Go Bottom3pt still doesn t work with loader attached
 | PJDrew
Join Date: Posts: 1 
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2000-10-08 20436
Greetings,I still can't figure outwhy 3 pt doesn't work with loader. Can in and out hoses be switched on loader and it still work properly? 3 pt goes up slowly only if no weight attached. 3pt works fine when loader unhooked and switch on hydraulic block flipped. I believe power beyond hose hooked to proper plug on joystick but can't be sure as its not marked. Any thoughts? Thanks PJ Drew
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 | Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York 
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2000-10-09 20448
There is so much left open here. What make tractor and loader? Where is this switch? Did it work before or is this new to you? The switch tells me that the system might be a either or system that one or the other will work. ....
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| PJDrew
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-10-09 20458
Sorry Art,
I had posted this problem under the Cub Cadet area before. Tractor is 7275 with a new Koyker 150 loader and a Waluoil(?) Joystick control. Cub has a hydraulic block on side of tractor to hook up loader to. 3 plugs, in, out and power beyond. When I picked up tractor only 2 hoses hooked up to in and out plugs. I talked to guy who installed loader and he didn't know about power beyond situation. (He's a tractor mechanic buts works on old tractors mostly). I got a manual with the loader but joystick not from Koyker I don't think. The problem is there is a bypass switch on block and when loader is attached this swith is flipped to allow oil through loader hoses otherwise it runs straight through to 3 pt. The idea I believe is that this power beyond hose runs up through joystick control and lets oil go back to 3pt when loader is hooked up.(Like a second out plug) I put on the 3rd hose and ran it up to logical plug on joystick control(out the side) but 3pt doesn;t work properly. The 3 pt works fine when loader is unhooked and bypass switch allows oil to run straight through. Any thoughts would be helpful. PJ Drew ....
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| David Paul
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-10-10 20473
I know exactly what the problem is. There is a restriction orfice that comes with the valve that must be installed for the power beyond to work properly. I am sure it came with the valve, many mechanics throw this piece away before they realize it is needed. Hopefully your man still has it. It comes in its own little plastic bag seperate from the valve. Contact me my email if you need more information. We are a Cadet dealer by the way and I have seen this problem many times before.
Affordable Equipment Inc.
600 Ross Ave.
Easley, SC 29640
864-859-2623
David Paul ....
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| TomG
Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 5406 Upper Ottawa Valley
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2000-10-10 20475
I'm not familiar with a switch on the block or power beyond. Actually, I'd appreciate a basic explanation of how power beyond hooks into a basic open centred system.
I can wonder about some things though. I wonder if the loader operates normally when it's connected. I wonder if the relief valve opens when the 3ph doesn't lift, and the loader is static. And, if there's any change in the 3ph lift if a loader control is operated.
Basic plumbing on an open centred system is to hook the 3ph and loader controls in series. My valves are ahead of the 3ph, so the valve output goes to the 3ph input, and the 3ph output goes back to the reservoir. So, I wonder where the loader input comes from and where the output goes--alternatively, where the 3ph input comes from. On my basic setup, the 3ph won't lift when any of the spooling valves are operated, because operating a valve closes the centre and cuts off input to the 3ph. I guess I can't wonder what, if anything, receives its input from the power beyond. I can't wonder since I don't know about power beyond, but maybe somebody will comment. I can't see any necessity of having a bypass switch in the system. A loader and 3ph should be able to operate normally on a single line in series. So, I guess that the switch is incidental to the problem.
A 3ph needs both a supply and a return to work, so one or the other isn't functioning. I think the key to unraveling the problem is to figure out how disconnecting the loader restores either the 3ph input or return. I'm guess that disconnecting the loader means just disconnecting the lines. Part of the key to understanding the problem may be knowing the conditions, if any, where the relief valve opens.
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| Art White
Join Date: Jan 2000 Posts: 6898 Waterville New York
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2000-10-10 20478
I think David Paul has brought up part of the problem. I still wonder of the need for the diversion valve. I would make the in and out hoses to connect together if the valve is removed with the loader like I think they have done. ....
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 | Murf
Join Date: Dec 1999 Posts: 7249 Toronto Area, Ontario, Canada
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2000-10-10 20480
The "3 hose" type of connection is common with Asain compacts, it is required in order for the system to maintain sufficient pressure & volume to the various parts of the system, i.e. loader & 3pth. The first line is hydraulic supply from the pump (ahaed of 3pth, by the way), second is a 'high-pressure return' line which supplies power to the rest of the system (including 3pth) the last hose is a traditional (low-pressure) return line to the reservoir. The hose you seem to be missing is the second one reffered to above, without you will not have any power to the 3pth or anything else in the system such as power steering if running off the same pump. This system is to the maximum power for the loader ahaed of anything else. Best of luck. ....
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| PJDrew
Join Date: Posts: 1
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2000-10-19 20704
Hats off to David,
I finally got plug for power beyond tonight and installed it and loader and 3 pt works!
PJ Drew ....
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