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Hydrostatic vs 12 x 12 SSS tran

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OldForge
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2000-12-20          22659

I am interested in buying a TC40 or 45 and I am not sure if I should go with a hydro or sss tran. My activities would include: mowing fields, loader work, plant clover (not sure if I would bale), pull trees out of my woods, and my property has steep sidehills. Please advise. Thanks for your time.

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Bird Senter
Join Date: Jun 1999
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2000-12-20          22662

OldForge, once again you're talking personal preference to some extent, and I know there are those who will disagree, but in my opinion, the hydrostatic transmission is faster, easier, safer, etc. I'm spoiled; I'm simply would not even consider a compact tractor without the hydrostatic. ....

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mbjacobs
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2000-12-20          22668

I have to second Bird's opinion. When I was buying my Kubota I had decided on the gear transmission but my wife wanted the hydro, guess what we got. The first time I used the loader I realized how lucky I was. I didn't realize how often I was going to change directions or need to move 2 inches. GET THE HYDRO! ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2000-12-21          22676

Well, I have gears. It was the right used tractor at the right time and price for me. It still is the right tractor, but HST definitely has advantages. I'm not sure if the somewhat higher PTO HP and lower costs of gears are adequate compensations. However, the selection of used compacts was about zip at the time, and I didn't have much choice. I do like my tractor though.

Here's a couple of thoughts. Somebody commented that certain ag operations require running calibrated ground speeds (Some type of planting was the example used). With my gears, I know what my ground speed is. There is a speed/gear chart built into the tachometer dial. I'm not sure how this issue is managed with HST's. Of course, I don't do those types of ag operations, so that advantage of gears is lost on me. The other thought is that my transmission gives me four reverse gears. The four reverse gears gives adequate ground speed control when I have to run in reverse at PTO RPM (with my snowblower). A transmission with only two reverse gears would be very restricting. ....

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Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2000-12-21          22690

This is funny to answer this but one of my customers that lives or has a camp in Old Forge NY told me a major plus of a hydro is it has a deadman petal on the hydro that he like's. When you lift the foot off the petal it all stops. The comments Murf made as far as gearing up and throttling down is a valid point which still can be done to a degree with a hydro. Any loss of horsepower with a hydro is normally made up with the hydro on pto operation. ....

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Bob Josaitis
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2000-12-21          22710

OldForge, I have the same tough decision to make on my upcoming TC45/TC45D purchase. Personal preference should only be based on what the tractor is used for, otherwise personal preferences have a way of rearranging themselves. No doubt hydros are perfect for loader and mowing work and small speed adjustments. Search this board and others and you will find posts where hydros fall down, like poor fuel economy, overheating, and less available power in drawbar pulling applications like discing, plowing, etc. These threads are relatively few, but probably only because relatively few compact owners use their tractors for ag work. Also some posts on hydro squealing noises in cold conditions and having to monkey with tranny fluid changes to correct, no posts accordingly for gears. Consider this, on the TC45 the placement of the shuttle shift and gear selector is so well done it's as close as you can get to a hydro while still having gears. Also, gears are "the original cruise control". Having owned both in small tractors, I would prefer a hydro on my new TC. But since I'll be doing lots of discing, probably will go 12X12 gears unless someone with ag time on a compact can steer me otherwise. Good luck with your decision, you'll be happy with whatever you buy until your personal preference changes! ....

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Michigander
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2000-12-22          22725

Let me put my 2 cents worth in as my new TC40D was just delivered last week. First, to correct Tom, the Hydro on the TC40D is "dual power" meaning you have 4 four/reverse ranges. A shift on the fly button is on the loader joystick the jump from turtle to hare in each hydro range. Secondly, there are other differences between the two models besides the transmission. Mostly in aesthetics. ie: no wrap-around headlights, no deck mat, etc on the TC40. It makes the TC40 seem like the ecomony model. Nothing that effects pulling performance just creature comforts. Obviously I chose the D model and I love it so far. Plowed lots of Michigan snow! ....

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Roger L.
Join Date: Jun 1999
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2000-12-22          22729

It sounds like there is no clear "better" trnasmission....just lots of opinions. So here is mine penny's worth: Frankly, I like a gear shift transmission on my tractor. I don't drive it all day or even every day. If I do put in a couple of hours of back and forth loader work with it then I might not do that again for weeks...or longer. Of course if I did work it all day, everyday... or did lots of back and forth loader work...or mowed a large lawn twice a week then I would want the hydro and no doubts about it. But I don't do that.
My tractor is both a hobby and a tool. I am likely to fire it up for a few minutes to fetch something heavy or move some bags of feed 100 feet. On a lucky weekend I might get to move some snow around or maybe mow the local baseball field. A favorite chore is gathering big rocks from the far end of the property, carrying them in the loader bucket up to the house, and nudging them into a pleasing landscape. Occasionally I will work on half a mile of ourt dirt road or clean up one of the creek crossings. It is fun for me to work with the tractor, and a multitude of gears is part of that fun. None of these tasks are very pressing - or difficult - and using a hydro to do them would be like hiring someone else to go fishing for me..... I'm not in any big rush to get the tractor chores done....but then I don't fish as fast as I can either. I do like a fast syncro shuttle shift, and consider that to be about as far as I am willing to go in automating my hobby.
....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
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2000-12-23          22731

Mich: Sorry about the confusion. I commented about my 3x4 gear transmission in comparison to something like a 5x2 gear transmission. However, I think a HST transmission with only two ranges would provide better control of ground speed at a given engine RPM than my 3x4 gear tx. My point is that if I have to run PTO RPM, then selection of gears is the only thing that controls ground speed. I may very well find that a two reverse gear transmission goes too slow in low and too fast in high. I could be wrong, but I think that some gear transmissions for current model JD's provide two reverses, which could be limiting. However, such a limitation would affect virtually no application except 3ph snow blowers. I guess it's sort of an unusual position to find myself kind of talking up HST's. Actually, I'm with Roger. I depend on the tractor to do work that has to be done, but my tractor is a personal tool, and I sort of like my gears. ....

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Roger L.
Join Date: Jun 1999
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2000-12-23          22737

Thanks Tom. I guess I got a little windy (again!). In shortened form: I like the gears and enjoy the tractoring. And, I'm in no particular hurry to get my tractoring done quickly so I can get back to work! Not being a total barbarian, I do like the syncro shuttle transmissions better than the old non-syncro patterns with reverse out in left field. ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2000-12-24          22753

Yep, my 3 gears plus reverse are synchro while the 4 ranges aren't. I'm glad for the synchro gears, because I don't think I could figure out how to double-clutch with the hand throttle set at PTO speed. I am certain that I'm no piker in the wind department myself. The only difference between your wind and my wind is that your wind usually blows stuff around (I learn things). Mine often is just too many words. I should have watched more John Wayne movies I guess. Of course, my wife probably thinks I am a John Wayne movie--plenty of sound, but just not very many discernable words. ....

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Mark
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 188 Virginia
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2000-12-26          22856

I have one question on the HST. I was suprised at the noise level on a demo drive. The dealer said this was normal. I tested a Kubota, and it was VERY quite, although I didn't like the tractor as well. Any imput on the noise level? ....

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Roger L.
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2000-12-26          22857

Mark, interesting you should say that about the noise. I can't see why any hydro would make noise....although some of them do. I wonder if it varies with the tractor? The NH that I tested was fairly quiet. The only noise that it had was a sort of whine like an electric motor. Is that the noise you heard? The Massey was also quiet - perhaps even quieter. And I honestly don't remember what the Kubota sounded like. Nothing noise-wise stood out one way or the other.

....

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Mark
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Posts: 188 Virginia
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2000-12-27          22866

Roger, The HST noise was like an electric motor/pump. It was loud enough to be easily heard over the engine noise at all rpm's.
Mark ....

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Daren Blackstone
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2001-01-03          23057

Old Forge:
I am also looking at a TC45. I have raised the question on Hydro vs. Sycro and my dealer who has been a farmer all his life too, says the factory said it is virtually impossible to burn up a hydraulic motor on these machines because you can't pull the "guts" enough out of them to do any damage. I have currently a John Deere 955 hydro and love it. I wouldn't have anything else. I have pulled it pretty hard and doesn't seem to effect it. Just make sure your are in low range. In the "old days" a clutch pickup was better for pulling stock trailers, and a geared tractor was better for plowing, discing, etc. IH and their TA transmission (hydro) was not very good for pulling plows, etc. The TA's would literally burn up and you put in a new several thousand dollar transmission. Todays hydrostats are build a lot better and they will serve the purpose I think. We have a tree farm, so the TC45 should do the job well in all that it will be used for. HYDRO is my choice. ....

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Bob Josaitis
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2001-01-04          23090

Daren, I have searched wide and far to answer the same question, hydro (TC45D) vs. gear (TC45), and was disappointed but not surprised to hear in your post yet another remark from a dealer, "the factory says.....", or somebody thinks...the hydro can handle discing, plowing, stump pulling, ag work, etc. I'd just like to find somebody on this board (and so would you and others I'm sure) who has actually in real life down on the farm done this kind of work with their TC45D, but apparently they are awfully shy. I'm resigning myself to the fact that I may have to lease a TC45D myself this spring to do what apparently nobody else has done: find out if a hydro can pull a light 6-foot disc (1000 pounds), do some cultivating, pull a grain drill, chisel some ground, pull some stumps, and have enough PTO power left after hydro drain to spin a half-way decent (tractor wide) tiller. I'll try it and let you know how things go. If the hydro burns up or the tractor runs an hour on a tank of diesel, no loss, I'll change the lease over to a TC45 or outright buy the gears. It wouldn't be such an issue for me if I was the only one driving the tractor, would just get gears. But would like to accomodate the wife with hydro. Practical real life info on the way.... ....

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