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How loud is subsonic 22 ammo

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kwschumm
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2004-12-03          101535

Do you still need hearing protection with subsonic .22 ammo? I'm looking for something I can put by the door and use to shoot varmints without grabbing for my ear plugs and muffs. I've lost enough of my hearing already.

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Hettric
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2004-12-03          101540

When I was 18, I could, and did, get a 22 pistol. Me and my buddies went target shooting three times without ear protection, Each time it took longer for my ears to stop ringing, I am 50 now and still waiting for them to stop after the third time. ....

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Hettric
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2004-12-03          101541

By the way, loud noise is also painfull!!! ....

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kwschumm
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2004-12-03          101542

Yeah, when I was a teen I went into the desert to shoot my .357 magnum revolver without hearing protection. Once. Very painful and my ears didn't stop ringing for a week. I now suffer some significant mid range hearing loss and I'm fairly sure that dumb stunt is why. ....

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denwood
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2004-12-03          101544

I use CB caps made by CCI I believe and they are very quiet is a long barrel bolt action. Slightly louder than a pellet gun. In my carbine auto, they won't cycle and are a little louder and in a pistol even louder but not in the ear damaging range IMHO. ....

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kwschumm
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2004-12-03          101545

Thanks Denwood. That's what I wanted to hear. My pellet gun doesn't have quite enough pop and the .22 bolt action Remington I inherited is in another state so I couldn't try it out. ....

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DRankin
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2004-12-03          101546

Sub-sonic is different than CB caps. CB's are pretty quiet and are powered by just the primer. Sub-sonics are loaded with powder but are designed to stay under the speed of sound and therefore can, and will, produce some potential hearing damage, but certainly at a lesser level and not as quickly as full power ammo.

CB's should not be used in long barrels(over 20 inches) as they can stick in the bore. I wrecked the barrel on a pre-war Mauser sporter in just that fashion.

I'll tell you what I have sitting next to my back door. It is a Benjamin pump in .22(NOT .177)caliber. I have cleanly dispatched a bunch of varmints.... probably 150-200 or more ... with that rifle.

It is astonishingly accurate. I am talking one hole groups at 50 feet from a rest with iron sights, and unlike a spring loaded pellet shooter, it can use standard rifle scopes without damaging them. Plus it have enough power, with 8 pumps, to take down critters the size of jackrabbits.

And... I guarantee it will not hurt your ears. ....

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kwschumm
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2004-12-03          101547

My pellet rifle is CO2 powered and doesn't seem to have much power. Plus the stupid CO2 cartridge is always empty when I need it most. How does your Benjamin compare to CB caps in terms of power? I sure like the idea of not messing with pumping or CO2 cartridges but CB caps don't sound like they'd have all that much power. ....

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Archdean
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2004-12-04          101548

I recognize full well and with full acuity, I can not believe what I'm reading!!!

As a pilot with over 10,000 hours of flight time and been assigned to more Artillery units than the Patron Saint!!

Your hearing is subject to prolonged frequency damage, not from short term loud sharp noises!!

note: if you disagree most people would be deaf if they ever experienced a thunderstorm!!

Rant over: Shoot and be happy, if your really concerned !! Lower the volume on your head phones or your car radio!! ....

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djmmps
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2004-12-04          101556

Get Aquila sniper sub sonic ammo from the Cheaper than dirt web site. Y ou may also consider purchasing a suppressed gun. I use a ruger 10/22 supressed and it is totally silent. Cost around $800.00 for a real good one, less for a used one. Try Guns America.com. ....

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BrendonN
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2004-12-04          101558

Might just be my ignorance, but I shoot quite a few 22LR's without protection. Only in a rifle, though. The same rounds that are fairly quiet in a rifle are pretty noisy in a handgun. And I always use plugs when practicing with larger stuff like my 222 Rem or shotguns. In the field hunting, though, we all shoot even the big stuff un-muffled and, especially bird hunting, may fire numerous times in one morning.
My personal feeling would be that especially with sub-sonic or CB ammo in a rifle, protection would not be required for the occasional varmint shot. I have used both in rifles with good success. Keep the Aguila Colibri rounds out of the rifle, though. They are VERY quite (hammer snap is a lot louder than the actual detonation) but can easily lodge in the barrel. ....

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Billy
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2004-12-04          101560

I agree with you Arch. Full powered ammo in a 22 "rifle" would be a non issue. ....

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greg_g
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2004-12-04          101562

The word subsonic when applied to ammo has almost nothing to do with how much noise it makes at the firearm end. It is relative to how fast the projectile travels on the way to the TARGET end. In the case of subsonic ammo, it travels slower than the speed of sound (~1100 fps) meaning that the SOUND of the gun going off gets to the target BEFORE the projectile.

Long guns, hand guns, old guns, shotguns, don't matter. The more often firearms go BANG around unprotected ears, the closer the shooter is to a pair of hearing aids (or injecting the word "huh?" into a lot of conversations). Been shooting for nearly 50 years, and wearing hearing aids for the last 20.

//greg// ....

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kwschumm
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2004-12-04          101570

Archdean, my audiologist disagrees with you. So does the National Institute of Health. It's called Acoustic Trauma. I've lost some hearing, diagnosed as nerve damage caused by Acoustic Trauma, and it is not any fun. I now wear hearing protection for almost every noisy activity - chainsaw, circular saw, hammering, shop vac, etc. Might as well try to preserve what hearing I have left. ....


Link:   Acoustic Trauma

 
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Chief
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2004-12-04          101571

Ken, the subsonic ammo is of little use to you with respect to reduction of noise as the shooter. Subsonic ammo does not emit the signature charactistic "crack" (which is the bullet breaking the sound barrier with normal ammo) and creates less noise for those who live around you. The sonic "crack" noise carries a long ways. Other uses for subsonic ammo is when employing sound suppresson devices such as a barrel muffler or "silencer" in military and other sanctioned use. The CB caps are effective as long as you are VERY close to the animal being shot. Not always possible.

What I keep handy for pests and varmints is a Sheridan 5mm Blue Streak pump air rifle ($100 - $165). These also come in 22 cal. as well. These rifles are VERY accurate and can push a pellet to about 700 fps, which is about near the performance of a 22 short. It is powerful enough to put a lead pellet through both sides of a 5 gallon pail. Very effective out to about 30 yards.

If you want to spend the big bucks and go for 1100 fps plus; I use a Weihrauch HW90 with a 4x scope mounted on it $500 - $600). Be advised that even though this is a pellet rifle, it is every bit as leathal as a 22. I have shot through both sides of 2 5 gallon pails lined up together with this pellet rifle. VERY effective out to 50 yards and maybe a bit more with a scope and heavy pellets.

I would recommend the Sheridan air rifle. Mine is over 25 years old and still working. I use it to coax stray wild dogs to find other living accomdations. I can nail them at 30 - 40 yards and not kill or hurt them seriously but seriously get there attention. It also allows you the option of not pumping up the gun to full power so as to sting and not penetrate if need be. I would hate to hurts someones pet. For other pests and varmints; pumped up to full power it works great. ....

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Archdean
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2004-12-04          101573

I answered your original question in regards to what you asked!!"
Do you still need hearing protection with subsonic .22 ammo? I'm looking for something I can put by the door and use to shoot varmints without grabbing for my ear plugs and muffs. I've lost enough of my hearing already."

The great thing about this country is everyone can disagree at any time for any reason!

"Causes, incidence, and risk factors Return to top

Acoustic trauma is a common cause of sensory hearing loss. Damage to the hearing mechanisms within the inner ear may result from an explosion near the ear, gunshots, or long exposure to loud noises (such as loud music or loud machinery).
Symptoms Return to top

hearing loss
usually partial and involving high-pitched sounds
may be slowly progressive
noises, ringing in the ear (tinnitus)

The real culprit as your own reference shows is Prolonged exposure!! How many varmints are you contemplating shooting out your back door with a sub sonic .22 cal rifle??? And will this be continuous non stop activity ??
....

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kwschumm
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2004-12-04          101576

Archdean, I appreciate your thoughts, but I'm not sure how you read the NIH link and concluded that only prolonged exposure to noise leads to hearing loss since "gunshots" and "long exposure to loud noises" are comma separated and listed as separate causes. The audiologist told me that a single loud noise event could damage sensory hairs in the inner ear and lead to hearing loss years later. No offense, but I believe her. ....

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kwschumm
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2004-12-04          101579

I had no idea that pellet guns had become so sophisticated. The ones I've used have all been fairly cheap. There's a website that sells about 20 different brands and some of them look really, really nice. My plan is to try different types of rounds ammo in my .22 rifle (when I can get it shipped here) and measure the noise with a sound level meter. If none of them are quiet enough I'll spring for a nice .22 pellet rifle. ....

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Archdean
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2004-12-04          101592

No offense taken Ken!!

You pay her!! I only responded to your .22 Question and I stand by my statement!! Personally I see no harm from hearing a retort from behind a .22 cal rifle!!

I'm fairly certain you will receive more harming frequencies (decibels)talking on your cell phone!! ....

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Billy
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2004-12-04          101593

All I can say is, if you're worried about a 22 rifle causing hearing damage, I'd sure stay away from clapping hands. ....

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oneace
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2004-12-04          101599

I will shoot 50 to 60 rounds of full power .22 ammo from my rifle all the time with out hearing protection. My 1/2" air impact gun is louder. (Manufacturer says 97, free spinning to 105 decibels, hammering.) ....

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kwschumm
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2004-12-04          101602

I haven't fired a .22 for probably 30 years so I don't remember how loud they are. I mostly just do target shooting around here and shoot either .40, 9mm, or .357 pistols, .30 or .223 rifles or shotguns. Those are all pretty LOUD. So, you guys are probably right about .22 rifles noise being fairly quiet, I just don't remember and ASSumed they were loud based on current experience with other guns. ....

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Chief
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2004-12-05          101604

Ken,

You ASSummed VERY correctly. Before the Doc found a little something, I used to fire about 4,000 round of 12,20,28gauge, and 410 bore every year. I ALWAYS used hearing protection. I can tell you first hand that being exposed to even one shot of high powered ammo can cause severe hearing damage.

While zeroing my Sako Finn Bear 375 H&H, I mistakenly removed my hearing protection while the firer in the adjacent lane was firing his 460 Weatherby. I thought the all clear had been given....... NEVER again. My ears rang for days and my head hurt for several hours (a good bit of which was from the 20 rounds I fired in practice).

A 22 is more than likely not going to cause much if any hearing loss but it sure does not help the cause. The pellet rifle is the best course of action and if a 22 is required; fire a bolt action as a semi auto it much louder. ....

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Archdean
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2004-12-05          101606

Is this a 2nd Hand name change? Chief! ....

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Chief
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2004-12-05          101607

Perhaps you should check with Clem K????? ....

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hardwood
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2004-12-05          101612

I really haven't hunted game since I was a kid, used to hunt pheasants and rabbits. All I really ever shot was a 20 ga. and a common 22 rifle, so I'm a long ways out of touch with modern hunting. We have several different deer hunting seasons here now, bow, black powder, teen shotgun, adult shotgun, etc. I think the adult shotgun opened yesterday. I think they shoot rifled slugs, but whatever they are they must be quite loud at close range, you can hear them for a couple miles. Happy hunting. Frank. ....

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DRankin
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2004-12-05          101618

My brother can almost drink straight tabasco sauce right from the bottle. He says it isn't as hot as it used to be.

Well they didn't change the recipe.... he burned out his taste buds using gallons of the stuff on his food.

So when I hear someone say they have shot xx billion rounds of .22 LR and they aren't loud and won't damage hearing..... I mentally add "not anymore!" to the end of that sentence. ....

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DRankin
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2004-12-05          101619

Ken... Randy mentioned a Sheridan air rifle. It is the same product as the Benjamin I mentioned.

As far as sophistication, in europe they have had air rifles capable of taking deer at close ranges for a couple hundred years.

If you have the money, you can find air rifles that are charged from a scuba tank and will do anything a 22 LR will do and more.

....


Link:   

Click Here


 
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Billy
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2004-12-06          101686

Mark, the point is there's things a person does everyday that creates more noise than a 22 rifle. If someone is worried about opening the door and taking an occasional shot at a varmint with a 22 rifle, he should also worry about hammering nails, running a skill saw, being around an applauding audience, loud trucks driving down the road.... ....

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kwschumm
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2004-12-06          101695

I'll pass on the scuba tank setup, but I'll have to check out a modern pump air rifle. My Sheridan .177 CO2 rifle is fairly accurate but I've found CO2 cartridges to be a pain. ....

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DRankin
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2004-12-06          101700

I hear you Billy..... I think.

I try to wear ear protection when I do a lot of the things you mentioned. I find I don't get as tired running the tractor or the RTV if I remember my ear muffs.

After flying small airplanes, taking the most powerful antibiotics known to man and being exposed to about a million rounds of handgun fire, I have lost all the hearing I intend to lose.

Truth is, I suppose I would keep a rifle loaded with sub-sonics by the back door instead of the pellet gun if I thought the neighbors wouldn't complain. ....

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kubotaguy
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2004-12-06          101703

I keep an old 18 shot Marlin 22 semiautomatic by the backdoor to eliminate groundhogs from digging in the yard. I bought some cheap hollow point bullets from Wal-Mart to use. I slide open the sliding glass door and put the barrel out the door and shoot. Even inside the house the noise isn't really that loud as compared to shooting my little 22 Beretta pistol outside. I should use hearing protection, but for the occaissional shot I pass. Just be careful if the shell kicks out on the Mrs. curio cabinet as she will become very upset and be a lot worse than the varmit. I guess you know how I know this. ....

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shortmagnum
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2004-12-06          101721

I'm gone a few days and miss a great discussion. :-(

After getting a hearing test during a physical at the Mayo clinic my left ear heard only about half as high on the frequency scale as the right ear. The first thing the doc asked me was "Do you shoot guns alot?"

I have a friend who operates heavy equipment for a living and he actually thinks his hearing cannot get worse than it is so why bother with hearing protection. The main thing to remember is that no matter how bad your hearing is, a continued high decibel environment will make it worse.
Dave ....

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hitracdozer
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2004-12-07          101749

dang you have got to be a genius ....

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DRankin
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2004-12-07          101751

That's your first post in our forum?

Maybe you can edit this and add something constructive or uplifting.

....

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shortmagnum
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2004-12-07          101755

Hdozer,

Gee whiz, no one’s ever called me a genius before. I’m really humbled that you used your first and only post to tell me that. Did you join TP just for that reason?
....

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