3 point vs. frame mount: Back Hoe  -- Tractor Attachments Implements 3ph Discussion Forum and Review 3 point vs. frame mount: Back Hoe -- Tractor Attachments Implements 3ph Discussion Forum

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 05-14-2001, 00:56 Post: 28134
J. B. Hopewell



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 3 point vs. frame mount

I am in the market for a backhoe for my JD 955 and have looked at both the JD #7 hoe (frame mount) and the bush hog 3 (3 point mount). 3 point units are considerably less expensive than frame mount, but are they worth it in the long run, or would I be better off spending the extra money for the frame mount?






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 05-14-2001, 07:58 Post: 28143
TomG

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 3 point vs. frame mount

The archives should turn up probably more than you'd want to read on the subject. If you check the archives and questions remain, I'm sure a post will get you some good responses. Myself, I'm of the convenient, cheap, occasional and fairly easy use 3ph-mount flavour. I'm also aware of the tractor frame stress issues that are especially pertinent to 3ph hoes. My hoe is somewhat undersized for the tractor, and I use it in moderation. If I was going to spend my life on a tractor mounted hoe or do repeated heavy-duty tasks, I'd probably get a sub-frame mount, but then I might just get a dedicated hoe/loader instead. Actually, I'm not sure I have the alternative of a sub-frame mount for my mid-80's Ford. Sub-frame mounts are fairly specific to a tractor, and the newer fancy mounts may not be available for my 1710. Many of the older sub-frame mounts are a pain and really do compromise other uses of the tractor. As it stands, the 3ph hoe does most of my work. There's also a neighbour with a sizable Case loader/hoe, and there's always the pro with the tracked hi-hoe. Having said that, I do have to remind myself to check the torque on my tractor's case bolts before I mount my 3ph hoe this year.






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 05-14-2001, 09:12 Post: 28149
Norm



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 3 point vs. frame mount

I have a #7 on a 755 and it can bounce the tractor around pretty well. The 955 is bigger, but not that much. I would be concerned about the stress.






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 05-14-2001, 17:04 Post: 28170
Paul Fox



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 3 point vs. frame mount

I have a Woods 650 three-point on my JD 750. I use it HARD! Hard enough to have cracked a couple of weldments over the last 8 years or so. I get into rocky soil, ledge outcroppings, pin gravel, you name it. I'd like to have a buck back for every tooth I've worn out and replaced on that thing. I have never seen any indication of undue stress anywhere on the tractor. Not saying it's not an issue, just haven't seen it on my application. I need the flexibility of being able to change implements in a couple of minutes, and I've been very happy with my three-point, and I'd buy another in a second...






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 05-14-2001, 20:51 Post: 28176
Roger L.



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 3 point vs. frame mount

I'm wondering if the guys that get good results with the 3pt hoes also have some sort of attachment to keep the 3pt arms stable. Paul, you sound like you use yours a lot. Does yours have some sort of 3pt arm locking fixture or does it just flop around?






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 05-15-2001, 00:33 Post: 28183
J. B. Hopewell



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 3 point vs. frame mount

Thank you to those answering on the 3 pt vs frame mount question. I really appreciate the input and the time it takes to answer these posts. My application is strictly personal and occasional and all my research seems to be leading to the 3 point units.






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 05-15-2001, 05:11 Post: 28185
TomG

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 3 point vs. frame mount

I remember a comment from somewhere about reinforcing brackets that are available for some model Kubotas. The comment was in the context of warranties. The person said that Kubota wouldn't cover damage due to backhoe use (their hoe and a sub-frame mount I guess) unless the brackets were installed. I don't know thing more than the comment that was from a person who claimed to have the brackets installed. The availability of such brackets might be of some value, but I am pretty much in Paul's camp. A hoe that is the right sized for the tractor and used properly shouldn't require the frame to be reengineered. I suspect that many of the stories about damage are cases of abuse or unskilled operation, although I do avoid jobs that are really beyond a compact tractor. I regularly check the mount adjustments, and will occasionally check the case-bolt torques. However, that being said, the reality is that machinery just can't be used without the risk of breaking something. It not exactly uncommon to hear stories about loader frames broken by lifting from one side of the bucket or from loose mounting bolts either. Maintenance budgets should be planned that anticipate repairing breakage, or the tractor just ends up sitting in a shed. Maintenance budgets also should planned assuming good maintenance and skilled operation, which will do a lot to keep the repair costs down.






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 05-15-2001, 05:23 Post: 28186
Paul Fox



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 3 point vs. frame mount

Hi Roger. I made my living with my tractor for a couple of years, and a lot of that was backhoe work, so yes, she's got a lot of hours on her. As to the stabilizers, the answer is "sort of". The upper mount on the 'hoe is triangulated to the lower mounts. This limits the side-to-side motion to a couple of inches at most, and then only when transporting. With the rig properly set up for digging (stabilizer pads down far enough to lift the rear wheels of the tractor off the ground, FEL bucket rolled fully forward and loader down far enough to lift the front wheels off the ground) there is no noticable movement of the lower arms. The upper mounting point moves within the limits of slop in the pin/mounting hole which creates a certain amount of jerking, particularly in tough digging conditions. The most abuse of the mounting happens when digging in bad enough conditions that the 'hoe will drag the tractor, bucket and all, across the ground, or pick it up off the stabilizers while biting, and drop it when the boom is lifted. Generally, I take this as a hint and take smaller bites. Occasionally, I just bull my way through. In one extreme instance, I had to chain the front of the tractor to a Michigan loader to keep from skidding the unit across the worksite with every bite. I should have passed on that job, but they were desperate, and paying VERY well...






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 05-18-2001, 22:08 Post: 28349
Mark



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 3 point vs. frame mount

Before you pay to much for a frame mount or chance hurting your tractor with out one, consider the Bush Hog brand back hoe.
Most people don't know that Bush Hog Hoes have sub frame mounts available. (My dealer didn't even know). The nice thing is it is simple and easer to attach and unhook than the quick attach loader, NH7308.
I wasn't sure what I was buying when I ordered it because BH didn't have any literature on it. But as it turns out the back hoe and sub frame go on and off as one piece with only 2 pins in the front. there is no lifting or hands on at all the whole thing loads it self using the hydraulics in less than one minute.
anyone using a 3pt. hoe could build one like this for less than $100.00 and eliminate the chance of damage to there tractor. Any one that would like a picture just give me an e-mail. I would be glad to help.






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 05-23-2001, 11:05 Post: 28488
J. B. Hopewell



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 3 point vs. frame mount

Well, I'm still doing my homework on this 3 pt. vs. frame mount backhoe subject. Mark, the info you supplied is invaluable. On the JD setup a "power beyond kit" has to be installed if you want to be able to operate the bucket along with the backhoe. Is there a PBK on your setup??

Also, I thought that about a week ago, someone posted that they sold Woods hoes but now I can't find that post. If that came through as a private post, would you please post again. I think the price was $3800 plus shipping.

We looked at the full frame mount on the JD and it is way beyond what we need. The entire 3 point assembly has to be removed from the tractor for the hoe to be installed. Mark's setup allows the 3 point hardware to remain on the tractor, so now I'm actively looking for a hoe that can be installed using Mark's sub-frame mount system.

Thanks again to all who are part of this discussion.






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Discussion Boards > Active Subjects > Messages as Posted > Back Hoe Forum

Thread 28134 Filter by Poster:
Doug L 1 | J. B. Hopewell 4 | jb85302 1 | lsheaffer 2 | Mark 4 | Mark G. 1 | Norm 1 | Paul Fox 2 | Rich Luhr 1 | Roger L. 3 | TomG 4 |




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