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4110s and hill sides

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jmiller606
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 6 Owenton KY
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2005-04-07          109540

Question from a newbee. Just got a used (74 hrs)4110 with 54" belley mower. I have a farm with some 25% and more grades. The 4110 is narrow. Will front and rear weights, along with the belly mower, lower the point of gravity to any worthwhile degree?



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hardwood
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 3583 iowa
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2005-04-07          109542

I used to do kind of the same thing with a 4410 and rear mount mower and front weights. I think the tread width is a bit wider than yours, but after a couple pretty good scares when a downhill side wheel went in a wash I gave the sidehills back to nature. Be carefull. Frank. ....

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AnnBrush
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 463 Troy OH
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2005-04-07          109545

Are the tire center planes offset from the rim plane location (where the rim attached to the wheel hub)? If they are, you should set them at the widest position if not already so, this will lower the CG somewhat. ....

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jmiller606
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 6 Owenton KY
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2005-04-07          109552

This tractor is for my wife. She wanted to help mow some grass at the farm. The wheels are turned out. Unfortunately JD doesn't make axle extenders for this model. I should mention that this is my smaller tractor. The really difficult hills I can tackle with my 5310 with axle extenders. I am just concerned about my wife not being able "read" the topography and wondered if anyone had used rear and front weights on the 4110. The other option is to pump calcium into the tires for more weight. Thanks for the info and the help. Any further suggestions will be very welcome.
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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-04-07          109554

From what it sounds like, that would be a good way to get a new wife, but ruin a nice tractor on the way. (that was meant to be a joke) If you like your wife, which I assume you do, let her mow the flat stuff.

I regularly mow shallow ditch banks with up to 45 degree incline. I mow perpendicular to the bank, mow only when dry, use a small lawn tractor with 46" or 54" deck, and sit on the fender that is on high ground. If the tractor were to tip, I can hop off and balance the weight of an 800lb. or less tractor or just let-er go. When off of the seat, the mower deck cuts off. If you try this on a deep ditchbank while drinking beer like my neice's husband did, you find an 800 lb. lawntractor on your chest with the blades turning and the engine running. This is not good!! It did bad things to the hood,grille and hour meter.

Fortunately, he has been fixed and can no longer reproduce! ....

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jmiller606
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 6 Owenton KY
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2005-04-07          109555

Thanks for the info yooperpete. I will have to relegate her to the flatter land. In the outer bluegrass region of kentucky, there is not much of that. I will teach her to go up and down and not sideways. 4110s ought to be real easy operate that way. May go for the weights too.

The 5310 with axle extenders and wheels turned out hugs the hillsides like a big grasshopper. Can't beat it in this terrain. Tires are 8' apart.

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Billy
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 975 Southeast Oklahoma
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2005-04-07          109556

I was going to advise you to go up and down, not sideways, but Pete done told you. Good advice! ....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-04-07          109557

Yes, going up and down the hill is the way to go. However, sometimes you have to go on a diagonal. We've had discussions about after market tilt meters. Wheel weights will definitely help. If you can attach front and rear ballast and place it real low is also helpful to keep your center of gravity down under.

Not to be critical of women, but they generally can get themselves in trouble. Women fall into (2) categories: afraid to do everything and not afraid when they should be! Men (atleast some) have a pucker factor (as Murf describes) that puts the fear of God in them when things don't seem right. ....

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Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2005-04-07          109558

I've said it before, an' I'm gonna say it again.

The most dangerous part of a tractor is usually the 'loose nut behind the wheel'.

Operated correctly, and in accordance with good safety practises and common sense, these things are relatively safe and will go nearly anywhere.

However, (there's always one of those isn't there) one dumb manoeuvre, or a moment's inattention can be deadly.

Best of luck. ....

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funchy
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 128 north eastern corner of Maryland
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2005-04-07          109563

"Not to be critical of women, but they generally can get themselves in trouble. Women fall into (2) categories: afraid to do everything and not afraid when they should be!"

Yooberpete, you know as a female I can't let you get away with saying that without saying something.

The only reason women get into trouble is because they haven't had people show them ("women don't need to know that stuff") or because every guy around them says "you can't do it!!!" and the woman becomes a nervous wreck.

I operate my FEL and BH confidently, but every time I try to ask a guy for a tip, he dismisses me. So, I just had to teach myself. And yes, women can have a "pucker" sensor, too.

jmiller606, send your wife my way! I'll teach her to love the tractor so much she's driving it to the mall. ....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-04-08          109578

Funchy:
Figured I'd get somebody's attention on that one. Did good, didn't I.

On the serious side, men and women both can get in allot of trouble quick when operating large equipment. Farmers have the 2nd highest accident rate next to miners for deather and dismemberment. Most farmers grew up on the farm and know the risks but still get in trouble. It can happen in the blink of an eye.

About two weeks ago, a local woman died while eating a MacDonald's hamburger. She was a couple of miles from home and had just picked-it-up. While she was driving and eating she got off the right side of the road. When she attempted to correct for it, the vehicle flipped. She's history.

CUT's are powerful for their size, are tall, narrow and short. They are just as dangerous as an ATV or snowmobile. ....

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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2005-04-08          109579

My land is pretty steep and I have had a 4100 and now have a 4115.

After trying both, wheel weights seem more stable to me than fluid filled tires on side hills.

I think a square shouldered rear tire is better than one with a rounded profile for keeping things upright.

Ag tires are the worst for lateral stability on hills, but you may have to use them in some conditions to climb the hills so that you can mow on the way down.

Whatever you end up with, I would never take a tractor into such an environment without first walking and inspecting every inch of it for burrows, holes, rocks and other tractor tipping traps. ....

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jmiller606
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 6 Owenton KY
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2005-04-08          109591

Thank Y'all for the advice and your wisdom. My first post on this forum revealed a lot about the type of people on this site. You have all been very helpful, courteous and humorous. I think I will hang around this forum more often because the members are such decent and caring folks.

BTW the 4110 came with industrial tires so they provide the squared off edges that were recommended. I am going to print all the replies and hand them to the wife for her to read. This was a birthday present for her. Her name is Jean so I am going to have a sign guy make vinyl letters for the hood in JD yellow that says "Jean Dear". They will look good on her new toy.

Thank you all again for your help.

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jdcman
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 103 washington
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2005-04-08          109594

I live in the NW, where slopes can get kind of slippery.

My property, from a "workable with a tractor", point of view, is moderate to heavily sloped, (10 to 33 degs). I would never consider going normal to the slope at a 33 deg angle. It's just not safe. My technique is to back up the steep stuff. I still walk the property prior to working, boulders and holes just have a way of magically appearing, and it doesn't take much of an offset to change the center of gravity.

I have a 4400 with filled Ag tires. Tried the industrial grade tire and they were just too prone to slipping on this terrain. By filling the tires you not only gain ballast, but a lowering of the overall center of gravity, (increased mass below the axel,), and a reduction in the side roll of the tire.

I couldn't believe the performance change after I had the tires filled. Big jump in performance from the industrial tire to Ag's and a much bigger improvement in performance once I filled the tire

Trust your gut --- if it doesn't feel safe don't do it, you may not get a second chance.





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kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2005-04-08          109596

jdcman, you're exactly right about those R4 tires in NW clay soil. I'm in Oregon and rolled my 4310 once, which was enough (see pics). The rollover wasn't directly caused by the R4's plugging with mud, because the slope gave way, but the lack of traction did cause me to slide too close to the edge. As I read that I guess the R4's did cause the rollover. I immediately replaced them with R1's on the widest setting and it's made a world of difference. I was lucky, no damage to man or machine because the ROPS and seat belt worked, but everyone needs to keep safety in mind. Keep the ROPS up and your seat belt on. ....

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DRankin
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 5116 Northern Nevada
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2005-04-08          109597

Keep the tire sizes here in mind. On a 4110 you can put more weight "on the wheel" than you can "in the wheel".

The reverse is true once you get to the 43/4410 size rear wheels. ....

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jmiller606
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 6 Owenton KY
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2005-05-26          111561

Just thought I would give an update on the performance of the 4110 on my hillsides. It works great if you transverse the hills or approach them diagonally. It climbs better than I thought it would. Must do it all in low range. I have 5 weights in front and one set of wieghts in rear. The only problem I have had is due to the low hanging belly mower. It can't be raised up very high off the ground so on my rough terrain, it bottoms out quite often when it is raised to the highest position. In fact I already shattered the axle pin for one of the anti-scalping wheels. I love the industrial tread on this tractor. I can mow damp ground without tearing up the turf so it gives me more flexibility during damp weather. I really like this little guy. Haven't tried any implements yet but hope to in the future.

Thanks to everyone for all their advice. ....

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stone8
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 13 midwest
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2005-05-26          111581

Great discussion regarding hills and CG.

What effect does a loader have on CG? It seems like it would be to raise it.

I have a 4720 and I usually run around with the loader on. And it seemed very top heavy to me. I had a down hill wheel sink in and the uphill wheel popped up in the air and I popped off the tractor on the downhill side. I rolled around to look at the tractor, expecting it to be landing on me, and saw it sitting there with 3 wheels on the ground slowly continuing to tip over. I quick ran up the hill and stood up on the raised wheel and was able to recover the thing. Very lucky. I only had a banged up knee and pride.

I think I'm going to get the tires filled, pronto. And maybe using front weights is better than the loader? The wheels are out but not fully out.

I've got muddy hills. Springs everywhere. I didn't want to make it so heavy, but I've got to get the CG changed.

R1 tires. Bad idea not wearing the seat belt. But in my case I traded a smashed knee to prevent a roll over.


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kwschumm
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 5764 NW Oregon
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2005-05-26          111582

I'm glad you survived your near disaster. My recommendation is to follow the JD ballasting requirements in your manual to the letter. They have done the research and know what is required. On my 4310 the manual says to load the tires when you mount a loader. There must be a reason for that. ....

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yooperpete
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1413 Northern Michigan
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2005-05-27          111587

My belly mower raises and lowers from the 3 point hitch. On mine there are several adjustment holes on the bracket attached to the deck. You may be able to get a little more lift out of it. Likewise my 3 point has several positions that can adjust height. You may be able to get some extra stroke out of there also. Mine isn't a JD so I don't know exactly how it is built but assume it's similar.

You shouldn't be mowing when the grass is wet nor should you be negotiating hills when the dirt is wet either. Bad stuff happens!!!

Be Safe ....

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