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Rakes for Grapplers

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PaulPrince
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 35 California
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2004-03-20          80519

Another post from a new-to-tractors type; I have alot of pine tree slash from the bark beetle infestation and tree cutting. Does it make sense to buy a 'landscape rake' for cleanup (and future stuff), and weld two bushings to the loader arms,along with a hydrolic cylinder and mounts. In this way I would "easily" attach the rake to the loader and have an articulated rake-grapple device. Probably not strong enough for picking up heavy stuff (although with the many rake tines, it might do OK on logs), but seems like this would be handy for picking up piles of light weight slash, etc.

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itsgottobegreen
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 329 Mt. Airy, MD
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2004-03-20          80534

I see you have a BX23 and by the time you built something it would be to heavy for the tractor. You couldn't pick anything up. A rake is good for clean up. But pulling large logs isn't. The tines will just spring back.

Now what i plan on doing here shortly is built a set of brush forks for mine b7500. I plan on getting some 3/4" cold rolled solid steel (after the price of steel drops when the EPA allows a steel mill that rebuilt itself after burning down to reopen). Weld them about 4 or 6 inches apart onto two pieces of 3/8" by 2" flat bar. One which would be bolted towards the front of the bucket and the other toward the back. Each of the 3/4" tines would be 3 ft long. Half in the bucket and half out. So i would had 18" long tines with plenty of leverage. It would look like a graint rake. I would be able to slide right into mulch and brush piles with it. The just unbolt them when i am done with four bolts. It would only add 50 pounds to the weight. ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2004-03-21          80552

I wonder if the idea is to move the slash to nearby piles or further away? I think you might have trouble dragging slash through bush any distance with a rake and might want to load it onto a utility trailer.

Green's idea sounds pretty good for dragging it around and there may be similar commercial products. Loading slash onto a trailer would take a different style of forks. Either way, trying to attach a 3ph rake to the loader doesn't sound like it'd work. ....

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itsgottobegreen
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 329 Mt. Airy, MD
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2004-03-22          80751

My design is like a manure bucket. Its for going into the pile with a brush of little points instead of one big one (cutting edge of bucket). So you would be able to slide into the pile, lift, back up, lower and drive away. Then lift and dump. The brush will slide right off. When i get it built i post some pictures or i get around to making the CAD drawing. ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2004-03-22          80760

Green, I'm not sure how much brush you will pick up with forks that are only 18" long, especially if you do not have a grapple on top to trap the material.

Paul, the tines of a landscape rake are too close together to function as a grapple very well, you would need to pull out at least every other tine to leave enough space for the teeth to bite in to the load.

As for dealing with brush generally, something I have to deal with for business constantly, dragging it around is not very efficient. The best thing is to get it as compact as possible, as close to the source as possible. If you have to drag it more than from about 100' it's a waste of time. Generally speaking, taking a chipper to the brush is easier than the other way around. A small PTO chipper shooting the chips straight into a wagon with sides would be a nice clean way to deal with it. "Letting the chips fall where they may" is a great way to suppres weeds while building up topsoil in the long run.

Best of luck. ....

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TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2004-03-23          80801

Sounds like I didn't exactly get my head around Green's design and it still sounds interesting.

Slash is pretty unwieldy stuff and a grapple would be good for keeping it on forks if it has to be raised. I think It also takes a sizable job if it's in the middle of bush before a tractor becomes faster than a few people with gloves and pitch forks.

Around here the dumps are close and there's no tippage. We just cart slash to the dump and the Township burns it over winter. A loading trick for trailers and truck beds with slash is to put long straight stuff in first and trim a few branches if necessary. That way the whole load comes off just by pulling on the bottom pieces.
....

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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2004-03-23          80807

At one time I owned a JD model 725 loader on a 7810 JD farm tractor. I bought a brush grapple from Deere that was meant to fit a 500 series loader, It wasn't much of a problem to adapt it to the 725 and it did work really well for brush, old fence wire, etc. The only problem was it's hard to keep the grapple from pinching something too tight so I replaced quite a few teeth in the grapple. The frame it's self was plenty strong it never sprung or broke. After we got all the old fencerows cleaned up I traded the loader and grapple in on something at the Deere dealer. I guess for brush cleanup only I'd lean toward a chipper and just blow the chips out on the field then let nature take over. Frank. ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2004-03-23          80819

It is a fairly simple straight-forward thing to add a pressure-relief valve to a grapple so that it cannot close harder than needed.

Best of luck. ....

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kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2004-03-23          80825

Or get something like this. 1" tines you won't be breaking any time soon. ....


Link:   Bodozer grapple

 
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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2004-03-23          80836

If I remember correctly the tines were either inch and a quarter or inch and three eights by about 16 in. long, and your're right a pressure relief valve would have solved the problem. I did fail to mention that is was grappling rocks nearly as big as a wheelbarrow too. So that machine was tough, but the tines weren't quite as strong as the frame and maybe that was designed in to keep goofers like me from destroying it. Frank. ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2004-03-23          80840

Or maybe it's part of an evil plot designed to get men to buy bigger & bigger toys, errr, I mean TOOLS not toys, TOOLS....

Wait a minute, there's nothing evil about that.


Best of luck. ....

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PaulPrince
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 35 California
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2004-03-23          80904

Thanks all for your suggestions! I feel a bit foolish since I could probably spend 3 days with a pitch fork and finish it all. But in desiging this thing I've got alot of interested neighbors with alot of slash they need hauled away.
I've decided to build Green's device and add a 'twist'. I'm using 3/8 x 3/4 cold rolled bar (on edge) 36inches long(for 22 inch prongs outside of bucket) with two 3/8 x 2 straps to tie together and to go into the bucket. But for raking, I'm going to weld a 1-1/4 inch x 8 inch pipe at 60 degrees in the center toward the top of the assembly to act as a journal. Then to rake I'll put a 1 inch pipe 12 in long into the journal. The 1 inch 'axle' will expand up to a 1 1/4 and be welded into a trailer hitch type channel (2 inch square...).
When I hook this all up on the 3pt hitch (with a 'FlexPoint adapter', I expect to float vertically while also 'floating' in the twist direction (the 1 inch pipe with grease in the 1 1/4 pipe is a crude journal bearing at the right price). If this works I'll post some pictures. I haven't done much tractering yet (18 hours on the BX), but it seems the rake would benefit with the rotational float feature so it follows the ground contour regardless of what the tractor is doing. ....

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itsgottobegreen
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 329 Mt. Airy, MD
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2004-03-24          80929

I got to see this. Lets us know when you get it done. ....

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PaulPrince
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 35 California
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2004-03-27          81317

First stage of the 'rake' is done. We used 3/8 x 3/4 cold rolled steel bar, as mentioned earlier, 36 in long. We welded the back strap at the end of the bars and added two vertical tabs drilled into the sides of the bucket with half inch bolts. At the front of the bucket we put the strap overlapping the bucket front edge and welded five pieces of strap (the 3/8 x 2 inch hot-rolled bar) on the underside overlapping the bucket front edge. In this way the bucket front edge captures the 'rake' so the only mounting required are the two 1/2" bolts.

This works absolutely great. As a pickup device with loader flat, you can see the tips of the rake for reference, and as Green says, you just drive it into a pile of slash and it scoops it up great. You can give the bucket a quick tip up and through the slash ingto the bucket, then go for another bite!

I have managed to bend the tongs a couple times by hitting rocks. I would suggest maybe 1 inch X 1/2 inch tongs if you can afford the steel; especially for larger tractors. But my 'rake' is pretty heavy as it is.

To actually collect slash, branches, pine needles, etc. I turn the bucket vertical and drop the bucket into float, and drive backwards. This works great for raking, except for the need for freedom in the twist direction. That's the next revision to this, as described earlier. ....

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itsgottobegreen
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 329 Mt. Airy, MD
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2004-03-27          81356

send me some pictures man. Now i got to built mine. But don't have the time. ....

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PaulPrince
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 35 California
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2004-03-28          81417

OK Green, I posted some pictures: 1 shows the assembly. The tongs are 3/8 x 3/4 on edge x 36". This shows how we hold the rake using the front edge of the bucket so as not to have to use more than 2 bolts.
fig 2 closeup of the hook. fig 3 the flange inside bucket at back, both sides. fig 4 is using the rake as a rake driving backwards, fig 5 using it as a scoop.
Again, for a larger tractor you might want heavier tongs, but the weight will be hard to handle unless you store it hanging and can get under it to install.
Regards, Paul ....

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itsgottobegreen
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 329 Mt. Airy, MD
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2004-03-28          81428

The tabs on the front are a great idea. I am going to do that. I was planing to use 4 bolts to hold down the assblemy. But that is better. I am going to get to mine next month i got to many thing to put back together before the mowing season starts. I just got the 3 commerical mower out of storage. Boy do they need worK. From welding to engine work. AHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ....

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