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Wheel Weights or Everything About Air Compressors Oil vs Air based

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Larry
Join Date: Mar 2004
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1999-12-12          10956

I have a JD4100 with 410 loader. I have the ballast box attached filled with sand. The manual says that I need 6 rear wheel weights in addition to the ballast box, at least that is how I read it. I plan on using the loader to remove snow for the winter and thought that the rear wheel weights would be enough ballast without the ballast box. The ballast box extends beyond the 3 pt. and is not desireable for tight spaces. I asked the dealership about buying wheel weights and they said they are 60 pounds each, don't recommend more than two per axle, and cost $95 each! I think the dealer or the manual made a mistake about how many weights you need on each wheel or maybe they are talking about different size wheel weights. Even if I could afford it, I refuse to spend $400 or $600 for wheel weights. Does anyone know what the cost of having the tires filled with liquid would be? Will the constant weight of liquid filled tires cause lawn damage? With wheel weights I can install and uninstall them as needed but liquid filled tires are there year around.

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MichaelSnyder
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1999-12-13          10971

Larry,
I think the dealer misunderstood something. The manual does recommend 6 weights@60lbs a piece. I also think the quoted price was incorrect. I have 1 set installed 100% of the time. 1/2 our yard is one big hill, in which the weights add stability and actually lessen turf damage due to wheel spin. Kinda hard to believe considering we are only talking about 120lbs. I will also admit using the 410 loader without the rear ballast(also filled with sand), But only for carrying things like trimmed branches and such. This situation is where you really notice the extra 120lbs. Because I've also done this without em. If you look strictly at cost, I doubt you could justify cast weight vs liquid, on the other hand, you lose the ability to adjust the weight of your tractor. Personally, I'm not a fan of liquid in the tires. OMO, forget the idea of NOT using the ballast box. ....

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Scott
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1999-12-13          10977

Larry - I also have the 4100 with 410 loader. I use the JD ballast box with about 420 lbs. of weight in it; that plus the weight of the box brings it close to 500 lbs. So far that's been working good for me. I didn't go with the wheel weights because I mow with the tractor too and it's heavy enough already for that. So far I've moved around quite a bit of dirt and have had no problems with the ballast. Looking at the manual JD has, I too wonder if they made a mistake on the table that describes the needed balance because it seems excessive. HOWEVER, I'm a rookie at tractor ownership, so I'd like to hear some input on this issue of more experienced 4XXX owners. As for now, I'm just very cautious when using the loader. ....

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Larry
Join Date: Mar 2004
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1999-12-13          10981

Thanks MLS. Wouldn't 6 weights at 60 lbs each be 360 lbs? Maybe I missed understood what you were saying. In any event would you be kind enough to tell me how much you paid for your weights??? I don't like the idea of liquid filled tires either. ....

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Larry
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1999-12-13          10984

OOOOPPS! Sorry MLS, I did not read your first post right. Now I know what you were saying about the 120 lbs. Thanks to Scott for his post too. I would just use the ballast box but I think the wheel weights add to stability and IMHO using 6 of them should be more than adequate for a bucket full of snow on a 4100. ....

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MichaelSnyder
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1999-12-13          10992

Scott,
The manu'f recommendation for 6 wheel weights or liquid in the tires, PLUS (X) lbs of weight in the ballast box is most likely due to the fact that they must allow for "every" user, thus a certain % margin of safety is factored in. I personally cannot say that I've ever needed 6 weights, plus ballast, but I'm sure some guy, somewhere does...
Larry,
Gotta remember to check what I paid. I'll let you know. ....

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Greg
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1999-12-26          11461

I have owned a 4100 for 15 months with a 410 loader & really love it. The only
ballast I use is liquid in the tires, per my dealers suggestion after I griped
about price of ballast box and wheel weights. The tractor has been used to replace several tons of dirt and sand on a piece of waterfront property I own due to the hurricanes here in Eastern NC, granted when I really load the bucket it can get a little light in the rear, but for the most part it has worked fine. Please keep in mind that ground I use the tractor on is very level. I also use it to cut @ 2 acres of grass and the only time it has ever scuffed is in 4wd in a very tight turn. I have really enjoyed reading the info. on this site as this is the first real tractor I've owned personally.
Thanks guys, GH
....

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Scott S.
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1999-12-26          11463

Regards ballast vs. liquid-filled tires, for what it's worth, my 4100 recently had a rear-wheel flat (wish I knew why - couldn't find or duplicate problem) and I'm glad I didn't opt for the liquid filled tires. It would have complicated repair and made more of a mess, I would think. As it is, I had to jack the tractor up, remove the wheel and bring it to an garage to have it fixed. Needless to say, come Monday I'm getting a compressor of my very own! As to why it went flat in the first place, maybe someone out there can give some insight... ....

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bo
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1999-12-26          11466

Scott == did it ever occur to you to ask the garage that fixed it why it went flat? bo ....

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Scott S.
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1999-12-26          11469

Hi Bo - Yeah, I asked the garage guy that very question, of course. He had no clue. He looked the whole thing over carefully and found nothing out-of-sorts. He filled it and did a water check for leaks - nothing. I've reinstalled it and checked pressure since (one week and counting) - no problems. Prior to the flat, the tractor had not been used. Parked on flat ground. I'm in New Hampshire, so there's been some pretty large temperature fluctuations, with the low hitting about 5 deg. F. All opinions welcome...Scott ....

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bo
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1999-12-26          11471

scott- rim leak-barring nails, thorns which would be obvious, the only other two would be scrader valve or rim-bet on rim, garage dude pulled it and cleaned the rim and reset it. In future, pump up tire with your new compressor which you will buy {and it won't be oiless} Mix up a little dish soap with water put into a spray bottle and spray mixture on the bead part of the rim and look for cute little bubbles. You probably can't fix a rim leak cause you can't pull off a tire that size unless you are built like arnold schwarzenegger and have a huge 20lbs sledge and monster tire spoons. Best you can do with a rim leak is to wang at it with a 3lb hammer and hope you can set it. Or--get yourself some good quality stop leak and fill the tire with it and hope. Either way, it is fixed and with luck problem solved. Oh, if you don't have tubes and get a flat don't hesitate to plug them yourself. Find the culprit with your handy little soapy water spray bottle, run to your local wally mart and buy tire plug kit and follow instructions. Buy an extra can of rubber cement and be liberal. With practice you should be able to fix a flat in about 10 minutes without pulling the wheel off the machine. Pretty basic stuff. bo ....

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Wheel Weights or Everything About Air Compressors Oil vs Air based

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bo
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1999-12-26          11473

Scott- p.s. forget contours of ground and temperature, got nothing to do with the flat. If a tire is mounted on a clean rim and seals well, it could be -20 and it still wouldn't go flat. If it did you would be bringing all 4 to the garage. bo ....

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Wheel Weights or Everything About Air Compressors Oil vs Air based

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FRED G.
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1999-12-26          11474

LARRY,
I HAVE A KUBOTA 2710 THAT I PUT WHEEL WEIGHTS ON. THEY ARE 25 LB. WEIGHTS USED FOR WEIGHT LIFTING@$11.65 EA. THEY ALSO SELL 50 LB'S. A PLATE WAS MADE FOR THE INSIDE OF THE WHEEL WITH A 1" THREADED ROD IN THE CENTER. I TAKE THE LUG NUTS OFF, PUT THE PLATE OVER THE STUDS, PUT THE LUG NUTS BACK ON. THE WEIGHTS SLIDE OVER THE THREADED ROD AND TIGHTENED DOWN WITH A NUT ON THE END OF THE ROD. I PUT 200# ON EACH SIDE. WORKS NICE. CAN BE TAKEN OF IN ABOUT 30 SEC. JUST PUT A GOOD COAT OF PAINT ON THE WEIGHTS, AS THEY WILL RUST.
FRED ....

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Wheel Weights or Everything About Air Compressors Oil vs Air based

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Scott S.
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1999-12-27          11490

Bo - Thanks for the input. So far, so good on the tire holding pressure. But now you have me curious...why shouldn't my (soon to be purchased) compressor be "oil-less?" Many I've seen advertise this as a selling feature. ....

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Steve in Buffalo
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1999-12-27          11494

Oil-less compressors are fine for the casual user and it is a selling point because you don't have to check the oil. Better compressors have an oiling system similar to a lawnmower engine (splash oiling?) that lubricates the cylinder and crank and this sort will last a heck of a lot longer and under heavier use. Seems to me that oil-less compressors turn faster and are a heck of a lot louder too. ....

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bo
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1999-12-27          11498

Scott- Steve in Buffalo--miami of the north-gotta find out were that boy lives, I'm from the area too. Well, anyhow, I guess I got pretty pushy when I slipped that in. Oh, yeh as I was saying, Steve did a pretty good job of explaining. What it boils down too is longitivity and durability. 30 years from now when your son inherets your oil compressor, he'll appreciate it. The few extra bucks mean nothing 10 years from now. It'll be a minimum of three hp. and 20 gal air tank. You get it right away, You ain't gonna beleive how many things you'll find to use compressed air on. If I was setting up any kind of shop or the occassional repair,a good quality compressor would be the first thing I buy. Bo ....

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Bird Senter
Join Date: Jun 1999
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1999-12-27          11500

Scott S, Steve pretty well answered you question about the oil-less compressors. I have a small sideline business of repairing/rebuilding mechanics' air tools, and I discussed this matter at length in the past, but don't know how to find that thread now. As one factory service rep told me, "If you figure on 10,000 hours with a 'real' compressor, figure 1,000 on the oil-less." I tried an oil-less myself, and in almost daily use, it had to be rebuilt every 6 to 8 months (the only good thing about them is that you can completely rebuild one in less than an hour for $40 to $70 worth of parts). The manual will probably tell you to never run it more than 20 minutes continuously. If you do, I think I can guarantee you need to keep a rebuild kit on hand. As Steve said, for the occasional, casual user, it'll do, but if you want one that will last, get a cast iron (not aluminum) cylinder with a deep crankcase. ....

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bo
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1999-12-27          11502

Scott- another ps. get a different garage guy to fix your flats. Anyone can't tell me why it went flat I would worry about. Tires just don't go flat for the fun of it. If he just pressurized the heck out of it and seated the bead and did't clean the rim, over time the tire will leak down and the problem repeats.bo ....

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bo
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1999-12-27          11505

Scott-a heads up. when you buy your compressor and it calls for a 20 amp fuse or what ever and you keep it in the cold, expect it to pop a circuit breaker every now and then. Most home and garage circuits are fused at 15 and 20 amps and a compressor ,depend on what you get, will, on start up suck a lot of juice and being new with every thing tight you probably gonna pop circuit breakers, especially in the cold when all the compressor parts contract. After some use, things will loosen up and you won't have the problem. None of this applies if yours will draw 15amps and you put on a 20amp and keep it in a heated garage. bo ....

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Wheel Weights or Everything About Air Compressors Oil vs Air based

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Scott S.
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1999-12-27          11514

Thanks, guys, for the info on compressors. I would have gone out and bought the wrong kind. Now I know what to look for. My only remaining problem is my significant other can't fathom what the heck I need a compressor for. I explained as best I could. I thinks it's one of those things that, once you get one, you can't imagine how you got along without it. Just like my tractor!!! ....

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Jack in IL
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1999-12-27          11517

I have always found it easier to ask forgivness than to ask permission. If you need an air compressor then simply get it. You don't have to announce it--just use it for the impact wrench and socket set, die grinders, inflator, and all those other ESSEMTIAL tools that go with owning a tractor that you will also need to purchase. I haven't lost too much skin on my head so far (even though I am somewhat balding) and you probably won't either. ....

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bo
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1999-12-27          11518

scott- get your self a bunch of red bows and every time you buy a tool, put one on it and give it to her and tell her you are being spontaeneous and thoughtful. when she objects to your choice of gifts, cast your eyes down,look sorrowful and heart broken and mumble something about how you thought she would like it. bo ....

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Scott S.
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1999-12-27          11520

Bo - Loved your suggestion for "gift-giving." I think I'll also kick the ground a little with my foot and mutter a few "aw-shucks Sweetie, I really thought you'd like this one..." when I do it. Worked for the tractor. ....

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RobertN
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1999-12-29          11599

A couple of thoughts on compressers...
Get one that works on 220v. It's a pain when you blow a 120v-15a breaker every time you run the thing. Most garages have wimpy wiring, unless you've made improvements. No matter what you get, don't mess with extension cords, it's a good way to ruin a motor. Get plenty of hose! Remember you can get gas motor driven compressors too. Bird Senter made some good points about oil free vs cast oiled machines.

For justification, you can air up the kids bike tires, blow off the driveway, blow off the deck, air the tires on car, truck, tractor, boat trailer, use impact wrench, spray gun, blow the dog hair ball out of the vacuum, run air sander, and more! ....

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Mark A. Holt
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2000-02-04          12515

I liked the gift giving idea. My wife came home after work to find a JD 855 in the back yard. Well, my come back when she was up set that I bought without the permission slip was "I was not trying to hide this big green thing from you." Probably not great line but it kept me from totaly being way out on the limb. Just sorta out there without much support. If there is such a thing it was money that was set aside as it were...

Buy the way, comment about water in the tires. I also have a Massey Fergason 35 that I water and 100 lb (they are at least 100 lbs) weight on the front with some water in the rear (only have two wheel drive). The weights help kept the front down so I can steer. The weight in the front really increased stability. The 855 having the loader on the front keeps it more stable and when riping or pulling loads in the scraper box I balast the front with dirt in the bucket which keeps the tires from spinning so.

Mark Holt in Salinas Calif.

markh@dedot.com ....

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Ron Brauer
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2000-02-06          12560


For what it is worth, I have a 750 which I put chloride in the rear tires.
After about a year the chloride ate up the valve cores. I replaced the stems
and cores and after another year they were leaking again. I bought 4 old JD
wheel weights (150 Lbs ea.) for $15 each, drilled them to fit the weight hole
pattern on the 750 and put a weight on the inside and outside of each rear
wheel. The outside weights do not extend beyond the rear tire, so I still have
my same clearance and don't have to mess with the chloride. I have found that
the weight is ample for using the loader. ....

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