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Misenplace
Join Date: Jul 2003
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2003-06-06          56755

The Question was "would you like to talk Big Bore Lever guns ?" My answer is I like to talk Lever guns day or night, big bore small bore any brand is ok with me as long as I can hear that ca chink of the lever and a cartridge. I love that connection to the old west and history. The combination of a lever gun and a old straight wall cartridge for me is about as good as it gets. I personally prefer Origional Winchesters (pre-64) but I like all and have owned Marlins as well. I partcilarly Like that new 9417 and the 9410 both which I think are going to be big hits. Then there the big bores. The Tim Taylor in me comes out every time I see or shoot one. Lets hear your favorites, good stories or any thing at all about them lever actions.

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Billy
Join Date: Oct 1999
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2003-06-06          56756

I only have two lever guns. Both old Winchesters in 30/30. The newer of the two, made in 47, looks brand new. I bought it for 100 bucks about 6 years ago. I like the semi buckhorn sights. Easy on the eyes. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56758

You got a bargain there !! The model '94 in pre-64 is the last of the great buys on origional Winchesters. A standard model '94 in 95 plus % condition is now selling at a $500 median for all dates from the mid 1920's to '64. Excepting some like the flat barrel band versions of WW2 and other rare variations. I picked one up at a show in 32 WCF a few years back from a fellow that must have been at least 75. It belonged to his wife who had passed away several years before. He told me they bought a pair new in '54. I doubt it has ever fired a full box of shells. Even pre 1899 variations that have special order features or SRC versions can still be had under 3k. Still a lot of coins but one of the few bargains left for collectors. ....

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plots1
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2003-06-06          56761

I have BLR in 308 and one in 358 great quick handlers.now I use a bar 270 to keep those deer in check. ....

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plots1
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2003-06-06          56762

I also like to use my ENCORE 50 cal smoke pole by thompson.It will work on them well at 150 yards. ....

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ruger454
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2003-06-06          56763

You did say any brand big or small. I have two Ruger model ninety six's (1) in 22mag. and (1) 17hmr I love both guns. I never really had any desire for a lever, but I have to say they are super fun to shoot and there is something special about the "ca chink" that you just can't explain.
Mark ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56764

Hey you learn something new every day. I didnt know ruger was makeing little lever guns. I have been a ruger fan since I got that first 10/22 over 30 years ago. I am really wanting a Winchester '94 in 17 HMR. Plots, does that Thompson come with a lever or was that you just wipeing the smoke out of your eyes ?? lol. Just kidding those are great fun and VERY reliable. I have never shot a .358 Is that BLR a newer one ? Sounds like a serious brush buster. It was introduced as a cartridge in 1955 by Winchester for the model 70. It is basicly a 308 necked up so I am suprised it never got more play. Browning is currently the only one still chambering a rifle in this caliber. Sounds Like serious Moose medicine. ....

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plots1
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2003-06-06          56766

It packs a walop, almost to much on whitetale. I just mentioned the old smoker because it's one of my favored weapons to get after the deer with.It also has a great deal on punch useing 250 gr XTP's.If I'm not mistaken browning makes the only lever gun that will acept a belted mag.I would like to get one in 7 mag but the price is way up there.they are proud of the rotory bolt. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56769

Plots, If you think that .358 is too much then avoid that belted mag. Besides now the new Winchester short mags are availalable and ballisticly superior and more accurate. I get away with the 270 Weatherby because I down load. That 358 should do any job just fine. Maybe you should give hand loadind a try. Down load a bit. Besides it can be a lot of fun and you wind up shooting more often to test your loads. ....

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plots1
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2003-06-06          56770

the 358 blr is a older model and the the 308 is newer.they are both great, It's like handling a daisy red rider untill you touch one off..... ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56771

Sounds Like Fun too me ! ....

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plots1
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2003-06-06          56772

just like to get 7 mag now to work on them across my back pasture. it's a quater mile long. ....

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plots1
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2003-06-06          56777

I know this is a lever gun post but guns to me means HUNTING. and I favor the OLD HOYT more then guns for that.and NO all guns will out do my skills.but when booney is creeping along i would like to get a chance at him as long as his not too far off. I always see one during bow time but he's out across the pasture a way's , with some pratice I figure I'd take a crack at it out at 300 yds. though. they neibor shot a ten that scored 142 last year that came off my back pasture on to his at 310 yards with a 7 mag . made me want to get one and practice more.I couldn't believe it was that far till i used my range finder and found out. I watched the whole thing from across the pasture. ....

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plots1
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2003-06-06          56780

Maybe one of those blind's you been looking for would enable me to set up closer than another cal. would be fine. pasture land with limited cover is some times tough to work. well i'm going to let this post go back to lever guns I just get side tracked easy when starting to talk HUNTING. sorry. ....

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AC5ZO
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2003-06-06          56786

I have a Win 94 in 30-30. It is in somewhat rough shape on the outside because of treatment by the previous owner, but I got it for a song and don't mind throwing it in the truck when I need it. It shoots fine.

I also have a Marlin in .357 Magnum that I really like. I would have bought another lever gun in .44 Mag, but I came across one of the old .44 Mag Ruger Carbines and picked that up instead.

Ruger came out with another .44M rifle a couple of years ago, but it was lever instead of auto like the old Carbine. The old carbine also had a tubular magazine and the mechanism looked somewhat like a shotgun action. The carbine is also real particular about what ammo it will use. I have to use high pressure rounds or the action will not cycle. The newer lever guns from them use the rotary magazine like the 10-22, but I believe that the .44M gun holds four rounds. Of course, you don't have to worry about the load with the lever gun like the auto.

When I am out with these guns, I carry a pistol of the same caliber. When using the .44M rifle I carry a 629 SW with a 4" bbl for example. ....

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DRankin
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2003-06-06          56791

BBLG's? Why yes I do have some. Marlins: 357 Magnum, 35 Remington, 356 Winchester, 375 Winchester, Several 444's in different rifling styles, a 44 Magnum and a 45-70. And maybe one or two that I forgot.

Do Ruger #1's count? It has a lever you know. That is a "do it all" gun in 416 Rigby. Another pretty cool big bore but not a lever gun: A Remington 7600 pump in 35 Whelen. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56800

BBLG's You betcha ! Now I sure would like to send a few rounds throught that 416 just for fun.. Have a lot of elephants doing crop damage ? Ruger #1's ALWAYS count ! I sure have seen some beautys customized in this gun over the years. I have never owned one but I hear they are a bit tempermental about what they eat. I also hear once you get the recipe right they are tack drivers. Now that 375 is one appealing caliber. kind a like a 375 H&H in a lever gun. My dad used to hunt with one of those ruger carbines in 44 mag. Talk about a brush cutting machine. His only complaint was that he had a hard time finding cartridges thar were solids. Every one should have at least one beater to throw in the truck. The fine patina of abuse, fits like an old pair of boots and is just as dependable. ....

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AC5ZO
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2003-06-06          56801

Years ago a gun dealer offered me a "free" Ruger #1 if I would buy 100 rounds of 416 Rigby for full price. I don't remember the price, but I did not go for it.

I guess that I figured that the recoil would be like nothing else I had ever shot, and I could not think of a case where I would use a gun like that. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56803

Mark came from Alaska. I'd bet he had some use for it there. I sure don't want to buy one, I just want to take a few pokes with his ! lol. That's all I can handle ! Do you shoot that 375 lever mark or is a collector ? ....

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AC5ZO
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2003-06-06          56804

When growing up on the farm the guns were just another tool like a shovel. All of the guns that my dad owned showed the patina of high use. When he died, I inherited all of them, but I have not even considered restoring them. I don't shoot them, but they carry many fond memories of some of the first hunting that I ever did.

The lever 30-30 was not one of those guns, but it has become one of my "ranch" guns. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56807

I personally would never restore them. I can not begin to tell you how many antique Winchester that people have asked me to look at that were absolutely destroyed by poor restorations. There are only one or two people who do this and friend you better get ready to write one fat check if you are going to have them do it. You still wind up with a gun that is worth less than what you paid and worthless to collectors. What did dad have ? One of my all time favorites is a 32-20 model '92 SRC. You can just pop pop pop all day long. I really do want to get my hands on a nice '94 SRC in 38-55..Any one have one ? ....

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
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2003-06-06          56810

Been collecting for over 20 years and the one lever gun I have not gotten that I think would be a great addition would be the Model 1895SS in 45-70 Government. Would make a great Truck n' Tractor gun. ....

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AC5ZO
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2003-06-06          56811

Doc, I agree with you. One of the guns is a Browning Sweet 16, but I largely shoot 12 and 20. Another is a Remington 120 or 121 pump 22 and the other is a WWII Mauser with non-matching serial numbers.

I have the hunting shotgun situation covered. I have several Mauser 98s and I decided that I did like the Remington 22, so a few years ago, I bought one that was in mint condition and I use it. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56816

The first deer rifle dad gave me was a 8mm Mauser. 1944. with all the correct period markings. It was a cavalary model with a bent bolt. One year a friend and I decided that we would pack in a few days before the season opened and set up camp. I decided to remove the bolt and put it in my pocket due to carrying a rifle in the woods two days before season. Can you spell S-T-U-P-I-D ? lol Never did find it. I am starting to think we need to have a rompin stompin tractor round up and BBQ. All firearms welcome. Prizes to the best decorated tractor. I was thinking bull horns on the hood and a leather scabbord for the Winchester. I had one of those marlin 45-70 Guide guns with a 18" ported barrel. It was a beast but a real hoot to watch the flames come out of the end of that thing. ....

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AC5ZO
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2003-06-06          56821

Does anybody have any of the Browning Lever guns? ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56831

Plots has a couple. ....

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AC5ZO
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2003-06-06          56833

I missed that from before. It is kind of funny that the most active thread on the Board is this one. It is getting to where it takes a while to load on the computer.

Plots, do you like the Browning's? I have never had one. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56836

Ya I Gave up on the 357 maximum because it was takeing forever to load. I saw another 7-30 waters on GA today. ....

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Billy
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2003-06-06          56847

Doc, you're right about restoring a gun. It takes about half of the collector's value from it, even if done expertly. The reason I had the 357 Maximun redone was it'll never be for sale, not as long as I'm still breathing anyway. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56855

Billy, I was really referring to those lever guns which would be considered collectable although modern arms certainly fall into that catagory as well. The only real way to justify the cost either way is to have one that has more intrinsic or sentimental value than the real value of the gun. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-06          56977

Hey Mark, I'm still waiting to hear if you shout that 375 winchester or if its just in the collection. It seems like a heck of a cartridge. ....

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cutter
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2003-06-06          56980

A rifle thread! Now I am going to have to send you information on my old Winchesters to get an idea what I actually have Doc. One octagon barrel, one round, I'll get back with the details when I have more time. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-07          57005

Sounds good, I'd be happy to take a look. Intersetingly enough on the antiques the round barrels were the special oreders and the Octagons were standard. Then theres the 1/2 octagon 1/2 round. The first light weight barrel ! ....

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DRankin
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2003-06-07          57038

The 375 Winchester is a fine and under-appreciated cartridge.

If it loaded to anywhere near its potential it will launch a 220 grain bullet as fast or faster than a 30-06

This is serious short to mid-range power. It is SAAMI rated at 50,000 CUP. One of the reasons it can go there is the specially drawn brass.

The 375 Win., like its granddaddy the 38-55, uses a straight walled 30-30 case. Actually I guess the 30-30 is a necked down 38-55 case.

Anyway, the 375 brass is much, much stronger than run of the mill 30-30 brass and has some interesting potential for "plus P" loads in 30-30 Ackley Improved chamberings and similar loadings in the 7-30 Waters.

I have done some limited experimentation in this area with my Ackley Improved cartridges and I discovered rather quickly that the brass is so much thicker that once it is necked down it needs its neck thinned to operate safely in standard 30-30 chambers. I suspect that would be true of 7-30 chambers too.

Anyway, my Marlin 375 was used when I bought it. I have run some practice rounds through it. Someday when life gets easier, I hope to hunt with it.

Two bullets of note for lever guns and handloaders are a 220 grain flat point which is, I think, made by Hornady especially for this caliber, and a 255 soft point made by Barnes. Either one should slap the dog turds out of a moderate to large sized bear at closer ranges and be more than adequate or deer, antelope and critters of that ilk, or in this case, elk.

For Contenders in this chambering there are published loads using 235 grain bullets designed for the 375 H&H.
....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-07          57046

Sounds like fun to me. Probably seems a bit tame to a 444 Marlin fan. Speaking of Ackley Inproved cartridges the one I have always wanted was a 218 ackley improved. I am still curious to hear about that 416 !
....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-08          57088

mark, I noticed this morning takeing a quick peek at the Winchester web site that they are makeing a '94 chambered in the .480 ruger. I thiught that would be of interest to you being a wheel gun fan as well. I know what I have read about this one but nothing more. You think it will gain any yardage ove the 44 mag out of a 20" tube ? I have to admit to still being very drawn to the 454 Casull in a lever gun. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-15          57670

If Any one knows where theres a Winchester model "94 in 480 Ruger for sale please let me know. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-25          58259

Cutter; I havent heard back from you on those lever guns and I was just wondering if you had received My reply a few weeks back to your e-mail. I am planning on picking up a new Winchester trapper in 44 mag next wednsday. It should be fun with and with a 16" barrel a perfect little brush gun. ....

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DRankin
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2003-06-25          58264

I am thinking the 454 might be a lot pressure in a rear locking action.

It essentially runs in the same power class as a 45-70 but some of those factory loads are 60,000 psi or more, where the 45-70 runs at half that by virtue of it bigger boiler room.

You gain a little weight savings in the rifle, at least in the Taurus, due to the shorter action, but lighter weight is not necessarily a good thing when you combine those muzzle energy figures with a 6 pound carbine.

The 480 Ruger is also sort of re-inventing the 1873 'wheel'. It offers 1.5 caliber more than a 45-70 which isn't really significant, but its chamber pressures are probably more suited to a lever action.

I guess the attraction, other than the 'cool' factor, will be the traditional American virtue on "two guns, one cartridge". The only fly in that ointment is the frame size of the handguns for the 480 are a bit on the big side for daily packing. A 5 shot Super Blackhawk with a 5 1/2 inch barrel would change all that.



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Misenplace
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2003-06-25          58274

I have to admit to initially being drawn to the .480 ruger by the cool factor. After doing a little research ammo is limited, expensive and ballisticly there is such a nominal improvement over the 44 mag that I decided to pick up the 44 instead. especially if over the counter hot loads are desired they are available from Buffalo Bore as well as Cor bon although both are expensive as well. I did see a Casull in the Puma lever gun which I think is a '92 clone. I've never seen one close up. I am not mutch of a Taurus fan after two defective wheel guns, both 38's. No doubt the recoil on the Casull would be stiff but most big bores are. I really dont think of the 44 mag as a big bore but Winchester is labeling the .480 as such. I also like the 444 marlin ballisticly BUT I sure dont care for the beating, lol. I think I would have to send one of those out to have the answer system installed. ....

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AC5ZO
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2003-06-25          58288

This is one of my favorite threads on the CTB, but it sure is taking a long time to load. I am going to try starting a new thread Big Bore II. We can continue this great topic there. How about it?? ....

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cutter
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2003-06-27          58455

Sorry Doc,

I was out of town on business, just returned tonight. I have a graduation party Saturday and am trying to catch up on the yardwork. I will send it along end of weekend if time permits. Sounds like you have a new toy and the time to use it!

Thanks again for your help.

....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-28          58464

OK Pard, I just wanted to make sure you got my email. AOL occasionaly does stuff like auto delete my address book and saved emails. No hurrys at all. Sounds like you got a lot on your plate at the moment. ....

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cutter
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2003-06-28          58467

I'm grateful for the help Doc. I have Monday off, so worst case I can do it then. I was traveling with an avid sportsman last week, we had some good stories to share to pass the miles away. He hunts with a bow as well, got eight deer during the one day thinning held by a nearby town a couple of years ago. It is performed under a nuisance permit granted by the state due to the destruction caused by these animals in that area. All the meat goes to a venison program to feed the poor and elderly. He said he would not do it again, felt guilty as it was like shooting ducks in a barrel. I have been in that area numerous times, the residents have to put fences around every plant they don't want destroyed. There are 200+ car-deer accidents a year in the area so it is one of those things that creates a ton of controversy between the animal rights groups and the people that live there. ....

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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2003-06-28          58474

We need to get those people sidetracked somewhere. At least the animals we eat are already dead. We take living, breathing vegetables and eat them alive.

You can't imagine the terror a carrot or a kumquat feels when they see those teeth coming at them, or the pain of having their living flesh dismembered while their life's blood (you know, fruit juice) gushes forth.

It is too horrible to contemplate.

I think I'll have breakfast. I hope we are not out of encapsulated embryonic chickens (eggs) and pre-masticated, seasoned, porcine flesh (Jimmy Dean sausage) (MMMMM). ....

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Misenplace
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 875 Michigan
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2003-06-28          58477

I am on way to Marks house for breakfast. If I time it right I might get to AC's place just in time for some smoked meat, lol. Cutter, You might well be talking about the metro park right my house adjoins. No joke. We were in the NRA mags and had a lot of articles published about the deer population problem. Sadly all good intentions can go astray when you get politics involved. We had the anti-wildlife folks picketing, which was good for a laugh. It started out as archery only. The problem was no one was really shooting the dog gone does because we had so many enourmous bucks. I literally saw the biggest Buck ever less than 100 yards from my sub. Easily 180+ B/C. So the next year the powers that be decided to include shotguns. IMHOP not the brightest idea in a park. Especially when they didn't bother to notify all of the surrounding homes about the hunt. oops. It finally has been thinned down now we are only about 100% overpopulated for the acerage. It honestly has made a big difference but it is not unusual on the NE corner of the park to see 40 deer out at a time. The deer eating from my bird feeders in my photos are Park deer. I can certainly understand your buddys perspective. As much as I love to hunt I find it a very anti-climatic activeity. If thoose steaks weren't so darn good I proboably would not waste the time. All of the meat here went to food prograns for the needy. ....

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