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Log skidding attatchment

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Hillbilly
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 0 hills
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2001-09-05          31596

Last year I believe. described an attatchment they had made for skidding logs they could back up to a log and hook up to it without getting off the tractor and lift up with 3pt and put a little weight on the back wheels and drive away. Any one know or remember what I am talking about?

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2001-09-05          31602

Hillbilly, there are also commercially available versions of this implement. I don't recall the manufacturer(s) right now, but will post them when the come to me. While I have built several sets (each one different, and hopefully better than the previous) the concept is rather simple. I will try to describe it in less than a thesis-sized post. It is usually a large set of "tongs" (picture log-skidding tongs, or large ice-tongs if you're old enough) which hang from a boom pole on the 3pth, but are PULLED by the drawbar. This is essential to prevent a roll-over if the log snags on something. The tongs are opened & (held) closed by means of a single hydraulic cylinder which connects the two tong jaws (through some levers) to the hanging frame. It can be designed in many ways, depending on size and power required, and of course capacity of the tractor on which it will be mounted. Let me know if you need more details, I'm always willing to share my twisted ideas. Best of luck & happy pondering. ....

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Anthony M. Parente
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2001-09-05          31606

Hi Murph,
How about a photo of your unit?
Do you use a loader grapple? If yes, what brand?
Tony,

BTW: Where are you going to spend this winter? Aruba? ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2001-09-06          31619

Tony, in order of your comments, 1) let me rummage around in the back of the hard-drive and see if there is any pictures around, 2)Loader grapple, yes, it is a 1995 Murphy...LOL, 3)I know winter is coming, but it's already 76 degrees here (Nassau, Bahamas) and its only 9:30am... I can't really see any reason to go 'home' even after the job here is done. All the best. ....

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kay
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2001-09-06          31634

Hillbilly, I have a rig that is an upside down U, that pin connects to the 3pt (lift arms, and top arm) that has a big hook at the top center. The frame is made of 3" angle iron, and I drop a set of logging tongs on the hook. Back up to the end of a log, drop the 3pt, (if everything goes right, the frame and the tongs will slip over the log), lift the 3pt (the log tongs set) and take off with one end of the log in the air, and the other end dragging. Now as sometimes happens, the log will twist and roll, or you make a turn and the tongs come off. If I think it is not a good hook-up, I lift the log, get off and throw a log chain around it, and fasten that to the big hook. Then just use the tongs to get the log up in the air for easier chain work. Usually the log weight at the end is enough to give great traction and if nothing on the front for weight, can lift the wheels off the ground. Then you need to keep in touch with the 3pt lever to lower the log if the tractor front end comes up. With the FEL or plow on the front, it rarely gets too far off the ground. That is when you want to be able to steer with the individual brakes (which is not possible on some tractors). I carry at least two sets of log chains on the logging arch, and can bundle several logs together if small enough. I've pulled 8', 26" diameter white oak logs up a hill to get them out of the woods using this technique. ....

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BillMullens
Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 649 Central West Virginia
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2001-08-07          31645

This is an interesting thread. Murf, I'm anxiously waiting for links to manufacturers or pics of your devices. Kay, how high can the log be in relation to the tractor? Or does it pretty much have to be sitting on the ground? I'm skidding logs off of a pile; the best I've come up with is to pull it off of the pile, then back up and chain the log to the 3ph drawbar so that I can lift the front of the logs a little while skidding.
Thanks. ....

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kay
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2001-09-07          31647

Bill. On the ground. The hook is at the top of the arch, which is about the conventional top arm point of the 3pt attachments. Working logs off the top of a pile is pretty touchy stuff, unless you can lift them (which I am sure you know without me saying it). This thing I have looks very much like the quick tach 3pt arrangements with the hook at the top. It just lacks the locking hooks at the bottom to engage the lower pins. Hoping this description helps. ....

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Randy
Join Date: Feb 2002
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2001-09-07          31652

I built a log carrying device over 16 years ago for about $60.00 plus the cost of a good hand winch which was another $60.00 or so. I can and have used this unit behind anything that has a trailer hitch. I can transport a 30" diameter by 12 foot long log completely off the ground.

It is made mostly from 2" square steel tubing. I made a flat bottomed U with splayed legs inverted it and reenforced the corners with some plate stock. The U is about 36" wide at the bottom, the legs are about 48" apart at the other end, and around 36" long. The splindles came from the front of a 1980 AMC car, back when the rotor and hub assembly were one piece. The rotor would be worn out but the bearings and hub were still good. Four bolt removed the splindle from the car.

I welded a plate to a short piece of tubing horzontially attached to the leg of each side of the U, turned it up side down and then bolted the spindles to each side and added some 15" wheels. At the center of the U there is welded a 7' piece of sq.tubing which steps down 18" or so to a trailer coupler attached to a horizontal piece of tubing. Corner reenforcements and two 1/2" diameter rods from the tow pole back to the legs near the wheels add strength to the whole thing.

Along the rail in the front and along the U at the back are pieces of steel plate with slots cut in them so I can drop a chain link into them which go under the log to hold it off the ground. At the back end I attached a boat style hand winch. This will pull the log to the trailer and then positioned somewhere near the middle of the log lifts the log off the ground so the chains that hold the log up can be slipped under it.

I have pulled this behind my car when transporting logs from one place to another, or behind the tractor when going across the lawn or in the woods. Years ago the Mother Earth News magazine had a picture of one of something like this, it looked neat so I built one. I even used it once to drag a telephone pole home. You do have to get off the tractor to use it however. ....

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Hillbilly
Join Date: Jul 2004
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2001-09-07          31654

Can any of you men post any pictures? Sounds like there are some good ideas here....... ....

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kay
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2001-09-07          31656

I will try to link you to the landpride quickhitch, which is very much like my homemade hitch. Use the big hook at the top for the ring on the logging tongs. ....


Link:   hitch

 
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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2001-09-07          31658

I want to most STRENUOUSLY point out that at NO TIME should ANYTHING of any weight be dragged an implement connected to the 3pth of a tractor, unless there is some sort of safety device involved. The load being dragged, MUST for safety reasons, be pulled by a point on the tractor located BELOW the center line of the rear axle. Failure to follow this procedure WILL result in the lifting of the front wheels upon excessive load resistance being met. Not to pick on Kay, but see the comment about "...Then you need to keep in touch with the 3pt lever to lower the log if the tractor front end comes up. With the FEL or plow on the front, it rarely gets too far off the ground. That is when you want to be able to steer with the individual brakes...", in an extreme situation this is called a roll-over, the leading cause of operator death. There is a reason manufacturers design drawbars into equipment. It is where they DESIGNED the machine to draw loads from. Sorry for the ranting, but in this day and age we should be teaching each other the RIGHT way to do things, not just the way we have GOTTEN AWAY with doing it. Remember, there is no known cure for dead. Best of luck. ....

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Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2001-09-07          31659

Murf as always you bring up some good safety points as to proper three point hitch useage. Hats off to you! ....

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kay
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2001-09-07          31665

Murf. I don't mind the heat. The log, once it is lifted by the 3 pt arrangement I described (per the request of Hillbilly), can be secured to the drawbar with a chain just like the arrangement you described to Hillbilly. With my arrangement, it probably takes more skill than the neophytes have that jump on tractors nowadays. Its not as dangerous as flying a plane, but then one has to have a pilots license to fly one (didn't help Kennedy). Very definetly works great for pulling logs out of the woods. Your arrangement with the long pole has to be more difficult to manuever around in the woods. I like the arrangement described that has the wheeled yoke that lifts the entire log. It is tough to get around other trees and things in the woods though. On the good trails and roads, it would work great. My neighbor logged pine 1.5 miles out using his 10 HP garden tractor and an arrangement like this. It is like a technique used a hundred years ago to get large logs out with horses and oxen. They used huge wood wheels in those days. Keep cool and safe. ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2001-09-09          31689

I seem to recall that 'Stumper' (who stopped posting about a year ago) described a logging arch. I can't remember the description exactly, but I think the arch has its own wheels to support the load. I can't remember if the arch was entirely freestanding and towed by the tractor drawbar or if it was 3ph mounted and used the top-link to keep it upright. Anyway, it seemed like a pretty good idea (like most of Stumper's comments) and one not likely to tip the tractor on its bum. ....

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Randy
Join Date: Feb 2002
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2001-09-10          31718

My first experience driving a tractor was helping a friend gather fire wood. He had an old Massey-Harris tricycle front end tractor with a 6'X 8' 2 wheel trailer behind . We were cutting wood across a stream which was not that wide but had a fairly steep exit. I was warned to watch the front end of the tractor as it started up the bank out of the stream because the weight of the trailer as it came down the approach into the stream would transfer all it's weight to the draw bar. Sure enough when you got to this point if you gave it too much throttle the tractor would rotate of the back wheels. My friend had a tractor turn over backwards on him and pin him to the ground when he was younger. There was no cap on the radiator, his father was right there and crawled over his son so the hot water went on his back not in his son.

Many years later when I bought my frist tractor and used it primarly for fire wood gathering and some light logging this early experience put a level of fear into me. The logging arch I built keep most of the log's weight on the wheels of the acrh. The Farmi winch it is connected to is designed to pull logs from a point below the drawbar height. The winch I have is 18 years old, it has two legs in line with the rear wheels which are only 8" or so off the ground as I drive along. I have never had the front end even hint at coming of the ground, or had to use the brakes to steer the tractor.

As far as getting through the woods, anywhere I drove the tractor the log trailer followed. I am not in favor of pulling any weight from a 3PH device that is not designed for that purpose. I have seen some homemade booms made for picking up and transporting objects with the 3PH that look like an accident waiting to happen.

....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2001-09-10          31720

I appreciate Randy's and Murf's insights. I made some very indirect safety comments about a similar comment quite awhile back. However, I'm more theory that is acquiring experience than experience that may or may not be acquiring theory. I seldom feel it’s appropriate for me to speak so directly, but these are stories that should be heard. I do have the advantage of being maybe the first kid on either side on my family to have grown up in a city rather than on a farm. So, I'm aware that most of my uncles and their friends retired from farming following serious tractor accidents. Entire careers of doing what you see done and what everybody else did--and it worked. Except that some practices were basically unsound, and the accidents eventually happened. There were fortunately no loss of life or limb among my uncles, but still serious accidents. I think it's important that theory and experience converge for most people, and it's almost essential for people who come to tractoring fairly late in life. This Board is pretty good at helping the convergence. ....

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Randy
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2001-09-10          31722

Related to the subject of safety. A close friend of mind had an accident doing something I and many others probably have done before without giving a second thought. While working in the woods clearing a section of his land he cut a smaller diameter trees, 8" or so, then used his Ford 1510 with a FEL to push the trees out of the way. This time coming in from the side he pushed against the upper portion of the tree. A branch caught on something causing the tree top to bend and roll. The branch he was pushing against slipped off the bucket and followed the loader arm aiming it right at his head.

The blow from this hit broke several bones in his face and fractured his skull and knocked him out. He was working alone a little distance from his house, some how he made back to his home where his wife was. After several days in the hospital and many stiches he came home, but there was a posibility of brain damage.

The story had a happy ending, he turned out to have only a few scars that show on his face. I can tell you one thing, the next time I went to push a tree with the FEL on my tractor I thought twice about what could happen. ....

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Anthony M. Parente
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2001-09-10          31725

That is the exact reason why all industrial forestry equipment have a cage with wire mesh surrounding the operator. There are cages made for Ag tractors. Maybe someone has a link.
Tony,

....

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AndyMA
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 0 NE Conn
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2001-09-11          31772

Take a look at this Farmi skidding winch. I just upgraded to a larger version and find it to be a very easy to use and safe product. (Just don't stand in the way of the cable it it snaps)

http://www.northeastimplement.com/newpage5.htm ....


Link:   Farmi Skidding Winch

 
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david godollei
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2001-09-14          31807

Check out these links.
http://www.novajack.com/english/html/skidding_arch.html
http://www.norwoodindustries.com/skidmate.htm
This one's a little big...
http://www.jonwest-horselogging.co.uk/bigwheels.htm
One thing I heard mentioned is that if you get a really big log going down hill with a small machine, can that machine stop it? I really appreciate the safety aspect of this board. ....

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