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Don t buy JD compact tractors You may be sorry

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bernie123
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 6 Arkansas
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2003-05-09          54593

I cannot recommend John Deere compact tractors to anyone. I have had horrible safety, reliability, and factory service problems with mine. For instance:

The power steering hydraulic steering shaft broke completely into, causing a complete loss of steering. The driver was only going about 1 MPH but if he had been going faster he could have been killed.

My tractor's reverse is not working. Before it quit completely it was slipping out of reverse by itself after a few feet of movement, and making a horrible gear grinding noise. It is my understanding that is a design problem with a bolt coming loose inside the transmission (that was later corrected). JD did not and will not recall the tractor and fix it free. The transmission has to be completely torn apart, which will cost you more than a few bucks. They won't even supply the parts free. This is really sorry.

My tractor had the wrong tire sizes (12 inch) and it took me four years worth of calls to John Deere before I figured out it was suppose to have 15 inch tires, and I discovered that myself. With a front-end loader I knew the tires were too small but could not find out from JD a fix for the problem of being undersized. The tractor even turned over on me once when I picked up some dirt. Now I need to buy new tires and rims, at my expense. Those 12-inch tires have sidewalls about like your motorcycle and were always getting penetrated by something, completely ruining the tire. Their smaller tractors have these tires as the correct size. Don't buy any tractor with 12-inch Agri tires. You will be sorry.

JD factor people completely ignored all of my problems because the tractor was out of warranty and referred me to a dealer. Dealers were no help, of course, and couldn't correct factory problems anyway.

The safety roll bar is dangerous. If you are looking back at a bushhog or plow and hit a bump, your head will crack the roll bar. It needs more bow to avoid the problem. I finally padded the roll bar, but the design is the problem.

The factory people have the sorriest attitude you will ever want to experience. They apparently have no respect for the consumer's safety or investment and apparently are not concerned about reliability. This probably applies to all of their tractors. My local tractor dealer does not even want to take a JD trade-in. He says the parts are too high and the tractors have too many problems. From my experience, I agree.

There are many more problems with this tractor - electrical, fuel gauge, switch shut-off not working because the solenoid is broke and cost about $115, but you are beginning to get the idea. Don't buy any JD compact tractor and I would think twice before buying any JD product because of their attitude toward the consumer.

The $90 repair manual is a disgrace. I just cannot believe they would publish such a sorry manual and then charge for it. I almost bet you can buy better manuals for your lawn mower, which didn't cost $15,000 to $20,000.

My tractor is a JD 855,but I believe my comments apply to all of the models in that series, and some comments probably apply to JD in general.


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MXMASTR
Join Date: Jul 2003
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2003-05-09          54594

Interesting to say the least. I haven't had much experience with John Deere other than recently visiting numerous dealerships. In my experience, they were very arrogant, unfriendly, and stop your heart overpriced. I will try to give them the benefit of the doubt because their name is so well known (like Harley Davidson) and maybe that is what makes them so cocky. Hope your luck changes.
Later on,
Charles ....

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bernie123
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 6 Arkansas
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2003-05-10          54597

If you think the dealers are bad, you should try dealing with JD Headquarters people. Here is a quote " Your tractor was designed and manufactured with the intent of meeting and exceeding all applicable engineering standards at the time it was manufactured. We maintain this position that it meets all such standards of design, manufacturing and safety."

In view of the facts in my case, do they actually have their head in the sand, or in some worse place.

Surely our engineering standards are better than this. I think I have seen toys designed better.



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dcsmith01
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2003-05-10          54601

That is intersting. Everything I have heard about the 855 is that it is one of the BEST compacts ever made? ....

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cutter
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2003-05-10          54603

Did you purchase this tractor new Bernie? The tire thing sounds amazing, but I suppose inattentiveness on the part of the shop could allow it to occur. The rest of the problems appear to indicate you ended up with a "lemon". Every manufacturer makes them, not every factory rep is there to make your life easy over it. I had that problem with my N/H but not the J/D I owned, the only bad experience I had was when I tried to trade it for a larger machine two years later and met with the dealer arrogance you refer to. A friend of mine owns an 855, never heard a complaint from him and I can testify my company's 755 took a world of abuse and never cried uncle. If you purchased used, perhaps the machine was seriously abused prior to you getting it?

There is a good deal of history on this site pertaining to J/D's unwillingness to admit to a problem, perhaps that is the category into which the transmission bolt problem fits. Did you touch base with more than one J/D dealer?

I am certain others on this site will have something to say about your experience, sorry to hear of it. ....

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DRankin
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2003-05-10          54611

Just sifting through this, the wrong size tires sounds like was a used tractor.

Most of the other complaints could easily stem from the rollover mentioned. The transmission popping out of gear could be related to running the wrong size/mismatched tires in 4wd.

We also do not know how many hours are on the machine and there is an allusion in the story that it is used commercially or at least rented out or borrowed.

How many years since this model was offered new? ....

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bernie123
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2003-05-10          54615

The tractor was not rented out. It was primarily used to mow part of 12 acres and used to move potting soil around and general utility use on a nursery. I inherited the tractor when I bought the nursery. The average yearly use was about 85 hours per year, with less than 1450 hours total. This is equal to driving your truck for 40 hours per week for 36 weeks. A long haul truck could rack up that many hours in two months. I consider this low use.

JD has a kit to fix the bolt coming loose in the transmission. You have to replace a shaft. Apparently a cap bolt holding a gear backs off by itself from normal use and vibration. This bolt holds on a gear necessary to go into reverse. The problem was fixed in the 90's by a carter key or something similar to prevent it backing out. JD did not recall the tractors with the problem, which reflects on their character and lack of concern for their customers. I was lucky to even find out about the problem at all because it is not documented in their service manual. Big secret it looks like.

I have no idea how the 12-inch tires got on the tractor, but I can almost assure you the original owner would not remove 15-inch rims and tires and replace them with JD factory 12-inch rims. If he did, the original rims would still be here, along with 30 other years of parts and junk.

The tractor was well cared for, but you have a rough ride on the 12-inch tires if you cross a rut, which shakes the loader excessively. JD is not concerned about the tire problem apparently or how it happened, even though it's unsafe with a loader. When you pick up a load with the loader, the low-pressure front tires flatten out. If you are on a little slope, It's then easy for the load to shift and then you are in trouble.

The power steering hydraulic cylinder shaft that snapped into, causing a loss of steering, looked like the metal was crystallized. This is dangerous and I know of no fix other than replacing the JD cylinder with one made by a quality manufacturer. Once again, JD factory people were not concerned about the safety problem. I would have had the part sent in for examination and testing (and provided free recall replacements).





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Chief
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2003-05-10          54616

Bernie, if the tractor is in as bad a shape as you say. How much do you want to sell it?

If you think John Deere service and design is bad; you are in for a rude awakening. JD is no perfect but they are about the best out there in my opinion.

To be honest with you, it sounds to me like the tractor just needs a good going over and "start from square one" servicing and go step by step by the manual. Put the proper tires on the front and move on.

I understand that you are PO'd and blowing off some steam but I think the best idea here would be to get you and the tractor pointed in the right direction. It may cost you a few bucks in parts but I think you will be happy and the both of you better off. ....

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bernie123
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2003-05-10          54617

Chief, if you think a tractor company should not be concerned about a shaft from a hydraulic power steering cylinder snapping into, or not concerned about a bolt coming loose in the transmission that could have been easily prevented I think you should go to work for John Deere. They would love you and you would sell a lot of replacement parts for them. Personally, I cannot stand safety problems or failures due to bad design, inferior parts, or a "you bought it and now its yours" attitude from the factory people. Thank god we don't fly on airplanes made by people with that attitude. Since I have a pond and several other sharp slopes on my property, I could have wound up drown in the pond from the loss of reverse at the wrong time, or been killed on a slope by loss of steering. The roll over could have also killed me. I think you and everyone else who buys products should expect concern for safety and reliability and free fixes from any manufacturer or every product we buy will be crap. Anything that cost as much as this tractor should be at least as reliable as a 1940's Ford 8N don't you think? As a side thought, have you ever looked at the original selling price and the current price for all of those old small garden tractors, and then compared them to the new/resale price ratio of a modern compact tractor? I don't think these tractors will sell for twice their original selling price after sixty years.




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Chief
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2003-05-10          54619

Bernie, first off I am trying to help you out here. With the attitude you are conveying here I don't think you will get much if any help at all from a dealer as they are going to be inclined to think nothing they do will please you.

Yes, I am and would be concerned about the points you brought up, but those are not common occurances with that model tractor. As a matter of fact I used to work for John Deere as a mechanic prior to my enlisting in the Army. Funny you should mention flying aircraft manufactured and maintained by a business with the same attitude? I am a maintenance test pilot for UH-60 Blackhawk helicopters and trust me, the business I worked for, for 21 years had an even worse attitude.

The factory people are not going to do squat for you. The dealership people are going to do that provided you can establish a positive repour with them. No need to kiss their butts or anything like that. Start off buying some parts, like filters, etc. Start asking some questions about some of the problems you are having with your tractor while you are there. It sure doesn't hurt to act like you are looking at alot bigger more expensive model too. ;o) Just to get them wondering.

The wrong size tires is not John Deere's fault. Bottom line is that you are going to have to perform some maintenance on this tractor, pay someone else to do it, or sell it and get another. If you are not interested in doing the work yourself, ask the dealer to look at is and give you an estimate.

This tractor was made from 1989 to 1998, that says alot about how popular this model was. Assuming it is as old as you say and a 1989 model MFWD, it is worth around $6,000 in fair condition. Get it repaired and deduct the cost from your taxes. It is not going to get any better on the track you are on. Coming to the John Deere section to ask for and look for help is one thing, but you are not going to influence many owners here; at least speaking for myself. I also worked in procurement as one of my duties while in the Army. I purchased 15 JD 4710's that I have not heard so much as a peep out of that are still in Iraq, and the soldiers love them. John Deere was the only manufacturer who stepped up to the plate and worked with us. All New Holland did was threaten to go to court if we did not buy their TC45D. Kubota was not even interested because they could not meet specs. John Deere warrantied the engines for use with JP-8 fuel. Nobody else would. The 101st Airborne (who I am currently with until the golden retirment day this June) purchased dozens of JD Gators that the Special Forces took to Afganhistan. They did nothing but add oil and fuel. Put over 1500 hours on those machines with no maintenance and they were still running when they came back. They were a mess but running. All they required was normal services and tires.

The point is here, that nothing will last if not maintained well. I worked on Yellow Line John Deere and I'll be honest with you. None of them are fun to work on but the worst was the 450B & C track loaders and the damn HLR. In any case I hope you are able to get your tractor fixed to your satisfaction without have to pay your first born or you can work out a trade on a newer model. You sound like you are about ready for a nice new JD 4310 or 4410 ehydro! ;o)

Keep us posted one how things go for you. Good luck! ....

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Jim on Timberridge
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2003-05-10          54629

Bernie - your experience with the 855 is unfortunate. I had a 755, then a 955, and they were fine machines. Wish i still had the 955; i used to think the best thing that JD could do was come out with a "1055". Instead they went the 4000 series direction.
Chief gave some very pragmatic advice; the best point was to get past the problems and make the best of it.
jim ....

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slowrev
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2003-05-10          54630

I keep hearing about the sorry attitudes of John Deere dealers. I know they are not all this way, so if you represent a Deere dealer and are not this way...PLEASE take no offense. However if you represent this poor attitude, just look back at IBM's history. They had the we are God attitude, we do not listen the customer, we sell them what we WE want to sell them... well they seem to have fallen from grace a LOT. Same with other corporations with the same attitude. Employees with bad attitudes can drag down a large corporation, it just takes longer if they are really big.

I a dealer treats you like dirt, do not deal with them ( Brand does not matter ). This is how we consumers speak.

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bernie123
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2003-05-10          54638

My reason for positing my original message was to inform the public of JD factory people's awful attitude toward the safety and reliability problems I mentioned and make the buying public aware of the problems that I have had. I am not even sure I have a big problem with JD dealers -- they didn't design the transmission or the hydraulic cylinder or write the service manual. One might have installed the wrong size tires however.

I am sure that many of JD's products perform satisfactory, especially the older ones, but one commercial user that I know who has JD, Ford, and Massy tractors in the 100 HP range (mowing highways) says his JD has more downtime than all of the others combined.

I do believe JD is going the route of IBM, and they may learn the same lesson. Anyone who does not listen to their customers is in for a rude awaking, especially with the power of internet to inform the public about problems. You are reading this, right?

I do have a very strong background in reliability, safety, etc. I spent two years as an Army Ordnance Officer, then 28 years with NASA. It's interesting that one person mentioned IBM. In fact, I was one of the primary people who designed/architected the IBM mainframes out of the new control center for NASA. It was a dedicated mission of mine to get their computers out of there because of their cost, their attitude, and because they had no interest in interfacing and integrating with local area networks and workstations. (They do now, lol) The last mainframe was removed some time ago, and I cheered. IBM did have very reliable computers, however.

More background: I have had many people work for me in computer systems, both hardware and software designers, plus QA and reliability. I have been responsible for a huge building full of electronic equipment for maintenance and operations. When I was only 24 years old, I doubled the reliability of the NASA mission control center with a few simple changes that everyone should have seen. Believe me, I know complex systems like few people on this earth.

A tractor is not a complex system. The technology is over 60 years old and mature. Anyone who cannot design a reliable, safe tractor has a real problem. Then to refuse to acknowledge and fix the problems just compounds the crime.

I am sure I will never own another JD product again. This is my third JD product and all were unsatisfactory. I do know how to maintain machinery, but I have to have something to work with. I don't know of any maintenance that can be performed on a bolt inside a transmission, nor what maintenance is necessary for a steel hydraulic shaft. I am currently mowing with a old 1986 high hours Yazoo riding mower, which is mowing what the JD 855 is suppose to be mowing. I occasionally drive my 1969 Van that I have owned since it was new. The lawn mower I mowed hundreds of yards with commercially when I was a kid and in college lasted over 25 years before the frame rusted out. My dad then put the motor on a tiller. In contrast, the JD riding mower my dad bought lasted about 3 years. The engine was shot and the body not much better.

I am sure I will not fix my JD 855 at my expense. I think it would better serve the public if I put it out in front on the highway with lemons plastered all over it. I see no use in sticking someone else with such a product. The motor appears to be good, so I may find a use for the motor.

Whew, what a soapbox I have been on. Sorry.
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Chief
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2003-05-14          54888

Bernie, you can park it out in front of my house. :o) ....

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bernie123
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Posts: 6 Arkansas
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2003-05-16          54998

Naw, I am on a major highway. It will make a good conversation piece. It pays to advertise.



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Peters
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2003-05-16          55004

Bernie;

I am sorry to here that your JD 855 has been a lemon. My manual states that the 855 is shod with 4x15 for ags and 23-8.50-12 for turfs. I agree the sidewalls on these small tires are not too puncture resistant. I ended up with tubes in mine.

If you look back on the posts you will realise this is not the first time we have discussed the JD problem. They seemed to be slow in correcting the 4xxx series problems.

I just I am one of those people that starts quiet and with out any action will raise the roof. If I see something that is a safety related item I will certainly make noise until I get action. I had a Toyota with a critica safety related problem that could have distroyed the engine if I had not caught it immediately. It took going progressively higher in management but I finally had it fixed out of waranty. As for JD I would go as high as I needed to get action, if you are certain that it is a defect.

I would be worried how you could prove that hydraulic steering cylindar had not been previously damaged. This is not the first JD hydraulic cylinder to fail, check for posts. ....

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BurbMan
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2003-05-17          55058

I've owned two JD 750 and am selling the current 750 I have now. I never had any problems with either one so I never ever brought them for servicing..I did it myself. Here I was all set to buy a JD 4210 next week but after reading this and other forums about their service, I think I'll drive some 75 miles and check out the Kubota dealer. You made your point Bernie. ....

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Billy
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2003-05-17          55061

That reminds me of this old guy that bought a new Dodge truck from the local dealership here. The dealership had put numerous transmission and rear-ends in the guy's truck, under warranty. They finally quit fixing it for him (he was abusing the truck). Well he gets ticked off and starts towing it up and down the highway in front of the dealership, with a BIG lemon sign on top. Then he'd park it across the street for everyone to see.

The old man is dead now and the dealership is still in business. He was kind of the joke of the town. ....

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Peters
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2003-05-18          55066

Burbman;
I believe the concensus is that there has been fewer problems with the 4x10 series than the 4x00 series. The tractors were corrected over their production run and then replaced with the newer series.
There is a post on problems on the new series that some one started. You may want to look at these.
We have had some negativism in posts on the Kubotas also.
I guess it all depends on your local dealer.
Peters ....

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harvey
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2003-05-18          55076

I've set on the sideline long enough. I fail to see how JD is responsible for any problems with this tractor. I did the math, 1450 hours divided by 85 per year makes tractor 17 years old. Of course I know I'm not smart enought to fix all of NASA's problems and make them a more stream lined operation. So my math could be off. BUT I am smart enought to know no one is gonna accept problems with a old tractor well out of warranty, by 15 years.

YUP as Peters said some dealers are bad and that goes across the colors. BUT none of them would accept this issue.

Harvey ....

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usafretired
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2003-05-18          55086

Bernie,

Sorry to hear your trouble. I have a 96 model 855 and so far I have not had any trouble out of mine. I used this forum to find out about the 855 before I made the purchase. Everything I found on it was positive.

Anyways, if you are going to let the tractor sit, let me know if you want to sell the Front end loader. I am looking for one. ....

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Peters
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2003-05-19          55096

Harvey;
Thing break with wear etc. but not fixing known defects is asking for law suits. Unfortunately these large companies have their army of lawyers to determine the risk. If it is cheaper to deal with a law suit if and when the person is killed then we don recall the tractors. I realise this is not large money on on tractor but I think Bernie is angry at the fact that they knew it was a defect in the tx and chose not to recall and risk his life and any other that had a tractor like his.

Bernie I was also looking for an 855 project tractor. I don't need the motor. ....

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homedad5acre
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2003-05-19          55105

I guess it's true that the only thing you can count on is that one day we shall surely die and until that day we will pay taxes. Choose your color and expect problems either with the dealer or with the tractor. I've been whipped so many times that I guess I've given up. ....

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Maynard
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2003-05-19          55126

On Saturday, I spoke to a Kubota rep at the county fair. Said his tractors that's comp to JD 4210 was $1200 cheaper out the door. Well I today I went to check his Kubota tractor but discovered it was $2K more! Needless to say, he got me to go to his store, but for lying to me, he didn't get my business. I'm back to JD dealer to buy the 4210. I hate liers. ....

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DRankin
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2003-05-19          55128

Which model did he say was comparable to the 4210? ....

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Maynard
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2003-05-19          55137

B2710 ....

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DRankin
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2003-05-19          55139

I don't think so! The 4210 weighs a good 800# more.

The better dollar value in the Kubota line is the 7800. It comes in cheaper than the 2710 and has more ponies. But it still only weighs in at 1700+ pounds. The 4210 goes 2600# stripped.

I am beginning to really appreciate what weight means in a small tractor.

Good luck on your quest to find the right machine. ....

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homedad5acre
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2003-05-20          55144

Maynard, Do you know how to tell if a salesman is lying? There lips are moving.(a really old joke) Anyway I wish you luck ....

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Murf
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2003-05-20          55201

While I don't have any Greens in the fleet it's not because of quality or reputation. In fact of all the commercial operators I have spoken with the only complaint with the equipment itself was the notorious 'turf-eating' front axle a few years back.

Many of the golf courses I deal with have several CUT's and are very satisfied with them. Most of the municipalities around here also run fleets of them for clearing snow off sidewalks and maintaining baseball & soccer fields. They seem to last 3 years with township flunkies at the wheel day in and day out, they cant be that bad......

Best of luck. ....

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cutter
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2003-05-20          55217

It's amazing to me how an expensive piece of equipment can be ruined in two years by municipalities. I looked at some City owned dump trucks, backhoes etc.. and could not believe the terrible shape they were in after just two years of abuse, now being auctioned back to the taxpayers that had to buy them in the first place. More of your CSEA at work I guess. ....

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tbarber
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2003-05-20          55219

I have a 87 855 with 800 hours no problems at all.
Tom ....

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homedad5acre
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2003-05-20          55227

I don't mean to be cynical but warranties are like Indian treaties they for the most part aren't worth the paper they are written on. As in the case of the cute story that Billy passmore wrote of the old man, the dealership did not have to go to court and prove the old man was abusing his truck, they just stopped honoring the warranty. This put the burden of proof on the old man and in almost all cases it is cheaper to pay to fix it yourself than to go to court and force them to honor the warranty. And as far as recalls are concerned Peters hit the nail on the head. Although that old man was the joke of the town, the joke is on all on us. Bernie123 for what it's worth I totally understand your frustration. ....

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homedad5acre
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2003-05-21          55300

Harvey, You got me thinking is 85hrs really equivalent to a years worth the work for a tractor. I have know idea so I will defer to you experts. However, it would seem to me that if the average man works 2080hrs per year, his well maintained tractor should be able to go at least 1/4 of that. I bought my Kubota 3 weeks ago and I have 39hrs on mine, projected out over the year thats over 500hrs. Can anyone of you experts tell me if I am pushing it to hard. I don't think so but I could be wrong. ....

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DRankin
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2003-05-21          55303

Your BX clocks "real" hours. Most of the Deere's run tach hours.

My 4100 is two years old and shows 110 hours. I have had the BX 8 months and it shows 135 hours.

They get about equal use but the BX clock just turns faster. ....

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Maynard
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2003-05-21          55304

Update on my tractor search. This morning I drove to another Kubota dealer to see if they could match the price on the JD 4210. They too were higher..$2-$3K more for a comp Kubota. I drove back to the JD dealer and bought the 4210 which will be delivered tomorrow. Whee...over and done with. Anyone looking for a good JD 750 4x4 with only 639 hrs? ....

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homedad5acre
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2003-05-21          55308

Congradulations Maynard, I hope you'll be happy with your green machine. There is an old saying that you get what you pay for, but it has been my experience that it is often not true. Whether you buy the high end or low end or in between. Don't get me wrong I love my Kubota and even though I had a hydraulic leak at 12hrs that was easily fixed and it's taking everything I've thown at it so far, it did lighten my wallet quite a bit. I am a person who is not loyal to brand only value and value is determined over time. I hope that your green machine works out to be a good value for you. Good luck!
....

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Morgan
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2003-05-22          55317

Bernie, I just want to comment on your spelling. How can a shaft be broken into? Do you mean broken in two? I can't imagine why anybody would want to break into a shaft, but maybe it can be broken in two. (Broken in two pieces).

No wonder John Deere wouldn't help you, they thought your tractor was broken into and vandalized, and then would be an insurance case. ....

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Murf
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2003-05-22          55350

Before you can comment on a unit's hours showing on the hour meter, you need to know what type of reading it is. If the hour meter is electrical thats one thing, but if it is a mechanical type then it only records the hours based on the engine running at PTO speed, if it spent a years time puttering around idle, or close to it, then it would only show one hour for every three it actually ran, and it could really be closer to 300 hrs. a year on the machine, not 85. If you consider a nursery type environment where a machine may only be run long enough to pick up a few plants and hoist them onto a truck, or scoop up some soil, then "Taxi Cab" syndrome (constant start/stop) starts to apply and you can them multiple 'meter' hours by 8 or 10 to get a more realistic estimate of condition. Especially if the level of maintenance was lees than desirable for the conditions. Using this theory the machine would have the equivalent of 11,600 to 14,500 hrs. on it, the equivalent of 680 to 850 hrs. per year, considering the seasonal nature of a nursery this sounds about right.

A slightly different perspective on condition...

Best of luck.

....

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Morgan
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2003-05-22          55387

Bernie, I sympathise with you about John Deere. I have had the same problem with Ford. I bought a 1921 Ford Model T "Tin Lizzie" last year from an old man who had it sitting in his back yard for 50 years. The seat material was damaged and the spring broke right through the upholstery and hit me in the butt, when I sat down. So, I took the car to Ford and asked them to fix it for me because it was faulty craftmanship on their part. Why would they manufacture a seat so the material would break through so bad that the spring would come through? It can be a safety hazard. I called the Ford executives in Detroit and they said the car was out of warantee since it was 81 years old. I said it didn't matter that the warantee was expired, it still made their company look bad that they used a material for the seat that would let a spring through into your butt, it can impale somebody and maybe even kill them if it went into their organs down there. What if a pregnant woman sat down, she might have a miscarriage and kill a human baby, that's murder. So I demanded to speak to the president of Ford, whose name is Henry Edsel II, and he said he would replace the car at no charge with a 2003 Chevrolet. I said that was not good enough I wanted a Rolls Royce. ....

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cutter
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2003-05-23          55438

Interesting Morgan. All this time I have had this wrong minded idea about personal responsibility. I am sure you were able to sue the old man as well, after all he sold it to you. Probably collect social security due to your disability now too! Were they able to remove the spring from your butt or do you now require special trousers? Most likely several of those defective units will be in our Memorial Day parade Monday, perhaps I can obtain some government warning labels to place on them before this happens again! ....

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Chief
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2003-05-23          55439

Hey Guys! I don't agree with Bernie's position or logic either , but I would like to think this is a place where we can all vent once in awhile without a pile on flaming as a result. I don't know.......maybe I am just feeling all warm and fuzzy today. ;o) I am not having the greatest of days anyway. I opened up my boat today and found 3 inches of nasty, funky, scummy water sitting in the bilge and spent this morning hosing it out. I'm gonna give Sea Ray a piece of my mind about this defect! <;o) Cheers! ....

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Lefty1
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2003-05-23          55440

Mr Morgan,

Regarding your spelling correction that pertains to Bernie's shaft, those that live in glass houses..well you know the rest. Here is an excerpt from one of your recent posts;

Murf, I have a B6200 myself and I'm not convinced that the fuel cutoff is a solenoid. Mine fuel cutoff is a cable that pulls on a lever and I think the fuel cutoff is purely mechanical.

What is a mine fuel cutoff, does it prevent the mine from operating or is it part of the shaft? Just curious.
....

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Lefty1
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2003-05-23          55441

Oh and Morgan, what is a warantee? Is that a cross between a guarantee and a warranty? ....

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plots1
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2003-05-23          55442

boy this JD is crap post has really grown, so I just want to throw in my 2 cents.I think there all good tractors ,and with good care they will all do a good job for many years, although I still think green is the finest machine out there no matter what the upset fella says. ....

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homedad5acre
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2003-05-23          55443

Just to let you all know that a warrantee is a person. ie someone that receives a warranty. You guys are a hoot. I'm still laughing Oh and Chief I bet bernie123 could sell you a good boat anchor. ....

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drcjv.
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2003-05-23          55445

I will not add to the piling on of Bernie and will admit to my occational spelling problems before anyone else does. This is just an observation but, from reading post on this sight for just over a year it sure seems that there are many more complaints about JD tractors, dealers and factory than there are about NH and Kubota. It seems in many cases these well known problems (4000 series tractors, dealer arrogance, high prices ect... )are just overlooked or explained away by JD fans. Again this is just my opinion. ....

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kwschumm
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2003-05-23          55447

I can't speak to tractor quality because I'm inexperienced with any, but I am shopping. The JD and NH dealers here have for the most part been excellent to deal with, but I haven't been able to get the time of day from the Kubota dealer in two separate visits. So I called to make an appointment and they told me "the salesman is gone this week, maybe next, call back then." I suspect that getting a repair done by those guys would be an exercise in frustration so I've crossed orange off my list. ....

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cutter
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2003-05-23          55451

No doubt they all have problems but the dealer is the key to success. Around here we have one good JD dealer out of three in the area, two have an attitude to die for. Yet other than a rattling hood and a belly deck that would not stay adjusted to cut level, I never needed to actually make a repair to my 4100. That model did not have the axle problem to my knowledge, but the owners of the larger tractors had a difficult time indeed.

To say one is particularly better than the other from a mechanical aspect would require far more research on an independent level than anyone here could possibly conduct. They are all high quality Japanese machines, so the buy American brand loyalty does not mean much in this case. I find the N/H TC series to be the most comfortable but I did have my share of problems with it. So far the Kubota at almost two years old has suffered a loose wire on the fuel gauge sending unit that I fixed myself and a faulty loader frame (mis-aligned weld) was replaced by the factory.

Any machine that is used hard and possibly abused by a previous owner can cause problems. I have seen this happen in the automobile business particularly as it pertains to rental and lease units. They look great after being doctored up for the auction but are rolling pieces of junk at two or three years old. I believe that is what Bernie has inherited. ....

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homedad5acre
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2003-05-23          55453

Cutter, tell me more about that mis-aligned weld my new BX22 might have that problem. At the top of the bucket the cylinder supports/brackets are not centered. From the left one to the outside of the bucket it's 21 3/8" and from the right one to the outside of the bucket it's 21 1/8". Not much but clearly noticeable. Also when it's in 4wheel drive the 4wheel drive lever goes all the way to the bottom of the slot. When I pull it into 2wheel drive it does NOT travel to the top of the slot. Could this be a problem?
I know this may be a bit off thead but it might illustrate that they all have problems, hopefully pointing out that Brand loyalty is for those that can afford it.(A fool and his money sort of thing)If your going to show any loyalty it might as well be to other tractor consumers.

Lets keep there feet to the fire or they'll all get sloppy. ....

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cutter
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2003-05-24          55459


My 2910 had a loader frame that had apparently moved in the jig when it was welded. At the point where the upper pin is inserted there is a stop designed to align the holes between loader and frame. Mine had tilted back approximately a quarter of an inch in the jig before welding and therefore allowed too much travel when mounting and removing the loader (pin either bound up or would not insert without a great deal of joystick toggling). Hope this answers your question. ....

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cutter
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2003-05-24          55462

Homedad,

I re-read your post several times. It sounds like you are referring to the upper (cylinder) mounting dogs on the top of the bucket, they are welded in place correct? If that is so, the only effect that would have is to place the bucket off center a bit. But I would check to see that the loader arm mounts are equally off center. If they are not, undue stress could be placed on the structure. You might want to compare to another bucket at the dealer, that is what I did do demonstrate my problem with the loader frame. I am a nut for things being centered and square, grew up with tool makers and was one myself for a time so a tolerance of more than a few thousandths of an inch on anything irritates me. Not a good hangup to have considering the quality of some of the junk sold these days. ....

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DRankin
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2003-05-24          55464

Cutter, if I read it correctly he is speaking of the welds being jigged up off-center.

Homedad, I just measured my bucket. It is slightly asymmetrical also, 1/16 to 1/8 depending on how and where you measure. It certainly does not affect performance.

My 4wd lever does the same as yours. It has positive detents at either end so I am thinking it is just a cosmetic deal with a slightly over-sized exterior housing. ....

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DRankin
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2003-05-24          55465

To confirm Cutters suspicion..... my bucket is shifted very slightly to the right (as you see it from the tractor seat) on all the welds. ....

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homedad5acre
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2003-05-24          55480

Exactly right Mark, when I am in the seat it appears that the bucket is not centered. However, the bucket meets the ground level and the pins slide in and out with know trouble when mounting or removing. I have had the bucket filled to overflowing with blue mountain stone and have not had any performance problems(no twisting). Like cutter I have a thing about things being straight and true, so when I am in the seat my eyes are drawn right to it. Thank you both for your comments on these issues. It appears as though I do not have a problem after all. ....

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Chief
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2003-06-06          56961

I think this thread has meandered far and wide enough, enveloped pissing contests, and pole vaulted over enough mouse turds. Let's lay this one to rest and move on? ehhh? ;o) ....

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bigbukhntr
Join Date: Jul 2003
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2003-06-08          57076

yes chief, i had thought my 'puter had jumped back into the kubota section without my knowledge! ....

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cutter
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2003-06-08          57083

No doubt some of it has gone a bit sour, but it is sometimes difficult for me to express an idea on a subject without mentioning something else that may be related, or not :>. I have seen some fantastic threads that are totally unrelated to tractors this week and really enjoyed them. ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-08          57086

I have to agree. Overall who really cares if a strand digresses. Most conversations do. I have also enjoyed the majority of the wayward posts this week. ....

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harvey
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2003-06-08          57087

Funny how this one keeps comming up. Cutter you are exactly right with the meandering thoughts.

Nothing quite like a good brainstorming session with lots of ideas and with many options to pick a brain.

That is what is so good about the search feature you never know which thread will hold the best solutions to a unique issue.

Harvey ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-08          57089

harvey, hey thats a REAL load of wood ! I wish I could find mine all split and stacked like that. lol. I do have to wonder if Dennis gets a kick out of seeing how many times a strand can get swatted back to life. ....

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cutter
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2003-06-08          57091

Speaking of wood, that is what I will be doing AGAIN today. Hopefully one of the last Sundays I will have to remove lumber from my yard due to ice storm damage. I will go after the small trees today and that will leave two or three large ones to pick at this summer that are not half down blocking my mowing operation at this point. My fields/woods are a mess, tree limbs everywhere :< ....

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benfranklin
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Posts: 12 michigan
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2003-06-13          57507

Not the same here at all with my 790. The machine and dealer have been exteamly reliable. ....

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Murf
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2003-06-13          57509

Cutter, you think you had ice damage to clean up, have a look at my # 4 pic, it is of the mulch piles from the cleanup at a local university.

Best of luck. ....

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Billy
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2003-06-13          57512

Hey Murf, speaking of ice storms. We had one here in Oklahoma about 2 years ago. It was one hell of a big mess. I was out of power for 9 days but some were out 30. ....

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plots1
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2003-06-13          57520

Now thats a mess Murf, I see you use a real peice machinery instead of a cut on that size mess. ....

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Chief
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2003-06-13          57526

All this tree damage is going to shoot the bottom out of the firewood market this year. Maybe we will luck out and have a real winter this year. ....

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Murf
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2003-06-13          57527

The grinder was NOT pto driven either...LOL

It is a 9' diameter tub grinder powered by a 300hp Cummins turbo diesel, it will take anything that fits in the 9' wide opening, stumps, rocks, soil and all... It would almost keep up with the excavoator loading it.

To give you an idea of scale, the top of the 'tub' is 12' up. The mulch pile after a week of clean up took 4 tri-axle dump trucks two days of steady running to haul away. ....

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Chief
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2003-06-13          57529

Now that is what I call a stump grinder Murf! That grinder must sound good chewing up wood. ....

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cutter
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2003-06-13          57555

Murf,

Can you send some of that mulch over my way? I could only wish I had a grinder to do that! ....

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Misenplace
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2003-06-13          57559

After months of cutting, burning and hand chipping I could sure clean up 60 acres in a hurry with one of those babies. ....

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