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 | boatman
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 49 Idaho 
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2003-08-26 62722
I am considering purchasing a NH756C or a NH757C backhoe for my NH TC30(they are both recommended by NH for this application).
I have no specific use for the hoe but I have had occasions where it would have been very useful.
The link below shows specifications.
I know there are a lot of you that have hoes and I would like some opinions from others before purchasing. Thanks.
Link:
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 | AC5ZO
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 928 Rio Rancho, NM 87144 
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2003-08-26 62723
I have a 758C on a TC45 and I like it.
I don't exactly understand why they separate out the TC30 for the 757C and 758C. I thought that the TC33 would handle anything that you could use on a TC30.
The 758C uses a subframe and I recommend that you get a model that uses a similar mounting. I expect that the 756 and 757 both use subframes. After that it pretty much comes down to what you need it for. If you are going to be digging the occasional hole and perhaps a trench about 3' deep for a water line, the 756C will work. Larger BackHoes allow you to dig longer sections of trench and larger foundation holes without moving as often.
Backhoes don't dig very well at maximum depth, but you have to think about how much you are going to use it and what it is worth to you. It is certainly a handy tool to have around. ....
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| TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley 
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2003-08-27 62755
A regular hoe is a pretty expensive thing to have just because it may be handy. If money is no particular object then why not?
3ph hoes are less expensive and may be appropriate to an idea of occasional light use. There is a bunch of discussion in the archives about stress on the tractor frame from 3ph hoes and possible serious damage to the tractor. My hoe is a 3ph type. I've had it for five years without problems. My use has been occasional and light after the first year but it's good to inform yourself about the stress issues before thinking seriously about a 3ph hoe.
AC's comment about digging depth and moving is good to note. Most hoe's rated digging depths are for 2' bottoms. To get max depth, the boom and stick have to be pretty much straight down from the tractor and then you get 2' of trench at best before having to move the tractor. Moving a tractor every 2' of trench ends up taking a lot of time. In addition, digging trenches at max depth is one thing but digging deep shallow excavations is another. You don't want the tractor close to a deep excavation wall because walls collapse. The only way to dig close to max depth is to dig close to the tractor or to terrace the excavation walls.
I find that 5' is about the max practical digging depth for my 6' hoe and I'm a lot happier with 4' depths. It might be good to scan building and electrical codes in your area to see how deep a hoe may have to dig and then get one a bit larger than those depths.
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| AC5ZO
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 928 Rio Rancho, NM 87144
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2003-08-27 62764
I had just a couple of follow-up points...
There is a kind of soil here called colichi. It is a very hard compacted hardpan that is impervious to water and most other things. If you have to dig in that stuff, you have to use picks and hammers or a backhoe. When I was in my 20s and 30s, I would dig this kind of stuff by hand, but not anymore. A backhoe punches right through it. It breaks up into large rocklike sheets and I often use the backhoe bucket to cradle a chunk that may weigh 200 pounds. I think you probably get the picture. So, I use the backhoe for ANY digging.
The NH units are well built, in my opinion. To recap on subframes, they bolt under the tractor and bridge the section between the motor mounts and the drawbar mount. With 3PH mounted hoes, there has been some experience where they were heavily used or abused and they tended to accelerate the wear of the top link mount, and if used with such force as to move the tractor rear end around, they may even cause the tractor frame to break at about the transmission. A subframe bridges any potential or real weakness at the transmission and eliminates the forces on the top link.
On my 758C, the subframe requires the removal of the swinging drawbar, as the subframe mounts to that point. If you use drawbar pulled draft implements like a wheel mounted plow, this may be a problem for you. Most modern implements mount to the 3PH and so this was not a problem for me. For drawbar work, I use a heavy duty CAT 1 drawbar that mounts to the 3PH arms. This works well for me.
As far a buckets are concerned, I use a 12". I like this because I can stand and work in the bottom of any trench that I dig. You might dig faster with a larger bucket, but you also put more load on the hoe. Smaller buckets work, but you might not be able to work in the trench. With a 12" bucket, you just take out about twice as many scoops as you would with a 15"/16" range bucket.
I have easily put in fifty to seventy feet of waterline trench in a day with my 758C in this hard rocky desert soil. I could not do this in a week without a backhoe.
A backhoe is an expensive tool for a homeowner, but so is a tractor. Part of the cost of the backhoe is offset by my comfort in not breaking my back doing this sort of manual labor. I would buy my TC45 and 758C backhoe over again in a second, so I don't regret the decision or expense. When I did not have a tractor or backhoe, I found work-arounds, but those were always slower and required a lot more work.
There is another benefit to owning a backhoe. You can use it when you need it. If you rent a backhoe, you are paying for it when it is in your custody. You may feel rushed to do a job to get the machine back to the owner. If you have your own hoe, it is entirely practical to do a job that may take an hour, but where it would take half a day to go rent a backhoe, do the job and get it back. You can also do what you need to do at your own pace and you can pause if you need to get a special plumbing fitting or other part.
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 | jeff r
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 428 burton. michigan
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2003-08-29 62862
AC5ZO,
50 to 70 feet of waterline line trench in a day???? Since a waterline trench in your area only needs to go 24 inches, this colachi stuff must be tough stuff or you take a alot of breaks during the day?? LMAO
Jeff ....
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 | kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2003-08-29 62867
Colichi is like concrete. When I landscaped my house in Arizona I hated life working in 110 degrees with a pick and a shovel breaking that stuff up. Yech. ....
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| AC5ZO
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 928 Rio Rancho, NM 87144
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2003-09-02 63080
Adobe bricks that are used for houses around here are made of pretty much the same soil. It is almost as hard as concrete when compacted and baked in our desert sun.
Jeff, you are welcome to come to my house and see if you can do better. I have a few hundred feet of trench to put in next month. Let me know what day works best for you. ....
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| SteveInMD
Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 16 Brookeville, MD
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2003-09-03 63153
A few weeks ago I got a Woods 7500 for my TC33D. I didn't have a specific use in mind when I got it, but now it one the implements I use most. Attaching it isn't difficult at all.
Here are the specs. - http://www.woodsonline.com click Construction, then Backhoes, then 78-90" digging depth.
I paid $5,309. You can probably do a little better. I'm more of a "Buy it now!" impluse guy than a shop-around guy. ....
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| Millstone
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 17 Henderson, KY
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2003-09-03 63156
How much the Woods unit cost? Does it have a subframe? What size buckets did you get? ....
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| SteveInMD
Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 16 Brookeville, MD
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2003-09-04 63228
Re: How much the Woods unit cost? - $5,309
Re: Does it have a subframe? - Nope. I guess some people say you need one. The dealer said people screw up their tractors by digging without putting the stabilizers down.
Re: What size buckets did you get? - Just one so far, a 16 inch
Here's another thread on them... http://tractorpoint.com/cgi-bin/tractor/fullThread.pl?parentnum=58119&catcode=BH&catname=Back%20Hoe ....
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| jeff r
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 428 burton. michigan
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2003-09-04 63232
SteveMD,
Do yourself a BIG favor and spend the money to get that tractor a subframe for the Wood's backhoe. You won't be sorry. The 16 and 12 inch buckets are an excellent choice, you did good on that choice.
Jeffr ....
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| SteveInMD
Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 16 Brookeville, MD
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2003-09-05 63246
I agree it's probably a good idea to get a subframe. How do they work? The frame mounts to the tractor and then the backhoe mounts to the subframe and not the lower links? Do you have to remove the frame to attach other implements? ....
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| AC5ZO
Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 928 Rio Rancho, NM 87144
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2003-09-05 63247
Subframes have been described earlier in this thread and others. They attach to the underside of the tractor near the rear axle and bridge forward on the tractor. They can attach at various points and my require removal of the swinging drawbar on some tractors.
The backhoe then attaches to the subframe rather than the 3PH. This is a fixed Heavy Duty mount that also strengthens the tractor frame.
In most cases, you do not have to remove the subframe to attach other implements or use the 3PH as long as the backhoe is not mounted.
I have a NH tractor and the 3PH lower arms are left in place on my tractor when I mount the backhoe to my subframe. Other tractors and backhoe manufacturers may require you to remove the lower 3PH arms. (not a big job) ....
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| DK35vince
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 689 Western,Pa. 
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2003-09-05 63267
I recently purchased a Rhino 85 backhoe , with subframe and 18" bucket for $5200.
Seemed like an excellant price and works real nice.
The draw bar and lower link arms are left on when the backhoe is installed.
Goes on and off tractor in minutes.
The subframe detaches and comes off with the backhoe which works out OK but does take up more storage space.
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