700, bought it in July and have 382 hours on it now. I ordered it May 9th to be built to my spec's. I will list the problems I know JD has had with the 4000 series, most of which were told to me by the local JD machanic and some are from experience. The largest of the problems was the poor design on the first front axle JD was placing on the machines (tearing turf in a turn), then Something about the hydro pumps not filtering dust and premature wear, then Some type of washers or spacers in the transmissions that were suppose to be harden were not and wore prematurly, I'm sure I have forgoten some and I have not experienced any of those problems. It is my understanding all of those problems had been fixed by April 2000. The only problems I have had with the 4700 are the 3pth seems to slowly leak down with a load on it, two bolts that hold on the step on the left side of the tractor broke away from the transmission housing when I hit the step on a stump and both of these problems are going to be taken care of under warrantee. I'm sure other posters can add to the list, but the above problems I guess are the most wide spread. David ....
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| cutter
Join Date: Feb 2000 Posts: 1307 The South Shore of Lake Ontario, New York
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2000-12-02 22071
Larry, I did not have a problem with smoking. Try calling J/D yourself, I can't believe they expect you to live with it. I think my TC29 smokes more than my J/D did upon startup. A guy up the road works as a mechanic for one of the largest J/D dealers in the country. He claims they have had transmission failures on that model as well, take it for what it is worth. Good luck. ....
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| Larry in MI.
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-12-02 22072
I knew when I posted that message that I was forgetting one very important issue. "Complain and make it sound like a bigger deal than it really is" was that issue. I'm not saying that no one should purchase a JD4100 because I had a problem. I am saying that I had a problem with the JD4100 that I purchased and no one seems to care (other than me). To me $17K (total cost for loader, tractor, mower deck, ballast box, and a few other things)for a machine that does not perform without problems and warranty satisfaction is a big issue to me. I suspect there are a few other posters that have suffered far greater financial disappointments. Enough said on that topic. dsg listed several problems with the 4XXX series. I think he must have escaped the dash fogging problem. Obviously I am not going to receive relief from my dealer and I would like to know how much it would cost for a new set of injectors for the 4100 and how difficult it would be to install them. Thanks in advance for any help. ....
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| TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley 
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2000-12-04 22107
I know this isn't shoptalk, and I own a Ford anyway. But I was wondering about smoke at start up. If it's only at start up, injector spray (usually taken to mean the spray patterns) doesn't sound like the problem. Injectors that leak down fuel into the cylinders while the tractor is sitting could make the smoke, but that's something that would be unusual in a new tractor. I wonder what 'rebuilding the injectors' and 'weren't spraying properly' actually means. I guess the tractor smokes at start up irrespective of the throttle setting. I use 1/2 - 3/4 in cold weather, less when it's warmer. Of course, insufficient glow plug and some other things would make it smoke.
A fluky sort of question just occurred to me. I wonder how the max rpm adjustment is set. I'd have to think through how throttle settings and the governor work at start up, but maybe there's a chance a high max rpm setting would give a larger initial shot of fuel. Of course, this might be a wacky idea, but then somebody might tell me and I'd learn something.
....
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| Larry in MI.
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-12-04 22123
TomG, I have read your post with considerable interest. The excessive smoking and flooded engine does happen regardless of the throttle setting at startup. I tested the glow plugs with an ohm meter and the readings were consistent from one to the other and I did electrically isolate them by removing the wire from the top. I also physically inspected one of them by removing it from the tractor and examined the internal coil. The maximum throttle setting is as it came from the factory and runs at 2650 rpm. I have tried fuels from different sources. Please keep thinking and let me know what you come up with. I also wonder what rebuilding the injectors and were'nt spraying properly actually means. I do not think your ideas are wacky. ....
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 | Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2000-12-05 22143
Strange column to be talking about fords and injectors but here goes boys. The injector in your engine is meant to hold fuel back until it goes over a certain presure. Many hold till 1000lbs pressure and more. When that cylinder is to fire that line will get a burst of fuel pressure and overcome the seal in the injector and sending the fuel into the cylinder. There are holes in the injector tip some with just one and I've seen up to five holes. Leak down is when the seal gets weak and allows the fuel to weep by at a lower pressure allowing there to be fuel in the cylinder at the wrong time. This is what causes the smoke. Otherwise most cold engines depending on design smoke for a period when first started. Indirect injection normally gives less smoke when cold. ....
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| Brad H
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2000-12-05 22145
Please let me assure you - if you call the John Deere 1 800 number in the back of your owners manual and tell them your gripe they absolutly will take whatever steps are necessary to regain your confidence. Give them a chance! Not all dealers take care of their customers, thats why the number is there. They know they have a long reputation at stake and they aren't going to ruin it over a tractor. Let us know how it goes! ....
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| Larry in MI.
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-12-05 22148
Brad H. I will give the 800 number a try. Deere does have an excellent reputation. I have purchased 4 of them over the years and this is the first one that I have had a real problem with. I will let the board know how I am treated at the 800 number. ....
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| Larry in MI.
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-12-05 22149
Brad H. I will give the 800 number a try. Deere does have an excellent reputation. I have purchased 4 of them over the years and this is the first one that I have had a real problem with. I will let the board know how I am treated at the 800 number. ....
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| Roger L.
Join Date: Jun 1999 Posts: 0
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2000-12-05 22151
Larry, I also agree that JD should take every step to keep owners enthusiastic about their purchase....and can't understand why they won't. Hope you have luck. There are not many reasons why diesels smoke excessively, although they will all smoke and even spit partly burned fuel when they are cold.
I'll set your mind at ease on the injectors. Most of them are designed to be rebuilt and there is no reason in the world why a rebuilt one would not be just as good as a new one. Some rebuild shops claim that their rebuilds are more accurate than new. I can appreciate their reasoning.
Every medium to large city has a shop that does diesel injector servicing. You could have them test yours if you are still curious.
....
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| TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2000-12-06 22162
Guess I'm out of ideas, wacky or otherwise, but I hope you'll post an explanation when it gets sorted out. What you describe doesn't sound like normal cold engine smoke (mine continues to puff a bit on acceleration until it gets up to operating temperature). Most things that cause an engine to smoke don't cure themselves when the engine warms up, so the list of candidate problems is narrowed down. The only thing I can think of is an injector seal that leaks more cold than when warm. However, that's theory. Maybe somebody actually experienced such a problem, and on a fairly new tractor. Well, I guess if hang around long enough, an off-the-wall idea will occur. This one is fuel line bleeding. Mine can be difficult to bleed when I change the fuel filter. Until I get the air out, it does act like it's flooded. There is some, but not a bunch, of smoke. I'm not sure how air could get into a line once it's bleed, except maybe if the tank shut-off valve is closed. ....
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| Halsey Green
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2000-12-06 22163
For everyone's information, I received a customer survey from John Deere yesterday, asking me to rate the tractor, the dealer, and a space for other comments. I have a JD 790 and purchased it in May. Has anyone else gotten one? Since I haven't had any problems, except slow delivery of the rear hydraulic outlet from the parts depot, I had to rate them pretty good. ....
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| Larry in MI.
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-12-07 22216
I called the JD customer service 800 number today. It was easy to operate, fast, and the service rep. was polite. After explaining the problem, arrangments were made for me to take the tractor to another dealership for repairs. By the way, the new dealership said "bull ----" to the idea of rebuilding injectors on a new tractor that is under warranty. The most promising result of the call is that the service rep. gives their name, a "file number" for reference, and instructions to call back as the repair progresses. I will reserve my judgment until after the repair is complete. ....
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| John ODonnell
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2001-02-11 24112
I have a 4600, hydro, 4wd, R4s, with a 460 loader. 60 hours. Unlike most of you guys, I am very disappointed. First I couldn't get the bucket to float. It took three repairs to get it right. Then the fuel gage got stuck. Needed replacement. Then a rim leak in the front tire that no one could find. Needed a tube. Last week my battery died. Not covered under warranty. I had a 950 for 10 years without one bit of trouble but I hurt my elbow and needed a hydrostatic. That's why I traded up for the 4600. A big mistake. The machine is well designed but poorly made. I put it in the paper on Friday . For sale $23000. As soon as it sells I'm buying a Kubota. If anyone is interested, I live outside Boston.
Jack ....
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| Ted Kennedy
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2001-02-12 24125
A very short while ago I posted several comments in response to JD's with the metal contamination problem in their transmissions. One member promptly took me to task by suggesting that I was deliberately trashing JD in favor of another mfg. I wasn't then, nor am I now. I have followed this thread and from the responses I can tell you that it seems Deere & Co. is experiencing the kinds of problems that occur from across the board manufacturing cost reduction. Not the kind of cost reduction the buyer makes out on, but the kind that results in profit for the maker from thousands of units. Every manufacturer indulges in this, some more than others, frequently within financial quarters of low profit. What to do? Keep after the manufacturer, don't take NO for an answer. If there is no arbitration system for the product then maybe class action is the solution. One thing is for sure, no manufacturer wants to hear the kinds of negative comments that have accompanied this thread. If your machine is still under warranty, demand a buy-back or replacement if they can't fix it to your satisfaction. I bought a new garden tractor for my father-in-law from another manufacturer, had problems too numerous to list, got nowhere with the dealer, got nowhere with the manufacturer, got a lawyer, got a new tractor. Total cost for lawyer, $800.00. Total cost for tractor, $4300.00. Was it worth it? Yes. Good luck. ....
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| Anthony M. Parente
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2001-02-12 24148
I have a 4700FEL/BH with over 150 hours since last fall. I have had absolutely no mechical problems. I worked this tractor hard removing brush and trees and digging drainage trenches. I am looking forward to the spring to continue clearing land. My only concern is if the 4700 is has enough power for the additional attachments, such as a dirt scraper.
Good luck in whatever you decide, but do not let problems with machines cause you to get ulcers or have a heart attack.
Tony ....
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| Phil Weathington
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2001-09-21 31937
Eric,
I bought a 4600 about a year ago and I HAVE had my share of problems. First major problem was with the fuel injection. For some reason the tractor would lose power in the c gear,,,mainly in the high gear. The tractor would almost come to complete stop even though the rpm's were plenty high enough to push the trator down the road. The dealer had the fuel injection pump rebuilt,,,it kinda of fixed the problem,,,,but it's still sluggish and does not run like it did the first day I brought it home. My second problem delt with the hyd pump that worked my loader,,,the pump blew a seal and had to be rebuilt. The third major problem deals with the front axel. The tie rods that connect the front wheels to the power sterring unit tend to break. After the second time, I notice that the design on the newer models had been re-enginerred. It seems jd deere discovered this was a problem early on. I wish I had disvoverd this before I purchased my tractor. I have also noticed that jd might be having a problems with there parts suppliers. I have already bought my share of parts and for some reason the parts I get are not the same as what came on the tractor. They work, but the look totally different! I am thinking really hard about my current situation and might just jump ship and get a kubota. Phil ....
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