750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?: John Deere Review  -- John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum and Review 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?: John Deere Review -- John Deere Tractors Discussion Forum

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 10-25-2002, 19:51 Post: 44203
Gannz
2002-10-25 19:51:16
Post: 44203
 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

Hello all. I'm guessing it's possible but wondering if it's feasible to add front wheel drive to my 750.

Needed parts? Front differential, front axle housing, front drive shaft & lever... anything else? Would I need a different steering arm?

Do you now where to find or look for someone parting out a 750 w/ MFWD? Do you think this would be the only way to make it worth while to add the front wheel drive?

Thanks for your time/input and remember... There's no such thing as a stupid question… only stupid people who ask questions. Smile






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 10-25-2002, 20:39 Post: 44206
Peters

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 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

I can not imaging how it would pay. You would need the gear link in transmission and manybe a different transmission.
I think it would be easier to sell the tractor and find a good 4x4 one.






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 10-26-2002, 07:02 Post: 44220
TomG

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 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

Rather than repeat the details of earlier discussions, I'd say that a list of everything needed could be assembled from a parts manual.

My Ford parts manual gives different 2wd and 4wd parts numbers for a whole bunch of parts. I think the cost of required parts from a dealer would be more than a new tractor. Even if a 750 with a blown engine was found for parts, it probably would be easier to swap engines than do a drive conversion, and there's no guarantee all engine parts are the same. The idea could be pursued I suppose but it's probably absolutely a non-starter unless the 2wd and 4wd front axle mounts are the same.






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 10-26-2002, 10:40 Post: 44234
YanmarJim



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 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

Years ago several farmers around here added 4x4 to their combines. They called them "mud hog" rear ends. They took a steerable front end off some old retired 4x4 or purchased one at a junk yard. They added this to the rear and hooked up a hydraulic motor to drive this addition. This gave them gear ratio to match the main drive plus addional traction for their needs. This idea does work with a little fabrication, could be used on compact tractors. You might use a Toyota or Nissan 4X4 front differential or something similar. Cost would be dependant on your ability to scrounge, weld, fab., or hire reasonable skill.






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 10-27-2002, 05:11 Post: 44258
TomG

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 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

Now that's an interesting idea.

I wonder how the hydraulically driven axle coordinates with the mechanically driven one? Something for me to think about.






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 10-29-2002, 07:09 Post: 44358
Art White



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 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

Tom JD in there infinite wisdom gave the hydraulic drive to there ag customers in the seventies. They were one of the most cursed items I've ever seen on a farm. Seems they pull good till the relief valve kicks in then you sit. They are an easy add on as they just go to the pumps for there power. On a 750 deere it would need an extra pump just to run it. They had to speeds one higher and one slower that just worked with the unit's normal speeds. The high speed will spin them up good when a little light on the front or rear as in a combine. They did help on a tractor but not as much as on the gear drive front ends.






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 10-30-2002, 04:56 Post: 44412
TomG

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 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

Thanks Art. I was figuring something like that--the motor either turns into a pump or opens a relief to accommodate differences in speed. But it does sound like the 4wd could quit when it's needed most.

I guess that's also how power-track goes around corners, but possibly it's a more sophisticated design. I've never really thought about it, but the idea seems cheaper to build than differential gears.






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 10-31-2002, 13:58 Post: 44497
YanmarJim



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 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

I know the neighbors used theirs in very deep mud, I'm not sure about the by-pass, but I know it would have one. And I'm not saying that it would be equal to a new JD or even an older compact with 4x4 but it is do-able. It would provide front wheel "assist" at a very minimum investment(dependent on skill level) compared to trading up or buying another tractor for parts. The ratio used would need to be 4:10 or 4:55 or greater, something like the jeep rock crawlers use in the mountains. Just an idea....






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 11-01-2002, 07:13 Post: 44518
TomG

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 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

Oops! Cheaper than differential gears did I say? Guess I meant cheaper than a mechanical drive-train since the hydraulic motor does turn a differential.

I think the original question was mostly curiosity as to what is possible. In that vein, I'm thinking through the idea myself. I think there'd be considerable difficulties of replacing a 2wd tractor front end with an automotive axle. Many 4wd tractors have pivot points on the front axle that would be difficult to reproduce in a conversion. Automotive axle housings are sprung and designed to carry load toward the ends. I don't know if automotive axles would have the strength to support typical tractor front end loads (with a loader mounted) if axle housing was loaded toward the centre. Rigging steering seems like quite a chore.

Anyway, bunch of things to think about. A supplemental axle as in the combine example seems easier to do than a replacement front axle. What to drive the hydraulic motor with is another thing, and running it from the tractor pump probably wouldn't work very well. I suppose automotive or light-truck rear axles wouldn't be a great fit, but as I recall, if you want a real low-geared axle, than an old hearse is a good bet.

An alternative just popped into mind. I recently saw an old utility tractor sitting for sale along the highway (maybe a Ford N). The second time I noticed it I saw that it was fitted with tracks. That seems like pretty good way to get more traction from a 2wd. Snowmobile trail groomers often are converted farm tractors fitted with tracks. Although one is stored just down the highway, I've never looked closely enough to figure if 4wd is essential for it or how it steers.






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 11-01-2002, 09:32 Post: 44524
MRETHICS



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 750 4x4/MFWD conversion parting/parts... dumb idea?

Mud Hog is a brand name of fluid drive products owned by a company named Tuthill Ind. They have been around for many years and pioneered the rear wheel drive on combines described in a previous post.

The Mud Hog factory is located near our area.
Check this out http://www.mudhog.com/mudhog/mhdsm.htm

The Mud Hog system uses rolling lobe hydraulic motors to power the rear wheels of the combine. They have been in bussness for several years.

Hydraulic Front wheel drive has been around for several years. It was available on tractors as old as 4020's as a factory option. It has it's limitations.

On combines, if equiped with a hydrostatic trans, it's simple to install. Just plumb into the lines of the hydro pump, install the wheel motors and VIOLA! 4wd!. (This is somewhat oversimplified, but you get the idea) The Hydr trans is the secret to it's succes. Oil flows the path of least resistance so that eliminates a ratio problem. High draft on combines is improbable and in reality, non excistant. Combines pull nothing.

Now on a tractor, there is a different story. High draftin a tractor is eminent. In the early '80's MFGR's finaly gave up on hyd wheel motors for front axle drives. They are to inefficient to pull heavy loads. For an example, my father actually owned a JD 4630 with Hyd. FWD. When engageing the front axle, the Hyd. pump on the tractor used so much eng. hp. you had to drop at least 1 gear to pull the same load. Very in efficient. Now Mechanical FWD is the norm for tractors industry wide.

Back on the subject.

Changeing a 750 to a 755 is impractical. I'd recomend a trade of tractors, not parts.






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