Chronic gel problems: Diesel Fuel Lubrication Engine Additives  -- Tractor Maintenance Discussion Forum and Review Chronic gel problems: Diesel Fuel Lubrication Engine Additives -- Tractor Maintenance Discussion Forum

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 12-26-2013, 16:17 Post: 188530
gulogulo



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 Chronic gel problems

Hey Tractor Gurus,
Please help! My fairly new JD 5083E (new to me as of August) has gelled up 5 times in the last 3 weeks, and I need it daily for feeding out hay. Each time it's been cold the night before, but only one time was it REALLY cold (-15 F). It'll start right up with the block heater, but then after 5 minutes it sputters, gets no power, coughs black smoke and stalls out. Once I limp it into the heated shop (stalling many times along the way) and let it thaw for a few hours, it's fine again. The tractor lives in a pole barn, three-sided. I'd move it into the shop permanently but that's where the diesel truck lives.
I feel like I've tried just about everything. Changed both fuel filters multiple times, drained all the fuel out of the tractor's tank to make sure I didn't have any ice lurking in there, paste-tasted the diesel in my site tank (no water detected), added 50 gallons of kerosene to the site tank (it was year-old summer diesel in there), bought brand-new fuel from a gas station (which caused it to run a little more reliably, but still gelled up when it was -15), etc. Each time I fill-up, I pump and discard the first 5 gallons to come out of my site tank in case there's water. The fuel in the tractor tank has always been treated with plenty of Cetane Boost "Arctic Formula," and the 911 when I'm trying to thaw it. Doesn't seem to make a difference.
One strange thing is that when I drained all the fuel from the tractor tank, the LAST quart or so to come out was crystal clear. Shouldn't it have been the first thing to come out?
Tractor lived briefly in Florida before I got it. Could I have water lurking in my lines or in some weird compartment of my fuel tank that hasn't found its way out yet? Or wouldn't I have burned through that many months ago?
Or could the water and diesel in my site tank be emulsified, so the water isn't settling to the bottom? Fuel supplier has offered to test the fuel but that'll take another week.
I've been reading threads here about using a demulsification additive, or installing a heated filter?
Thinking of asking the dealer to do a full flush of the fuel lines and remove/clean the tank thoroughly. Not sure what else to do.
Much obliged for any wisdom and advice.
Thanks.






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 12-26-2013, 17:13 Post: 188531
46bugs

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 Chronic gel problems

I was having the same problem with jelling .I went to O'reilly and they told me to get a quart of 911 that will fix 100 Gallon of fuel. I used enough for 60 gallon in an 18 gallon tank ,let it set several days and then it started.Also change the fuel filters 3 or 4 times a year.

The fuel today is NO GOOD






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 12-26-2013, 18:16 Post: 188532
harvey

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 Chronic gel problems

We typically treat our commercial fuel 60-40. the 40 being straight kerosene. Your fuel treatments with provide the lube the injectors and pump needs. Personally I have no problem blending 50-50 if I'm not working the tractor at full power warmer weather.






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 12-26-2013, 22:22 Post: 188534
hardwood

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 Chronic gel problems

I don't know if your normal winter lows are colder than eastern Iowa. I always treated the fuel with Power Service, the white jug stuff, at about twice the recommended dose.
This was for my Deere 4310 and never had it jell up in ten or more winters. The tractor was always inside, but never in a heated shed. Whether this is true or not, I don't know, but I was always told that unless you blended fuel and added Power Service when the fuel was reasonably warm it wouldn't mix. The jury is out on that one.

Frank.






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 12-26-2013, 23:40 Post: 188536
candoarms

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 Chronic gel problems

I use a #1 diesel in my truck and tractor during the winter months, along with Power Service Fuel Supplement. Never any trouble with gelling. My tractor starts and runs every time, even at -40 F. (I don't like starting any engine at those temps, but once in a while I simply have to.)

My tractor sits in a shed, but the shed isn't heated. We've had temps in the -25 range here for the month of December and I've been able to clear the snow without a problem.

Number 2 diesel will begin to form waxes on the filter at about 10 degrees above zero. At about 0 degrees #2 diesel begins to gel. Adding kerosene will drop the gel point considerably, but kerosene is EXPENSIVE. Power Service Diesel Fuel Supplement will take care of the problem for about 1/20th of the price of kerosene.

Hope this helps.

Joel






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 12-27-2013, 08:15 Post: 188537
greg_g

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 Chronic gel problems

My 3720 has a psuedo water separator in addition to the fuel filter. I don't get as cold here as Vermont, but it's never yet gelled. That said, I don't know the fuel path in the 5083. Does it by chance have both as well? If yes, you may have an issue with your separator.

//greg//






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 12-29-2013, 09:24 Post: 188545
Murf

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 Chronic gel problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by gulogulo | view 188530
Hey Tractor Gurus,Please help! My fairly new JD 5083E (new to me as of August) has gelled up 5 times in the last 3 weeks, and I need it daily for feeding out hay. Each time it's been cold the night before, but only one time was it REALLY cold (-15 F). It'll start right up with the block heater, but then after 5 minutes it sputters, gets no power, coughs black smoke and stalls out. Once I limp it into the heated shop (stalling many times along the way) and let it thaw for a few hours, it's fine again.



That doesn't sound like fuel gelling at all to me.

Gelled fuel starves the engine of fuel because the filter's clogged. You're getting black smoke, that's too much fuel.

I'll bet if you take apart your air filter you'll find that either the filter element is clogged with ice or dirt or the air filter housing / piping / intake itself is iced up.

Our machines get that all the time when working in the winter.


Best of luck.






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 12-29-2013, 20:11 Post: 188552
gulogulo



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 Chronic gel problems

Thanks everyone. I really appreciate you weighing in. My best guess after running a bunch more tests is that it is the summer fuel after all, not so much a water problem. Didn't add nearly enough kerosene to thin it, and the Power Service Cetane Boost couldn't effectively combat the high waxing temperature (30 degrees F, I'm told) of the summer diesel. I kept looking for the water -- I think it was a red herring.






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 12-29-2013, 20:24 Post: 188553
Murf

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 Chronic gel problems

The summer fuel, a lack of kerosene and additives aside, wouldn't cause black smoke.

The only thing that can cause black smoke is a very rich fuel mixture, so rich that the fuel can't even fully burn.

Untreated fuel would cause an overly lean mixture, not overly rich.


Best of luck.






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Discussion Boards > Active Subjects > Messages as Posted > Diesel Fuel Lubrication Engine Additives Forum

Thread 188530 Filter by Poster:
46bugs 1 | candoarms 1 | greg_g 1 | gulogulo 2 | hardwood 1 | harvey 1 | Murf 2 |




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