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Check and clean your battery compartment after each use

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2003-09-02          63097

This is a definite DO item with the compact tractors with the battery in front of the radiator. You may not notice it much when used for short periods. After long periods of use such as 2 - 3 hours or more is when this condition appears. Check the battery compartment for battery acid which has vaporized or leaked from the battery caps. If it emits enough it will get drawn into the radiator and wreck havok with the metals later on down the road. I checked mine again after 3.5 hrs. of cutting and the battery caps were moist. I wash it down after each use now and plan to buy an Optima battery in the future. I posted about this before but wanted to follow up. Mine does not do it near as much as it did initially (perhaps due to the level filled at the factory) It is not apparent with the naked eye at first. If you happen to be working in dusty conditions, you can see where the dust has been absorbed into the battery acid at it is VERY apparent then. It is not a matter of over charging or bad battery. John Deere has a PIP for this but my battery already has it applied and it still has the problem. Just a heads up for the rest of you.

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F350Lawman
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 411 Goshen, NY
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2003-09-03          63106

No problems with mine thus far. What is Deere's fix? ....

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kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2003-09-03          63107

Chief, when did you take delivery on your 4410? Do you know if Deere has made running changes on newer machines? I'm curious if my 4310 already has the fix since I keep looking for problems but haven't seen any so far. ....

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
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2003-09-03          63118

None yet. It would be too easy for John Deere to use an Optima battery and pass on the added cost to the consumer. I would pay the extra $25. I may take the battery out and use it in something else and replace it with an Optima battery. Thing is I need to find an Optima battery model that has the hold down ears on the bottom sides like the John Deere battery. ....

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2003-09-03          63119

Ken, your tractor is newer than mine so maybe they did something to fix the problem on yours. I have the Hibernator battery in mine. What kind of battery is in yours? ....

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Peters
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 3034 Northern AL
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2003-09-03          63121

Chief;
I am not sure that Deere gives much thought to who's OEM battery they are using on their machines they may treat them like a commodity that they need to allow the tractor to move out the door. For some companies this is a dealer prep item therefore the dealer supplies the battery and it is only covered under the battery manufacturers warranty.
Twenty-five dollars does not seem like much to you and I especially considering the amount of extra maintenance that a leaking battery creates, but it is a lot to a manufacturer.
I wish that they would reconsider the location as what may be OK for a larger tractor is definately excessive pounding on a smaller rig.
I as I recall I think Mark said the Kubota moved it to the center on the BX? ....

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kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2003-09-03          63124

Chief, I have the hibernator in mine as well. I happen to have a voltmeter that records the highest voltage measured. Just for curiosity, next time I take the tractor out I'll hook that voltmeter up and see what kind of voltage the charging system is putting out. ....

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2003-09-03          63126

It would be VERY interesting to see what it records? I am going to check mine again with the volt meter. I think a good part of the problem is that the battery sits against the trans. oil cooler radiator. This can get pretty warm and cause the battery acid to heat up and expand more than normal. All the vibration and jumping around does not help either. ....

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kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2003-09-03          63134

I think the offroad crowd uses acid resistant foam pads under their batteries to reduce vibration. Heat and overvoltage contribute, but my guess is that sloshing acid is the major culprit. Of course I may be wrong.. ....

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F350Lawman
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 411 Goshen, NY
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2003-09-03          63155

What did Deere do exactly to fix your problem? How do I get it done? ....

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2003-09-03          63165

Scott,

More than likely, your battery already has the PIP applied to it. The PIP was basicly replacing the 2 triple pop off battery cell caps with 6 individual battery cell threaded caps that vent gas individually and are a bit taller than the original caps. I don't think they fixed the problem personally. John Deere has a spiral gell cell sealed battery; I wish they would use it in these tractors. How are you doing with yours? Haven't heard much from you lately so I guess you have about put another 50 hrs. on it??? ;-) ....

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F350Lawman
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 411 Goshen, NY
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2003-09-03          63168

I have the "new" battery with the 6 caps.

Well we've had 72 hours of rain so I have been idle. I am up to 63 hours now. Tractor is GREAT! I crawled all over and under this thing when I washed the motor and this thing is tight. Not a drip or moist spot anywhere, looks like new. I know it's only 63 hours but I wish all the vehicles I have owned were put together as well.

Check out picture #1, I have cleared the rock wall and brush are on the side of my house as you can see in the before and after photos. Tomorrow I will burn that brush pile ....

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neilw
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5 rainbow,texas
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2003-09-03          63169

I had this problem with my 790 2 years ago. JD replaced the battery and repainted where the paint had faded. The replacement battery did not seem any better than the original.

Put an Optima in the 790 and use the JD battery for on my Saturn. Guess you can tell which machine I favor.

The Optima will sit idle for months and start the tractor without hesitation. I do not worry about spilled battery acid. ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2003-09-04          63178

I wonder if keeping a battery to full charge with a trickle charger might help reduce the corrosion problem. If high charge rates from the alternator are adding to the problem, starting out with a fully charged battery would reduce the time it takes for the alternator to bring it back to full charge. Keeping batteries topped up is good for the batteries too. ....

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Ducati996
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 347 New York
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2003-09-04          63179

I agree battery acid spillage is very damaging and very avoidable. I very recently picked up a JD 4100 with very low hours. It was sitting idle the majority of the time, and it looked like the battery discharged. It effected the battery clamp the most, so I cleaned it up and put Baking soda all around it. No damage elsewhere thank god. I have it under a trickle charger that automatically adjusts charging voltage ( Battery Tender & Yuasa). The battery is healthly but I now have the fear of leakage. I'm replacing it regardless. I had a similiar incident on my older Cub 125, which acid leaked out and ruined my battery tray. Very destructive I might add, so I had to replace tray and a few other hard to find parts. My new Cub 3204 has a sealed battery, so I have less to worry about there. The mfg should also include a battery tub along with a sealed battery.
Besides Optima battery's who else makes a sealed battery ?
Interstate, Diehard ? Optima is overkill and over priced, but maybe the only solution... ....

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Ducati996
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Posts: 347 New York
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2003-09-04          63180

I also wanted to add that by having the battery on a floating trickle charger attached to the battery definately prolongs the life. 2 amp units are too high, and tend to cook the battery quickly (boil over as well). You should have a device that senses the volage and drops off to standby mode. Battey tender & Yuasa make good units that you find mostly in Motorcycle, snow mobile dealers.
I have a 1995 Yamaha Vmax with the original battery (8 years old), and still healthy as new (Yuasa). I know battery brands have a big factor on longevity as well.
I'm sure most people here are fully aware of this so this most likely is redundant info. ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2003-09-04          63182

Nobody in forums such as this should ever fancy themselves as stars who know more than regular people but don't (leave that role to political leaders) or to underrate their own contributions. We've all got things to contribute and things to learn, and we're all regular people. Fortunately I never feel that I get stars in my face from reading this board nor are there professional question askers either.

I for one knew about chargers with standby features somewhere in the back of my mind but forgot about them. My own cheapy charger is a 1A model and even then I don't want to leave it attached continuously. One with a standby feature would save me from having to remember to put it on and take it off.
....

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2003-09-04          63186

neilw,

Which Optima battery did you use in your 790? I have been looking at them and don't make one in my tractors size and with the side clamping lugs to hold it down. My tactor's battery take a BCI Group 22NF battery. John Deere's Optima type battery does not fit my 4410. Would be great if I could find an Optima or sealed type battery that fits my tractor. I was going to do exactly as you did and use the John Deere battery in the car. ....

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Ducati996
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 347 New York
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2003-09-04          63192

TomG,

I'm glad I'm able to contribute info !! Battery tender is a great unit they can be found at : www.batterytender.com
You most likely can find them online somewhere between $39- $59 depending on unit chosen. During the winter months
The bikes, cars, tractor (not used for snow) all are connected to Yuasa's or Battery Tenders. I usually remove
the bike's batterys and charge them on the work bench.
They never cause the battery to boil over and maintain the optimum charge for the battery during storage. They have extended the life dramatically on all the battery's including the 8 yr yuasa in my Vmax. The specific gravity is still as good as new. Yuasa's make good battery's, so thats a factor as well. Another suggestion is only add distilled water if they ever need filling. Regular water always shortens the life. I really like the fact I can place these on the battery(months at a time), and when I need it, its ready to go. Set it and forget it !! Hope this helps ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2003-09-04          63193

Being a thrifty 'old farmer' type myself I chose the home-brewed version of the 'automatic' battery charger.

One of the Big Box stores had a sale on a nifty automatic device, a timer of sorts I suppose. One of my pet peeves is re-adjusting timers around the house. As the seasons change, so must lights on timers, most of them have received a dawn-to-dusk photo-cell. The timer turns on the juice at 4:00pm, the earliest required time for winter season, and the photo-cell keeps the light off till dusk, about 9:30pm at the summers peak. The timers then shut everything off at 11:30pm regardless of season.

This gadget has a photo-cell and a timer in one, instead of coming on at a set time, it comes on at dusk, then you just adjust (with a single button on the front) how long you want the light to stay on past dusk, it also has a dawn-to-dusk setting.

I just put a 1 amp. charger on the battery and plug it into the photo-timer. I can set it to charge all night, or just for an hour or two. I will experiment with it but I think a couple of hours summer-time, and all night winter-time should do the trick.

Cost was $10 for the timer, and another $5 for the charger, the 'automatic' charger was $59 but din't have the flexability this setup does, I can also use it with bigger chargers.

Best of luck. ....

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Ducati996
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Posts: 347 New York
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2003-09-04          63211

Hi Murf,
The danger I see with your device, is the lack of control
of varying voltage. What these unit's do, providing the battery voltage hasnt dropped below 12 volts (otherwise it wont charge until 12 volts is reached) is vary whats actually needed. The initial output is 14.5 volts then it backs off after it senses battery voltage level, then stays on standby until battery drops below I think 12.5-13.5 volts. This actually can be acomplished very quickly (15 minutes or less) at times, depending on health of battery. Any longer than that is actually overcharging or cooking your battery. Charging all night is way too long, and will shorten you batterys life. These units (Yuasa & Battery Tender) are inexpensive. Its not worth dickering with a homemade device, that may or may not work efficiently..
I'm not trying to snub your ideas or efforts...

Our only true way of avoiding spillage is getting a sealed battery ( or a battery tub)...anybody know what model Optima or any other Mfg model number would be for a JD4100?? ....

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Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2003-09-04          63213

We take a lot of trades and even still get to see a lot of tractors. Some models seem to have this type problem and some don't. The battery location and how crowded of an area often seems to have a lot to do with it. ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2003-09-04          63221

I put a meter on my charger, the 'no load' voltage is 13.2 volts (although it's supposed to be 14.5v.) and I have left it on (by accident, CRS attack) a battery for two weeks at a time with no problems. The manufacturers stamp say it is only 850ma. output anyway.

My all night comment was meant to reflect the maximum amount of time I would ever leave it on, and then only in very cold weather. At the moment my 'Bota lives in an unheated garage.

Best of luck. ....

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bisaacks
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4 Texas
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2004-01-28          75332

Which Optima battery fits the John Deere 790? Thanks, Bruce ....

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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2004-01-28          75335

Your 790 take battery part # TY25258

Below is a link to the battery line chart which will tell you dimensions and BCI Group. ....


Link:   click here

 
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Chief
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2004-01-28          75336

Just in case you needed a look at the parts break down of the batter area, I have included a link for this as well below. ....


Link:   click here

 
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Chief
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 4297 Southwest MiddleTennessee
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2004-01-28          75337

Your 790 require a BCI Group 22NF battery. The same size battery as my 4410 requires. They are really odd ball sized and these are about the only sealed batteries I have been able to find to date.

Hope this was not TMI and was able to help you out. ....


Link:   click here

 
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hared1112
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 25 Marshall, Mo.
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2004-01-29          75420

I had the same problem with my 790 (it had the Hibernator battery with six screw on caps). After cleaning and repainting the battery area, I just took measurements and went to Walmart and picked up a sealed battery that would fit and had the terminals in the right location. Unfortunately, the first one went bad after about 3 months but Walmart replaced it free and have had no problems since. ....

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junkman 8556
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 8 beattie kansas
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2004-01-31          75547

just went out and checked my 250 hour 4410
its got the hibernator with 6 tall caps
and its definatly needs cleaning
I'm going to have to watch it ....

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