Go Bottom1 5 Ac of Grass Leaves and Snow and a decision
 | marcnh
Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 1 NH 
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2003-11-10 68434
My 25yr old 16HP Snapper (Massey) LT1650 + EZ-Rake 70 vac/70 cu ft trlr are functional but I'm spending more time fixing them than using them. (also can't find parts for EZ-Rake) Time to move on...
I've been impressed by the collective experience here and
I'd like some advice.
Specs: 1.5 Acre lawn in NH, big driveway, lots of deciduous trees. A spring mowing (esp.if I've missed a week) is 4-5 cu yds of clippings. fall leaves with a backpack blower & vac is 30 cu yds of chipped clippings (~10 trailer loads)
Mower: 48 - 62" OK,
SnowBlower: Biggest possible 47", 2 stg is nice, chains needed in NH even with 4WD, lots of ice
Vac: Thinking Trac-Vac 1080 or perhaps Agrimetal (if they have a version that attaches to discharge chute)
Tractor: JD X585 or JD 2210 or Kubota BX2200
HST fwd/rev & 4WD.
585 seems to have a vy tight turning radius, though. 4WS?
Any comments would be appreciated...
Marc
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 | Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York 
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2003-11-10 68436
BX definitly all that is needed here with a 60" deck. I still would question the chains unless you have a dirt driveway. Same size as 585 and all the features of the 2210. And splurge as the BX comes with a 50" blower on the front. The Trac-vac 1080 is an awesome outfit for clean-up. That is a Tim the tool timeyard keeper outfit if I ever saw one!!!! Ho HO HO!!!! ....
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| melensdad
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 90 Northwest Indiana, near Lowell and 8 miles from Beecher, Illinois
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2003-11-11 68464
Take a serious look at the new Massey CG2300. Also consider something like a large Cub Cadet garden tractor. I used a Cub with a 54" mower and a 48" snowblower to maintain 4 acres. I now have 12 acres and still use the Cub for many chores, I also have a NH TC24D and a Kubota B2910 but the Cub is the most used! ....
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 | psimonson
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 57 Northeastern Tennessee
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2003-11-11 68466
I bought a 2210 back in May with FEL and 62C deck. Your situation sounds familiar because I looked at the Deere 585 and 2210 as well as the Kubota BX and Massey GC2300. One of the things that steered me toward the Deere line is that I’m 6’-3” and I found the side-by-side pedals on the Deere much more comfortable than the rocker-type pedal used on the Kubota and Massey. Within the Deere line, I felt the 2210 with rear 3-point and PTO standard seemed like a better deal than the 585.
So far I’m very happy with the mowing capabilities; I mow about 1.7 acres of lawn in low range in less than 1 ½ hours. I was a bit concerned about steering radius specs on the Deere web site, since they showed 48.5” for the 585 and almost twice that at 7.5 ft. for the 2210. The 585 specs also show a 42” uncut circle…I found that my 2210 leaves a 60” uncut circle which works perfectly for the mulch beds around my trees. The only thing I’m disappointed with is the lack of a good collection system for the 2210 so I got a mulching kit and that has worked well.
I recently got my 47” snow blower which I plan to try without tire chains. I’ve got a 400 ft. paved driveway here in CT that has about a 40 ft. elevation change. I do have JD starter weights on the rear wheels.
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 | buzst1
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 47 Southern New Hampshire
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2003-11-11 68467
marcnh,
Though I'm very happy with my kubota and have no plans to replace it, if I were shopping today I would have to give very serious consideration to the new small kioti. It seems to be a real value for a quality machine. A couple other points... With our cold windy winters here in NH I think you would be happier (warmer&drier) with a FEL/ rear blade combo than the blower. the combo would also provide far more utility for close to the same price. If your driveway is paved turf tires without chains will perform best. good luck shopping and have fun with our overpriced New Hampshire tractor dealers ....
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| Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2003-11-11 68520
Buz your post tweaked my interest and I went directly to the Kioti Site to study. Why would you do it? Anything over 90lbs per horsepower is to heavy for mowing lawns. Now if you want to plow the back forty lets move on to the 110 to 120 lbs per horsepower and then you are a little light. I don't understand the value could you help me? ....
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| buzst1
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 47 Southern New Hampshire
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2003-11-12 68551
Art, great question please keep in mind I am a kubota fan but :
1. Here in New Hampshire it is not possible to purchase a kubota for nearly as reasonable price as the rest of the country.
2. Our kubota dealers really don't have to try very hard any more and the larger dealers really don't have knowledgable sales or service counter help. They certainly do not demonstrate the dedication and enthusiasm that you do via your activities on this board
3. I'm not sure I agree that there is a relationship between mowing performance HP and weight. in fact in my experience most damage to a lawn is done by tire slipage, not turf compression - a heavier machine will help prevent slipage. In all the wet weather we have had this year my machine (b2150 -1800lbs+filled turfs+loader+mower)has done no damage to the turf.
4. we have discussed in other threads my feelings about the hp ratings on the bx so I won't go into it again. the kioti produces 15.5 pto hp at just over 2600 rpm, though they do bump rpms up to 2800 to be able to sell it as a 21hp machine.
5. the kioti offers all the benefits of the b7500 on a slightly shorter wheelbase. Plus, position control, cruise control,and more powerful 3pt. That extra 600 lbs has to go somewhere so I can only believe that it is making the kioti stronger than the lighter machine. (btw- do you know if kubotas published weights include tires and if yes, which tires?)
6. In general I am very impressed with the quality of most products that are coming out of Korea today. Kioti is no exception, just take a close look you have to be impressed by what they have built.
Anyway all this is just my opinion. I remain very happy with my 2150 and am sure I will have no reason to replace it in the near future. ....
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 | Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2003-11-12 68553
Actually Buz, weight of the machine overall has little do with traction, likewise with horsepower which is only a measure of work capacity.
Traction is determined by 1) tire tread, and 2) the weight(psi) that the tire is exerting agianst the ground.
In other words, a lighter tractor on aggresive tires with a small footprint will get a better grip than big smooth tires on a heavier machine.
Turf damage is usually from tire slippage, but not from 'straightline' slippage, turning is far more likely to cause damage, both from the tire 'plowing' and from the difference in tire speeds.
Best of luck. ....
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| buzst1
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 47 Southern New Hampshire
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2003-11-12 68557
Murf, I'm not sure i understand your point, I do agree re the damage done by turning/"plowing" but don't understand how you can compare a light machine and a heavy machine with different tire types. If your application requires turfs I would expect that you would put turfs on the machine, the same with ags, so the only remaining factor is weight what am I missing? ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2003-11-12 68574
Buz, there are MANY different sizes of tires that are all still 'turf' tires, this results in different sized contact patches.
According to Firestone's website rear turf tires vary in contact area from 55 sq. inches for a 9.5-16, and go all the way up to 205 sq, inches for a 19.5-24 low pro. tire.
That means the smallest tire has less than 27% of the contact patch that the biggest one has. That's a BIG difference.
At that ratio you could, in theory have a machine that weighs 5,500 pounds transmitting less weight per square inch to the ground than a 1,500 pound machine on the smaller tires.
Now you see what I mean?
Weight means almost NOTHING when it comes to traction.
Best of luck. ....
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| buzst1
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 47 Southern New Hampshire
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2003-11-12 68582
Hey Murf sorry to prolong this thread but I don't get the point. I understand and agree with the concept of contact area and traction being related....but if you had two identical machines with identical tire sets and on one machine the tires were loaded, on the other they were not loaded wouldn't the machine with loaded tires (the heavier machine) provide better traction? ....
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| Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2003-11-12 68585
Buz, in that case, yes of course the heavier machine should have better traction.
My only point was that weight alone is a poor measure of traction, there are other far more important factors.
Case in point, a nieghbour was having traction problems plowing snow with his machine two years ago. He had Ag. (R1's) tires on his machine, a grey market Yanmar, I convinced him to try my machine with turf's on it. Even though I was running a higher blade width to hp. ratio, and LESS weight to power ratio than he was I could plow circles around him, and with TURF'S to boot!!
Best of luck. ....
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| Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2003-11-12 68595
Thanks Murf, When going out on demo's you get to see a lot and I still discount the weight in tires as not the best weight to have. The general weight of equipment needs to be as light as it can be and still do the job. Olden days things were often made big and heavy in order to stand up to the vigors of the day's work. Today with the newer casts available they can build lighter and still have the same and even stronger piece then before. ....
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